DETC and RA

There are certainly many examples of people using DETC degrees to get in to RA graduate programs and to advance their careers. DETC degrees definately have value.

In general their utility is much lower than RA degrees. In that sense they have lower value.

I am unaware of any DETC program that is not duplicated in an RA program at roughly the same cost and amount of work. Do you know of any?

The point in all of this discussion is not to put down anyone, but to provide accurate information about the usefulness of degree programs. If a person is choosing a degree program, it is imperative that they not think all "accredited" programs are equal, but instead understand the important differences.

 

Good Morning Dave ... ( From here on the East Coast )

Good point about U of P , I never thought of it that way.

You have a good point. I agree, it is the changing times and fast paced life styles that have caused the increase demands for distance education more than DETC universities. However they still compete for the distance education market. The competition between the two accreditors is good and will only grow with the distance market demands.

Regards,

Mike

 

And good morning from the west coast! Although next month my daughter and myself will be visiting my brother in the nation's capital.

 

But unless DL programs stop granting conventional degrees and start issuing DM's (Distance Masters) instead of MA's and MS's, they will continue to exist in the wider world of graduate programs. DL programs can't be segregated out and compared only with one another.

Until DETC accredits some excellent universities, it won't accredited any excellent universities.

That suggests that the DETC lineup (at least currently) isn't as good, when judged by whatever it is that makes universities excellent.

(Perhaps if somebody were ambitious, they could try to make a case for a few schools like AMU being excellent in a few specialized subject areas. Conceivably the DETC schools may already be approaching excellence here and there.)

I haven't really studied them, but initially I'd be inclined to favor American Military University in that comparison. AMU attempts unusual things. On paper its class titles seem focused and hard to duplicate. UoPx does things that are very common elsewhere, and seems to treat its product as a commodity.

I know nothing about Cardean, so I don't know how it compares with TESC. But TESC does seem to occupy the low end of the RA-accredited scale. In fact, it kind of defines that low end by design. In general it doesn't really provide instruction, it doesn't really have an intellectual life of its own. It lives off assessing what people do elsewhere, and granting credit for it so long as it meets an expected standard. That's certainly a legitimate and extremely valuable function, but from an educational and a scholarly viewpoint it's undeniably minimalist.

 

Uh Oh, Wheres Janko?

I agree with this, but TESC is RA and that is all that some care about. I just cannot see how the big three are in the same category as other RA even though I am considering transfering my credits there to either bank, or get an RA degree.

 

There are 1574 ( 4 year RA ) colleges & universities in America.
779- ( 2 year RA ) community, or branch colleges
source- www.utexas.edu/world/unv/state

There are more than 3000 colleges & universities in America.
Source- DETC web site

A sizeable number of colleges and universities are non-RA.

 

Yes. IF we are including Harley's College of Truck Driving and Maybelle's Beauty University. If we are talking college credit granting schools, no.

 

On March 5, 2003, Congressman Howard P. “Buck” McKeon (R-CA) proposed changes to the HEA. Below is a snippity from his proposal.
“Sanctions would be triggered, including the withdrawal of eligibility for federal financial assistance, ….The bill would also prohibit the denial of transfers of credit based on the accreditation of the institution from which a student transfers. ~ Mike Lambert of DETC has met with Mr. McKeon’s staff and Assistant Secretary of Postsecondary Education Sally Stroup to discuss recommendations for the reauthorization of the Higher Education Act. DETC’s recommendations were well received.”
If this goes through, the discrimination faced by DETC students will finally end, and violators will likely be punished.

That sucks for you, Mr. Davie Hayden … If academia is forced to equally recognize
DETC credentials, you won’t have anyone left to make fun of

And, Degreeinfo will have no reason to exclude DETC and ACICS schools from their “database”. Likewise, websites that make the already improper statement “Regional Accreditation = Gold Standard”, will need to amend.

More importantly, low-ranked or unranked “test-out” schools such as TESC will be forced to recognize DETC “course work”. Maybe then, TESC will update their inaccurate website. Take a look at their “ways to earn credit” page. The National Home Study Council?? Wasn’t that changed to DETC about a decade ago?

Your Baby Daddy,

BS (Top-tier RA),
MBA (DETC),
JD Student (ABA)

GO CHEYNEY U!!!!!!!

 

???

 

The 2000 Carnegie classification added up all of the schools in the United States with USDoEd/CHEA recognized accreditation.

