No dissertation for Northcentral University International Dept DBA?

If I was a NCU student, I won't just be a little concerned; I'd be screaming...!!!!!!!!

 

This program is given in a different format than the US one. There is classroom time required and a specific timeframe involved:

It only mentions the MBA. Perhaps the DBA is being developed by HIT ?

 

Possibly, but then again there are red flags all over this one for sure. I sent a message to the person I have been working with there to ask about some clarification with this. I likely won't get a quick response because so many current students are probably writing/calling that they have to come up with a PR answer on it.

Let's say that HUT does do the doctorates. If that is the case then HUT is still in cahoots with mills. This links back to NCU still, in my opinion. Why would anyone want to deal with red flag potentials at all when Touro basically has the same type of program going for about the same costs?

Speaking of costs, a student would be best off applying to the MBA through HUT here becuase it's 10K cheaper. I'd be complaining on that one if I were an MBA student.

 

"Grammar" Those in glass houses....

Otherwise, I agree with you. This sweetheart deal is disappointing for anyone enrolled in (or considering) NCU's MBA and/or DBA.

I've queried NCU regarding this matter. I'll report what I'm told, if anything.

 

There are some doctorates, known as professional doctorates, which require 90 semester hours or 135 quarter hours of coursework with no dissertation. The problem with the term "professional doctorate" is that some, like the JD and the MD, are non-dissertation doctorates, while others, like the DBA, the DM, the DMin, and some would say the EdD, have coursework plus an applied dissertation. Thus, conceptually, one could have a non-dissertation professional doctorate in business, but since both the DBA (Doctor of Business Administration) and the DM (Doctor of Management) are nomenclatures for the professional doctorate in business with an applied dissertation, what would one call the non-dissertation professional doctorate in business?

 

I would call it a professional certificate.

Bing

 

Rich,

An additional search reveals the following information, which may help to explain some of your findings:

NCU’s address:

Northcentral University
505 W. Whipple St., Prescott, AZ 86301-1747
For more information, call 866-776-0331.
From outside the U.S. and Canada, call 928-541-7777.
FAX 928-541-7817
http://www.ncu.edu/

SCUPS address:

Southern California University for Professional Studies Admissions Office
1840 East 17th Street, Suite 240
Santa Ana, CA 92705
Local Phone Number: 714/480-0800
Toll Free Number: 800/477-2254
FAX Number: 714/480-0834
http://www.scups.edu/

In the same building…

Newbridge College
1840 E 17th St Ste 140
Santa Ana, CA 93705
714/ 550-8000
http://www.newbridgecollege.edu/

And then 50 feet away you have…

American Education Foundation
1850 East 17th Street, Suite 215
Santa Ana, CA 92705
Tel: (714) 542-8374
Fax: (714) 542-8476
Email: [email protected]
http://www.american-edu.org/

The latter of which website (http://www.american-edu.org/programs.htm) states, “The American Education Foundation works with a number of American universities and colleges to provide quality education programs to determined learners throughout the world, including:

*Southern California University for Professional Studies (SCUPS) (note mention of the MBA and DBA degrees)

*Northcentral University (NCU)

*Newbridge College

A quick look at professors/affiliations reveals common associations among the AEF, SCUPS NCU, and the HUT/NCU program:

NCUI (NCU/HUT) faculty includes:

Prof. Robert Dalton is a faculty of George Washington University, President of D&D Association in Washington D.C.

Dr. Joseph Daly, Attorney at Law, Professor of Law at Hamline Law School, Minnesota and Arbitrator of the International Commerce Court.

Dr. Paul T. McGurr is a Professor of Finance and Accounting at Ashland Business School in Ohio.

(Source: http://www.hut.edu.vn/cictt/ncu/ )

Who also serve as SCUPS international faculty:

Prof. Robert Dalton, Lecturer at Maryland University, President of D & D Associates in Washington D.C.:

Prof. Dalton has consulted to US corporations and businesses to do business in the Asian market. His teaching experience include Vietnam and China, and is currently the President of the American Education Foundation.

