DETC and RA

Gus:

Have you ever thought about an exciting career as an attorney?

 

Yes for 77 years DETC's main focus and reason for being has been vocational programs. They began accrediting vocational schools in the 50's and expanded to college credit programs in the 70's Apparently, as of 1980 they accredited a total of 2 college type programs. As of today they accredit 24 programs that offer bachelors and Masters degrees. Both Aspen University and AMU are quality DETC accredited programs. AMU is seeking to move to RA. When students with DETC accredited degrees want to continue on to other programs at least 1/3 are unable to do so. Clearly some people have been able to use DETC accredited degrees for educational and career advancement. Are DETC accredited degrees the best or most appropriate ones for a majority of people? Clearly no.

 

Hi Everyone: I received some private emails indicating that some interpretted my comments about DETC as my being negative and in some way doing harm to the gains that DETC has made, at least in the eyes of some the posters here. I certainly don't see anything I wrote as indicating that, but decided to avoid confusion and go on record if you will: I am a huge fan of DETC - I have been president of a DETC school for many years. I believe in the value of DETC accreditation. I am well versed in Regional Accreditation also. I work hard to support the DETC, work on committees, and have been honored with recognition twice. I am very proud of what my school and our graduates have accomplished. I am not, however, stupid or naive. I would have to be both to ignore the reality that my students have a harder time transferring to RA doctoral programs simply because they have graduated from my DETC accredited school. Rather than ignore this reality, I do two things. I continue to work for change - reminding schools of the CHEA "Framework for Meeting Transfer of Credit Responsibilities" that was supported by the CHEA membership. I also continue to work on behalf of students looking to my school for an education to ensure that their degree will serve them well. I believe I have been successful at the latter and will continue to work on the former.

Best,
Mary

 

I'm glad you recognize the DETC and its long experience with distance learning. That's why they are so good at it, experience. They were doing it when the RA's held their noses at such things. There is no question that DETC schools are as good as the lower tier DL/RA schools and reach up to the mid-level of RA's. 2/3 of the students moved on to traditional schools in 2001 and that number is probably better now. Vocational schools are nothing to be ashamed of and I hope the DETC continues the close relationship with these schools. They are part of distance education and help to make the DETC so valuable.

 

In my view, Mary is absolutely right on. She gives a realistic assessment of the value of a DETC accredited education (both objective value and real-world value.)

Those who try to claim that DETC accreditation is somehow superior to RA accreditation are either deluding themselves or misleading the people who come to this forum to get some real information.

I honestly wish that DETC accreditation were viewed as being on par with RA accreditation. Unfortunately, that is not the case. Perhaps it will be in the future, but I have serious doubts.

 

Hi Mary,

I certainly hope that my PM wasn't interpretted that way. If it was, I sincerely apologize because I actually believe the exact opposite. I thought that your post was very supportive of DETC and did your school and DETC very proud!

 

Hi Bill - reference your quote below - your message was not one of the ones I received that caused me to clarify my posting. I think you interpretted my first post correctly, but rather than leave any possible doubt, I decided to clairfy my post since one never knows about all the people who read and don't comment who might go away with the wrong impression! Thanks for your very kind comments. They are appreciated!

Best, Mary


"I certainly hope that my PM wasn't interpretted that way. If it was, I sincerely apologize because I actually believe the exact opposite. I thought that your post was very supportive of DETC and did your school and DETC very proud!"

 

I'm a big fan of DETC. I hope their standards are--or will become--comparable to the RA's. I also hope the acceptance of their credits and degrees also becomes comparable. But they're not the main accreditor of DL schools; that sits with the RA's. As long as differences remain, however, it is better to acknowledge them, rather than brush over them with unsuported hyperbole and irrelevance.

 

There are jobs (psychology) and nursing are two examples ) in which professional accreditation is often AT LEAST as important as regional accreditation, sometimes MORE so. In other words, even if a school is accredited by its regional association, unless its psychology department is also accredited by the American Psychology Association, its degree will be less useful for psychology majors. This is true in many cases in which other accreditors are involved in the accreditation of departments. That's why so many different accreditors are involved in the accreditation process. Far from being "THE STANDARD" of the American education process, it is a part of that standard. The DETC is also an important part of the standards of the accreditation process in the United States. The education provided by DETC schools is every bit as good as Excelsior/COSC/TESC and in fact reaches to the mid-point of RA/DL in quality. Proctored exams, no testing out degrees, no degrees based completely on past education. DETC schools are not the favored venue for teenagers trying to get quick college degrees before they even finish high school.

