what is really accredited?

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by morleyl, Nov 1, 2003.

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  1. DaveHayden

    DaveHayden New Member

    I am not sure if you are being naive or dishonest. To answer your question WAUC charges a fee and any and all degree mills that apply are magically accredited. That is fraudulent as are Degree mills like SRU, KW, etc. It is not "balanced" to call fraudulent activities "low standard", it is dishonest. So is the bank robber less accurate or simply criminal?
     
  2. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    So what you are saying is that WAUC accepts money and does not actually carry out an assessment process? do you know this as a fact?

    I do not really want to argue these points to death. My position is about quality education and a quality way to convert experience and other learning into credit.
     
  3. c.novick

    c.novick New Member

    W.H.Taft University Vs. WAUC

    So what you are saying is that WAUC accepts money and does not actually carry out an assessment process? do you know this as a fact?


    .............................................


    As a matter of fact, WAUC is not recognzed by the U.S. Department of Education. If that isn't enough...

    In 5/00

    They were sued by William H. Taft University of CA. as they gave them accreditation without even a visit. They renewed their accreditation automatically without Taft even applying to renew.

    They are for profit.

    They could not provide any evidence that they had in fact ever conducted a site visit at any university they allegedly accredit.

    Isn't that enough?

    :rolleyes:
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 25, 2003
  4. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    Well, I suppose it would be difficult to please anyone on here with any accreditation thats not approved by US DOE. This is despite the fact that the US system allows for people for private accreditation without DOE approval. I understand the need to be skeptic but sometimes it seems to be more like paranoia in some cases.

    I found the situation with St. Regis interesting, first they said they are not accredited by Liberian Government. and even if they are accredited by the Liberian government, the government their is corrupted anyway. No are we going question all third universities to say they are substandard etc?
     
  5. galanga

    galanga New Member

    where, please?

    morleyl:

    St. Regis... first they said they are not accredited by Liberian Government...

    Could you please post a link to the statement from SRU that they are NOT accredited by the Liberian Government, referred to in your recent post?

    thanks

    G
     
  6. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member



    You opened the door. Thanks for having me in. Now that you've mentioned your own education as an example supporting your statements, please tell us:

    Who you are and
    Your degree(s) and its(their) source(s).

    I'm sure you'll be willing to do that now that you've used yourself as a credible example.

    If you do not, I would suggest to others to draw the same conclusion I've drawn in an earlier post.
    Which agency is this? DETC has as one of its accrediting standards that applicant schools must not engage in deceptive marketing. They've ignored this on several occasions now by accrediting schools claiming unrecognized accreditation--schools that did so right up to the day they were accredited by DETC. Your example has no basis in fact.
     
  7. AWN

    AWN New Member

    I don't think that they have endorsements from the RA schools mentioned on their site. They've set it up so as to fool the casual reader or the inexperienced students into thinking that all these RA schools support them.
     
  8. Jeff Hampton

    Jeff Hampton New Member

    I posted the link to the quote the first time, but here it is again:

    http://www.online-college.info/article872.html

    And then, of course, there's your statement:

    http://forums.degreeinfo.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10133&highlight=regis
     
  9. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    Who am I, I work as a Lead R&D engineer with a very large Telecommunications equipment company, I am presently pursuing a MSc in Computer Engineering with De Montfort University in the Uk and my education from Jamaica was certified by the University of Houston as Equivalent to their CIS degree even though my degree was Electronics and Computing.

    I am not sure this will help because I honest think the focus on here is wrong. The people who setup these unrecognized schools or whatever you call them has PhDs from very good schools too.

    In respect to St. Regis, When I said they, I meant someone on here saying that. I do not remember the exact post and do not have time to search for that.

    If you are so upset about deceptive and fraud, you should watch more ads on TV, Comcast will make you believe that Directv is a waste and vice versa. The core of my position or argument is that you all need to be honest about this education business and not act only in self interest.


    I do agree over the last few months that there are bad people out there but somehow I think there is some dishonesty in how its been discussed here.
     
  10. Jeff Hampton

    Jeff Hampton New Member

    Uhh...thanks for clearing that up. Makes perfect sense now. I can't imagine why we couldn't understand that from the beginning.

    So what did you mean by this:

    What is a third university, and why do you believe that people here are questioning them?

    That's a great point. If Comcast broadcasts deceptive commercials, then it is OK for people to operate degree mills. Don't know why that didn't occur to me before.

    Please cite an example or two of people here who are acting in their own self interest (other than the mill shills, of course.)


    I have no idea what you mean by "over the last few months that there are bad people out there..." but please explain where you are seeing the dishonesty in the discussions here.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 25, 2003
  11. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    I think you are dishonest about St. Regis and Ansted Unversity. The reason, you have not provided any real facts why they are called Diploma Mills. The fact that a school is registered in BVI does not make it a mill automatically.

    Its one thing to call a school unrecognized than to call them fraudulent.