Prof. Paul. McGurr is a Professor of Finance and Accounting at Ashland Business School in Ohio. Prof. McGurr also a certified public accountant.
Dr. Joe Daly Attorney of Law, is Professor of Law at Hamline Law School, Minnesota, and Arbitrator of the International Commerce Court. Dr. Daly has written numerous articles and books on various legal issues. His knowledge in the law and generosity for teaching has brought him to the four corners of the Earth, to countries like Australia, Vietnam, Austria, and China.

(Source: http://www.scupsint.com/professors.htm )

And we can see that Robert Dalton is the current President of the American Education Foundation.

Perhaps the apples do not fall far from the tree. Unfortunately, this gives an impression that NCU’s recent RA status is being shared/leveraged among a pool of entities/activities – some old, some new; some accredited, some not. Not very comforting to see.

 

why?
there a so many master's degrees without thesis,
why shouldn't it be possible to invent also a doctorate without one?
(just wondering)
m.

 

My rant…. I would call it an unfinished doctorate, like an ABD or certificate in graduate studies. Both of which are common to students that have not finished their dissertations.

A DBA may be considered a more practitioner-type of degree. However, as with a true doctorate, one should still demonstrate full research capabilities and provide a significant contribution and or extension of new knowledge. This is what separates a real DBA from an MBA.

I would hate to see the substance, recognition and tradition of a doctorate be diminished by non-dissertation programs.

Tom

 

An airplane without an engine is a glider.

A flute with no holes is not a flute.

A donut with no hole is a danish.

A doctorate with no dissertation isn't a doctorate. (I know, I know, first professional "doctorates" are awarded without requiring a dissertation, but I've always contended that the degrees are not doctorates and shouldn't be called doctorates, even if the degree holder admitted to the profession is called "doctor.")

An academic doctorate is designed to demonstrate one's ability to master one's field, discern challenges to it, and design research to meet those challenges. Coursework doesn't accomplish this. Whether the dissertation creates new knowledge or solves an existing problem, it is the dissertation that makes the doctorate.

Awarding a DBA without requiring a dissertation is wrong. The candidate has not demonstrated the requisite skills and accomplishments to be awarded the title "doctor."

(By the way, my first professional doctorate distinction shouldn't go unnoticed. Physicians, optometrists, dentists chiropractics, and the like normally don't use the title "doctor" unless they're licensed practitioners, or have been. IMHO, it is their position in their respective professions, not their academic qualifications, that merit the title "doctor." This is how the British system works, where bachelor's qualified surgeons and physicians are titled "doctor." The term "doctor" applies to those admitted to certain professions OR those having completed an advanced course of study resulting in the title. The title "doctor" is just as much mine as it is a physician's; mine for the Ph.D., the physician's for being a member of his/her esteemed profession.)

 

I am in general agreement on your usage of "doctor".

My observation is that in my industry there are a number of MD's that don't practice medicine anymore, and don't even have a current license, that are still referred to as "doctor". One of the managers here is an MD. He finished his second year in residency and then went to business school to get an MBA. He is still referred to as doctor by universities, other physicians, many people at work, etc. He just calls himself Steve, though.

Bing

 

JamesK: "Actually, the MD is not started right out of school. Instead, someone studying medicine will earn a Bachelor of Medicine and a Bachelor of Surgury (MBBS or MB ChB). The MD is often considered to be a higher doctorate (above the PhD)."


Cehi: In Nigeria, the students can enter medical school right from high school to begin studying for the MB BS (Bachelor of Medicine, Bachelor of Surgery) degree. The students that comes from high school will spend four years for the program plus the internships, clerkships, etc. It must be stated that these high school students (few, ofcourse) must have excellent, I mean, excellent result from the West African School Certificate Examination (WASCE), usually, with an aggregate of six by achieving 1 point each in Biology, Chemistry, Physiscs, English, Mathematics and Additional Mathematics. The lower the aggregate the better the student grade. Aggregate six enable a student to be awarded a grade 1 distinction, which is a superior grade. Hey, very few students achieve this outcome nationally.

The WASCE is the required examination that all graduating high school students in Nigeria and other west african countries must take and pass to officially graduate from high school. You don't pass it, you cannot officially graduate and go to the university. My many apologies if I am a bit off-point. Thank you.