 

That's lifted right out of Bears' Guide. Have you ever heard of copyright infringement?

You really need to grasp this concept: No matter how many times you repeat something, that doesn't make it true.

Which unaccredited school are you a graduate or fan of that is now talking about trying for DETC accreditation? That can be the only possible reason for you suddenly starting the DETC cheerleading squad.

 

Yes I recognize that DETC has impressive experience in accrediting vocational programs and EXTREMELY limited experience with college credit programs. I recognize that they accredit approximately 1% of all college level programs in the US and that schools accreited by them would much prefer RA approval. I recognize their utility and value is much lower than RA. They are a legitimate part of the accredited schools in the US but an extremely small part.

 

Hi Bruce: Thanks.
Hi Mary: Thanks.

Hi Rich: Does any of your research show acceptance/nonacceptance of credits or degrees from TRACS- or other NA accredited schools (besides DETC) by RA schools?

 

RA schools do most of the career/technology courses in the U.S. I wouldn't be too hard on the poor RA schools some of them teach truck driving real well and really do a bang up job on welding and brick laying. Tell me just how the Big Three provide better education giving degrees to teenagers who haven't even earned a high school diploma. Then give a degree to a guy without one semester hour of new work, based entirely on past educational work,allow someone to test out a degree again without any new work, or ever having received a book from the school. No, this isn't excellence in education. DETC schools easily surpass this level. AMU is better than either one of these schools.

 

There have been a lot of posts speculating how the two dozen or so DETC schools stack up against RA "tiers" (isn't this something made up by US News?). This seems at best an interesting conjecture and could be a perpetual argument.

There are a number of variables in the parametric equation one must evaluate in order to choose a school i.e. specific academic programs, cost, delivery methods, extra curricula needs, licensing, transferability...on and on. For instance, a well informed student might reasonably pick a school like AMU for what is has to offer (learning pedagogy and a specific academic program in say Defense Intelligence, Military History, or Criminal Justice) over a large percentage of other universities regardless of accreditation and where they reside on different "tiers". Many other schools could be passed over because they may not offer the program desired. Anyway, the opposite holds true as well... a large recognized traditional school, perhaps with an online program, may be just what the doctor ordered in many cases.

 

If my memory is accurate, James is a current student at a Nationally Accredited DETC university. I give him a lot of credit for going back to school to continue his education at a legitimate university. I wish him, as I do all fellow students, the best of success.

 

If that's the case, I certainly wish him well also. However, it's becoming a bit tiresome watching him put forth his opinion as fact, even after being rebuffed time and time again.

 

I think your memory is fine, and you know James is attending a DETC school.

James is put in the defense mode because he is attending a DETC school, and some are implying that it is not as good as RA. When I listen to talking heads on some show imply that SC is a racist state when they do not live here, or even come here I get in the same mode.

I think a lot of the courses in many degree programs are fluff. I have had my debates with people, but I still think that way. Many here have the same core beliefs about education, and are welcome to it, but James is also welcome to think that DETC is on par with RA. It should not bother people that James thinks that way. Disagree with him, but let him have his views.

If you believe in what you stand for you should stand for it!

 

I am not sure what you meant by your opening sentence. I don't know how much James would wish of his personal affairs to be spoken about and I was trying to respect his privacy. That's all.


I am a student in a DETC university as well. I know the frustration he feels. You work hard, just as hard as some RA universities. It can hurt when someone accuses you of attending an unaccredited university looking to be a DETC university, because you defend or have pride in your school.

DETC is not RA. It has along way to get there. People can still be proud to be in a DETC accredited university as long as they study hard, are willing to learn and do their best.

 

I very much agree, Scott. Those who only wish to hear one voice should get tape recorders. Each person is entitled to an opinion. If you are very tired of reading my posts--- DON'T read them. Because I will not be forced to reject my ideas because you prefer to hear what you want. The big three do NOT represent high quality education and DETC schools easily reach that level and better.

 

James has done his research. He has every right to defend what he believes in. I give him credit for being man enough to stick to his guns. I have not witnessed James be rude to anyone, but I believe he has taken at least one across the bow about being in an unaccredited university.

Agree with him or not, James is a class act and he is proud to be in a DETC accredited university. Good for him!