1. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck


    to continue to narrow the utility down. Have you done any research or even ad hoc study on whether there is a utility issue with RA DL and RA B&M. I ask because I do not want to continue to spend effort and money on degrees that are valuable to me alone and not to either a potential employer, the general public, or more importantly the world of academia.

    Secondly, while testing for credit is acceptable it seems to me that professional certs, PMP, MCSE, CCNA, etc...should carry some academic weight. Do you or others on the board have any thoughts and/or avenues to explore this possibility?

    As a counter point I have seen RA degrees insufficient when they were not accredited by the appropriate professional body. ABET in particular. But not in favor of a NA degree.

    By the way this forum absolutely makes my day. Seldom does one see so much advocacy.

    Happy Holidays,

  2. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Can't beat that.... :)
  3. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Whoa, cowboy. Who's being defensive? As far as I can tell, this is just a discussion thread. Disagreeing--refuting, actually--isn't the same as being "defencive." If it was, that definition would also apply to you.

    Your post implies someone is trying to prevent you from having an opinion. Nothing could be further from the truth. Refuting an empirical study with one's own limited (and undocumented) experience sounds like someone expressing an opinion. Dressing it up with a different name doesn't change that....

    But having and expressing an opinion isn't the same as being right, or even factual. If you have some information regarding the subject at hand that would shed further light on it, I'm sure many would enjoy reading it.

    Take care...;)
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 22, 2003
  4. dis.funk.sh.null

    dis.funk.sh.null New Member

    yes precisely Rich,
    I have repeatedly, in my posts, made it clear that what I have said is my opinion...
  5. dis.funk.sh.null

    dis.funk.sh.null New Member

    and then I was a member... :D sorry for flooding the thread.

    I am hoping, Rich, that I have quite a few years ahead of me for doing formal study in non-traditional education. Maybe I will take up your offer in this field in the future and I am sure it will be very interesting. All in all, I find the forum members being very helpful and guiding.
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 22, 2003
  6. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Re: Looks like I opened up Pandora's box!

    I definitely agree with your overall assessment of DL. I wouldn't say that new grad's skew the results away from DETC. I would say that it makes for a simpler comparison of purely the educational component in the decision process.

    On the other hand, it has been stated on more than one occasion that many people would consider a DL degree to be more significant that a brick and mortar degree because it does exhibit the attributes that you describe (i.e., maturity, self-motivation and time-management skills). However, that is a criteria that would seem to be difficult to try and separate in a study from the other issues.
  7. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    Rich Douglas wrote:
    " . . . Also, more than one manager raised the "How would I know?" question which is particularly true at a B&M school offering DL programs . . . "

    I respond:
    I understand this argument as far as it goes. However, in most cases it just doesn't go that far. Most of the people involved in DL programs, especially postgrad programs, are employed full time. Even a casual examination of a proper resume will reveal the glitch . . .

    "Well Mr Smith I see you've been employed full-time in Massachusetts for the past 10 years. In that same period you've earned your MBA from CSUDH (please substitute the program of your choice). I guess that must be one of those new-fangled DL programs, eh? :rolleyes:

    Obviously you can reduce the liklihood of this occurring by enrolling in a DL program of a school near your residence but how many of us can do that in reality. My point, obviously, is that I think it's usually pretty easy to tell if it's a DL degree.
  8. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    This is an important debate, I think. I am working on a D/L LL.M. from the University of London because that is literally the only way I can further my legal education in legal theory. Even if I were willing to relocate here in the U.S., there's only one LL.M. program (at SUNY Buffalo) in my subject.

    However, I am a bit uneasy about comparing my opportunity to DO gradute work with the opportunity presented to resident students at, say, SUNY. I will not have the opportunity to work closely with a professor or professors in my field. I will not assist such a person to prepare and present research in academic fora, something which INTERNAL U of L LL.M. students can do.

    The lack of the scholarly community worries me. I have no doubt that I will master the material to the master's level, especially since the model bears some resemblance to the American JD system, but I can't help but think that I will be missing a good deal by not having the routine interaction and debate with others in my field.

    Fianlly, I would be even MORE uncertain about doctoral level work. I notice that the majority of D/L doctoral programs seem to require at least SOME residency.

    Comments please?
  9. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck


    technology can place you in a virtual cohort with either your professor or classmates. I have seen some PHD (non in your field) programs that make use of web-cams, audio, etc...as a method of cohort participation. Not perfect but perhaps arrangements could be made for such a configuration. The challenge in itself may be a useful part in research for future students?

    Best of luck
  10. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck


    thoughts on the RA Independent Study for credit courses? Most of the ones I have seen are self-paced, within reason, and the institutions state they carry the same credit as the classroom version.

  11. DaveHayden

    DaveHayden New Member

    Hi Kevin

    WGU was founded in 1997. They knew they could gain DETC accreditation faster than RA. Being DETC accredited means they could state they were "accredited" which adds great value to any unaccredited program. I think the costs to keep DETC accreditation is minimal. I would suspect they will keep both. It really has no downside I can see.

    I am unsure what you are trying to say here. If you are asking if the DETC accreditation process is equal to the RA process, I don't know. The question this whole thread is about is what value and utility do DETC degrees have compared to RA degrees. I believe it is clear that RA is the better choice for almost all potential students.

    Again the question is utility and value. Clearly RA DL is better than DETC DL, and RA DL from a bricks and mortar school is better than an online only school. After that it is best to choose the best RA program in the field you want to study.
  12. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck


    my comment on ease of entry was merely to point out that many RA programs have an ease of entry also. Which is good, since many of us are better students as we get older. I am trying to garner two things from this forum:

    1st: respective utility of types of programs for continued education.

    2nd: academia view point of the various types of programs.

    I am somewhat limited as I travel a good bit. However, at some point I would like to return to teaching as I find it rewarding (not necessarily financially) and would hate to have to defend my academic credentials on a routine basis with peers. (My experience stands on its own merits.) The consensus of the forum members seems to be clear.

    I am going to post another topic in the general discussion forum that I would like to have feedback from the learned community.

    Thanks for the thoughts,

  13. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    I'm probably not the best source of information on this, but I do have a couple of thoughts on it. In many situations, that your credits come from an accredited school will be the criterion used. In some situations, there might be some reluctance or refusal to accept credits earned nontraditionally (or a limit placed upon how many would be accepted). I suspect these lines are blurring rapidly, however.

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