 

" Donuts with no holes". Ah yes. I remember those days when I shared a donut ( bought at a store in shinsaibashi ) in osaka with a voluptuous japanese women, in the comforts of her home.

Concerning NCU, I e-mailed the higher learning commission in regards to ncuinternational and the no dissertation requirement.


Ray

 

Hi there the information you have is inaccurate. Please refrain from making these types of statements unless you have more than a web link and a web page.

Thanks

 

A few Ed.D. programs allow for an "applied" dissertation (usually an instructional development or large-scale staff development project); however the vast majority require research doctorates identical to the Ph.D. I am not sure how most D.B.A. programs are structured, since business is not my discipline.

The U.S. Department of Education distinguishes between what it calls "First Professional Doctoral Degrees" (such as the J.D., M.D., D.C., D.P.M., D.S.S., D.M.D., O.D., Pharm.D., D.V.M., D.O. and M.Div.) and "Research Doctorates" (which include the Ph.D., Ed.D., D.B.A. and a few dozen other titles). The Doctor of Management degree is not included in either the list of First Professional Degrees or Research Doctorates. The only reference to D.M. is Doctor of Music.

Since the D.B.A. is considered to be a research doctorate, it would be contrary to its current classification to exclude the major research actvity (dissertation).

 

Hi Tony, please refrain from continuintg inaccurate discussions and unfounded hyperbole about NCU.

 

Are you the NCU police? Do you work or are affiliated with Northcentral University? Prove that they are inaccurate by including reliable and valid research. I am a student at NCU and I am concerned about my alma mater. Who are you to tell me and other members "to refrain from continuing inaccurate discussions and unfounded hyperbole about NCU" without including research, or accurate evidence that may prove otherwise.

If the Higher Learning Commission gives an ok to NCU offering DBAs with to dissertation required, then all power to them.

Here is the webpage and reference to ncuinternational.

http://www.ncuinternational.com/misc.htm

"A DBA is only a continuation of the MBA: DBA students will not need to write a dissertation" (http://www.ncuinternational.com/misc.htm).

By the way, have you ever had donuts with a beautiful japanese women?


Ray

 

To whom are you addressing this comment, and to what do you refer?

I know I've only made statements of fact and observation regarding the NCU/HUT connection, leaving open the possibility that the truth is different from the available impression.

If you have some information to share about this topic, please do. (After all, you state that the information is inaccurate--surely this is based on something.) Otherwise, asking others to shut up doesn't help.

 

Sorry, but the only thing that has been demonstrated as inaccurate is your use of the keyboard.

Tony has not engaged in "hyperbole." His is as dispassionate a post as you'll find, and entirely consistent with the nature of his posts overall.

If someone is posting something that is not true, point that out. Otherwise, please stop telling others not to post. Posting is the most central and natural function of this board!

 

KHarman works for Northcentral University ( I checked the staff listings at NCU )

I have a few questions for KHarman or a representative from NCU.

Disclamer: Please do not pm or e-mail me privately. What you write to me will be posted in this discussion board. Thank you.

-- Is ncuinternational.com a website operated by or affiliated with NorthCentral University?

-- Can you confirm this reference from ncuinternational.com?

"A DBA is only a continuation of the MBA: DBA students will not need to write a dissertation" (http://www.ncuinternational.com/misc.htm).

-- Are these websites below about the partnership between Northcentral University and Hanoi University of Technology?

http://www.ncu.edu/hut/

http://www.hut.edu.vn/cictt/ncu/

http://www.ncuinternational.com/hut.htm

-- www.ncuinternational.com is registered to:

Huy Doan
505 W. Whipple Street
Prescott, AZ 86301

The address of NorthCentral University is:

Northcentral University
505 W. Whipple St., Prescott
AZ 86301-1747

How are these to addresses related? Are they related?
Is ncuinternational.com a seperate subsidary or managed
within the departments and organizational structure at
Northcentral University.


KHarman, as a student and customer of your university, why did you not respond to me privately and identify yourself through e-mail?. I would have responded more appropriately.


Ray