Total 3,941
_
Doctoral/Research Universities 261 6.6%

Master's Colleges and Universities 611 15.5%

Baccalaureate Colleges 606 15.4%

Associate's Colleges 1,669 42.3%

Specialized Institutions 766 19.4%

Of which:
_ _
Theological seminaries and other specialized faith-related institutions 312 7.9%

Medical schools and medical centers 54 1.4%

Other separate health profession schools 97 2.5%

Schools of engineering and technology 66 1.7%

Schools of business and management 49 1.2%

Schools of art, music, and design 87 2.2%

Schools of law 25 0.6%

Teachers colleges 6 0.2%

Other specialized institutions 70 1.8%

Tribal Colleges and Universities 28

Source:

http://www.carnegiefoundation.org/Classification/CIHE2000/Tables.htm

You can find them all listed in their respective categories here:

http://www.carnegiefoundation.org/Classification/CIHE2000/PartIfiles/partI.htm

DETC seems to have 43 degree granting schools

3 (Leicester, UNISA and WGU) have other accreditation

3 offer doctorates as their highest degree (Concord J.D., St. Augustine D.P.T. and Taft J.D.)

24 top out at masters degrees

5 max at bachelors

9 only do associates

Source:

http://www.detc.org/content/degree.html

 

I do not think it is fair to say that Dave Hayden has made fun of anyone. He has made his case in a clear and precise fashion.
Dave is a senior member here and has a tremendous amount of knowledge.

While we may not agree on RA/DETC, Dave has my respect. I have learned quite a bit from him and others here. I value his opinion and knowledge. I think it is unfair to make any argument personal.

Mike

 

There are 272 non-RA colleges and universities in California alone.

A 2001 study showed that 2/3 of the graduates of DETC schools applying to traditional colleges were accepted. Rich Douglas described his poll as showng little difference in the perception of the general public between state approved & accredited. Certainly DETC accredited schools would have a very strong positive perception among the general public. In the private business community DETC degree acceptance should be very good. I see no major problems with degree acceptance.

 

That is because you are correct. There are few problems in the private business sector with acceptance of an accredited university degree... And that's what it is. DETC is a recognized accredited degree.

 

Additionally, the DETC universities provide an education. Some are better than others just like some RAs are better than others.

If my university is indicative of the majority of the DETC accredited universities, there is no difference compared to some of the distance RA universities. I can say again they are an improvement over TESC ( prior student). I was disappointed with TESC's course material and set up. I am extremely happy now that I transferred to another college.

 

One of the reasons for the numerical disparity between RA and DETC is that RA schools have been around since dirt and DETC has evolved relatively recently to include academics as a major component. I think the situation is confusing. RA schools can be distance only, traditional campus, or a combination of the two, but DETC is only distance. Based on this, I think there will always be a huge disparity in the numbers. I think that RA schools should also be DETC accredited if they are going to offer a strictly on-line or distance pedagogy for any of their programs. This would provide a measure that ensures the RA schools are rolling out and maintaining effective standards for that form of instruction (which should not automatically be assumed).

 

Why not let the real experts in distance Learning ( DETC ) run DL programs. They are a true national accreditor and not just restricted to small areas like the RA's are. That way RA schools can stop jumping around looking for the easiest place to get accreditation. The DETC can suppy uniform standards all across the country. Moving from one RA area to another to get easier accreditation is very poor for standards.

 

True; HOWEVER,

Bill has IMPLIED this, not inferred it. It was you (the reader) that INFERRED that Bill was suggesting the educational quality of DETC.

I got this from Dictionary.com:

I wouldn't of used the word infer in any sentence because I, myself, was very foggy on the difference between the two words. So, I found it very interesting and looked it up.

Best Regards,
Bill

 

The schools are in a spectrum or a continum of respectablity. The greater the respect a certain school has the more utility that the degrees will have. One would be doing themselves a disservice to settle for a degree that wasn't the best that they could get. Some companies do their hiring only from the top tier schools. I know that there are many companies in California that only hire from the University of California system and won't hire graduates from the California State University system. The new graduates cost a little bit more to hire but the companies are willing to pay more. So a lower tier degree while "acceptable" may not be good enough to get that job that you might have wanted and when you do land that job, it might not have as large of a starting pay as a higher tier school.

 

You are absolutely correct Bill. People need to use the best school they can afford. If you can get in Harvard or Yale, go for it. That wasn't my option. I had to choose from the lower to mid level schools. When I looked I found that the DETC offered a nationally accredited degree at an affordable price. I jumped at the chance, because of the quality of the school and the way they allowed me to pay for the program. I wanted a degree plan that would send me books, require me to study hard, provide credibility, and they also included proctored exams, which I could do without I want to know that I'm working with a school that knows DL, and with an accreditor that knows what DL is all about. If you've got the money and can get into M.I.T. that's the thing to do. In the real world of adults out of school for years, you need to deal with real experts on DL, DETC.

 

Going back to school to a brick and mortar university is not an option for many adult students. That is why Distance Education has hit the ground running for both RA and DETC universities.

DETC universities have grown in popularity and have become a real option for many adult students. With convenience, competitive prices and challenging study programs they are an excellent choice if an RA university is not in the cards.