what is really accredited?

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by morleyl, Nov 1, 2003.

  1. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    Again, you could say it is legal to open an offshore account and hide your money there from the government. Is it legal? yes. Is it honest and moral? no

    So I do not believe that legal automatically means recognition and maybe by accepting that fact then you can argue with the diploma mills that their accreditation is not regonized because the process is bogus.
  2. galanga

    galanga New Member

    what hogwash is...

    From the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, William Morris, Ed., Houghton Mifflin Company, ISBN 0-395-20359-7 (1981):

    hogwash n. 1. garbage fed to hogs; swill. 2. Worthless, false, or ridiculous speech or writing.
  3. Mike Albrecht

    Mike Albrecht New Member

    The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language: Fourth Edition. 2000

  4. Mike Albrecht

    Mike Albrecht New Member

    What is accreditation by CHEA
  5. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    again. what is English and what is not English? Hogwash is not in the Oxford Dictionary as far as I know.

    Anyway, I was not debating about hogwash. The point is to stick with the issue and not going off into assumptions or motivations.

    If we focus more on the process used to grant degrees, I think there would be less loopholes for diploma mills to exploit. I guess what I am saying is if TESC and WGU can be accredited then what excuse does these other schools have not to gain accreditation.
  6. galanga

    galanga New Member

    hogwash, some more

    Hogwash is not in the Oxford Dictionary as far as I know.

    Didja look?
  7. morleyl

    morleyl New Member


    You are focused on the wrong topic here. The word you used is not appropriate for the discussion anyway.

    I could ask the same question about Diploma mills, do you look before you conclude on different schools or agencies.

    I think you have missed the point of my question and postion totally.
  8. bgossett

    bgossett New Member

    Which schools?
    Name them.
  9. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    Well, I am sure you have the common ones.. St. Regis, Century, Hamilton etc etc.

    I do not want to get into a debate with names, I am just saying that if we question the processes, we could force them to realize their degree is questionable.
  10. kansasbaptist

    kansasbaptist New Member

    Good Luck getting a straight answer here!

    I have been trying for two months to get a direct answer concerning GSST. The responses I received were no more that one senior member quoting another as the "expert".

    Then, when I sent a PM to the quoted person, the original quote is denied and around and around we go.

    In the end, the question was not answered (still is not) and my outstanding PMs are ignored.

    All I wanted was a straight answer to a direct question, but (from my experience) that rarely happens in this forum if traditional points-of-view are challenged -- regardless of your motives.
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    What was your question regarding GSST, Michael?
  12. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

  13. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    Hi Jack:

    you could say I am new on the block but not totally ignorant.

    I am not really saying that there should be a totally new agency, I just saying that the current thinking could be flexible to allow certain possible approaches without hurting the standards.

    For example, is the credit base system the only way to offer a degree? WGU has come up with a different approach and has been accredited. Should more schools follow this approach? absolutely.

    I am not advocating for a specific outcome, I am just throwing out ideas that can lead to constructive conclusions. The concern I have is wehn people answer in such way as to imply that I am taking sides with the Diploma Mill approach.

    For example I have notice this with a lot of the schools.

    1. They give transcripts with subjects that the person has no knowledge of. Regardless of how qualified a person is I think its dishonest to do that.

    2. Most of them do not request any supportive documentation for the resume. You give a resume and a check and thats it. Thats wrong too.

    At least the person should do some work to develop a portfolio on a subject by subject basis. In most cases this would prove that the person needs to take some classes or exams.

    If I am advocating anything, I would say its balance. High academic standards but flexible to allow people to leverage their previous training and experience.
  14. novemberdude

    novemberdude New Member

    I realize that this is far from the point of this thread, but really, what the hell.

    While it may be legal to open an offshore bank account it is not legal to use it to hide income which is (or should be) subject to income tax. You are almost certainly required to report all income to your relevant national tax authority, with certain limited exceptions.

    You really gotta be careful what you tell people.