    My pointy is that people should not focus on discounting others but focus on developing more positive options for distance based education.
     
  12. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Active Member

    Back to your very strange position that people here are in the business of starting up new schools. It's true that a few here have participated in that activity but it is is rare. We are a community made up of people concerned with education more from the consumer perspective. Contrary to your statements, degree mills are a major problem for consumers in this business and they need to be warned about it. Why do you keep saying that we are somehow responsible for developing options?
     
  13. galanga

    galanga New Member

    beans beans the musical fruit

    morleyl: you said

    I think you are dishonest about St. Regis and Ansted Unversity. The reason, you have not provided any real facts why they are called Diploma Mills.

    You might consider reading the information that has been posted about Saint Regis, in particular how its Branford Academy sells AA degrees. That's well documented, it's factual, and those who have in mind a widely held definition of "diploma mill" (for example, those found in various dictionaries and offered up for your consideration previously) are likely to find that their evaluation of SRU's diplomamill-ness shows a good fit.

    I think you are not being straight with us. Perhaps you have an agenda that you are not revealing?

    G
     
  14. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    My point again , is that we can move from been too confrontational, to be more solution oriented. The consumer is looking for a solution not necessarily focus on who took what exam and this get diploma.

    If something is legal then it cannot be fraudulent, it would be considered uncrecognized or something else.
     
  15. galanga

    galanga New Member

    beans, some more

    Morleyl, you said:

    If something is legal then it cannot be fraudulent, it would be considered uncrecognized or something else.

    My understanding is that it is not illegal for the people supporting Saint Regis who had created a web site claiming to be the the Liberian embassy's site to have done so. The reason for this (as I understand it) is that it is NOT illegal for US citizens to pretend to be an official agency of a foreign country. It is, however, illegal for them to claim to be a US government agency. So if the web staff had built a fake American Embassy site instead of a fake Liberian Embassy site they would have broken the law. But they didn't-- they built a fake Liberian Embassy site, probably avoiding technical violation of US code.

    This is, however, fraudulent conduct.

    Do you now agree that objective information demonstrating that Saint Regis University deserves the classification "diploma mill" has been prsented on this forum, or do you think that the pigeon business does NOT merit classification of Saint Regis University as a diploma mill?

    My guess is that you will not answer this question.

    G
     
  16. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    well, I have to at least make a point again. I am sure if any person could make up evidence against someone that they do not like then a lot of people could get arrested and end up in jail. So thats why the burden of proof is always on the accuser.

    I really had no intention to debate about who made what web site and what you or do not know. To me thats going off track and not been productive.

    Its obvious that you have something against St. Regis, so even if they changed today and were doing well you would not care anyway. Are you saying that they are not accredited by the liberiam ministry of education?

    For the few persons that gave positive feedback it seem there are many creative ways to earn college credit out there. The issues I think from the detractors is they do not like any new players on the block.
     
  17. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    How many posts back was it "the most [he] could say"?
    How troll, oops I mean droll.
     
  18. Jeff Hampton

    Jeff Hampton New Member

    In the waning days of his rule, Saddam Hussein reportedly offered bounties to any Iraqi who killed an American soldier. Let's say that in addition to the monetary award, Saddam also offered a Ph.D. for killing a Yankee. He certainly had the power to do that. It would be legal, according to Iraqi law at the time. So those Ph.D.'s would not be fraudulent, right?

    Well, Charles Taylor's administration (which supposedly "accredited" St. Regis) was just as bad as Saddam's.
     
  19. Jeff Hampton

    Jeff Hampton New Member

    That is just ridiculous. I'm sure that those who you characterize as "detractors" would welcome any legitimate "new players."

    For example, Western Governors' University developed an unprecedented approach to awarding degrees. Yet I don't believe that anyone here ever stated that this school was not legitimate.

    However, many people here have a problem with a "university" where most pigeons could qualify for a degree.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 26, 2003
  20. galanga

    galanga New Member

    morleyl... you said

    well, I have to at least make a point again. I am sure if any person could make up evidence against someone that they do not like then a lot of people could get arrested and end up in jail. So thats why the burden of proof is always on the accuser.

    Ah, so you are suggesting that I am lying and at risk of neing thrown in jail. Not so. But since you think I am, view it as a hypothetical question: "If SRU really did that stuff that I described in my post, would that make them satisfy the commonly held criteria (as defined in dictionaries, and posted to this thread) which would classify them as a diploma mill?" Answer that, please.

    Its obvious that you have something against St. Regis, so even if they changed today and were doing well you would not care anyway.

    Based on their recent behavior (the false claim of UNESCO/IAU recognition, for example) I would need to see some independently verifiable indications of their policy revisions to believe it so.

    Are you saying that they are not accredited by the liberiam ministry of education?

    The Liberian Embassy in Washington DC informs us that SRU is lying when it claims that the Embassy will verify the Liberian recognition of SRU. I am only reporting the facts.

    Are you faculty/staff of Saint Regis University?

    G
     

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