    Wait, maybe this isn't so far off the point as I thought.

  15. Frankie

    Frankie member

    Lets replace the word legal with legitimate. As I understand it there is no law that forbids a school from operating without accreditation. However, that does not mean that a legally operating unaccredited school is going to be accepted as legitimate.

    Here are the problems:

    1) Acceptance of unaccredited degrees: It is not common practice (to say the least) for an RA accredited school to recognize unaccredited degrees. Heck, many of them do not recognize NA accredited degrees.

    Using an unaccredited undergraduate degree as a basis to apply for entry into graduate level RA degree studies would be less then simple. You could possibly find yourself severely limited and even restricted to unaccredited learning in the future.

    You also have to be concerned with employer standards. You will find that many top civilian, military, government and corporate employers want graduates of RA/NA accredited degree programs. Again, employers who knowingly accept unaccredited degrees are likely less in number then employers who demand otherwise.

    2) Standards of degrees: Regulation is important. a degree from an RA/NA accredited school means that the school has adhered to set government standards and regulations. This would give credibility to the school and degree.

    Private accreditors have no such regulation. They have no supreme body to answer too. Private accreditors could award their accreditation to a well-meaning school with a real curriculum or to a mill with nothing more then a post office box and a contact name.

    Just so you do not misunderstand, privately accredited is the same as unaccredited as they are unsanctioned by the educational governing authority.

    I hope this helps?
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 18, 2003
  16. morleyl

    morleyl New Member

    I guess it all comes down to intent. One person may offer a program with the intent to help others while another person will a program simply to make money because of the loopholes.

    From my limited knowledge it seem that accreditation mean different things in different countries and that affects how programs are offered. For example in the UK, you would need a royal charter to start a degree granting school but you may have flexibility in the programs you could offer.

    In the US, anyone can legally start a school in some states and declare degree granting status but of course the standard is RA accredited.

    I read about a school that lost its RA accreditation recently because of poor financial management so it seem this is a big factor to be accredited.

    This is a question now. Suppose a school decides that they not really need accreditation at least initially bu offer a high standard of education, what would happen to graduates?

    In respect to employment, there must be some acceptance or ignoring of the standards, otherwise the diploma mills would not have florish.. They seem to be and I bet its people who work that use them. If someone has a business and want to have some title thats another issue too.
  17. kansasbaptist

    kansasbaptist New Member


    I sent you a PM

    Hope you can answer my question
  18. Dennis Ruhl

    Dennis Ruhl member

    You have been touched by the academic snobbery rampant at degreeinfo. Way too many experts around here.

    To me, GSST looks like one of the better unaccredited schools. The faculty is reasonably well educated and the program seems comprehensive.

    If it works for you, great.
  19. Frankie

    Frankie member

    Being unaccredited is not illegal but definitely not preferred or shouldn't be IMHO.

    Do you know the name of the school?

    They would be running around with unaccredited degrees. I noted the risks of using such degrees in an earlier post.

    I would call it ignorant acceptance. However, when an employer learns of the truth...go to "search" and type in "time bomb." After doing this and getting quite few threads pop up...read carefully.

    People do not always get away with having diploma mill degrees and in many cases pay heavily for it.
  20. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    Hi Michael - I was somewhat perplexed about this post of yours as, typically, people have little difficulty in getting direct answers to direct questions on this forum. I took the time to review your entire posting history (all 8 posts) and discovered that you never really asked any questions regarding GSST. You did say that you knew that it was unaccredited and that it would have little utility. You also said that you were pursuing this degree for self-improvement only. There was one point where you asked what the criteria of a degree mill might be, but this doesn't directly reflect on GSST, or does it? But I seem to have missed any direct question(s) regarding GSST. Perhaps this was my oversight. In any case, perhaps you can reiterate your question here and hopefully get a more satisfying response. It's unlikely that I'll be able to help as religious degrees are far from my area of expertise. Good luck in all cases,

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