US intelligence: Russia plans to attack Ukraine early next year

Bill,
I see your point, can't it be that he allowed trigger happy commanders to order tanks cross the border?
I have no doubt and anyone reading my post to conclude that he ordered. Its obvious nothing like that is done without his orders.
Maybe be its the language as you say.

As to Zelenski, indeed he is a Jew and definitively not a Nazi, his family fought against Nazis.
Jews live well in Russia and in Ukraine.
Russia also uses Benderevtsi term, for the members of government etc.
Бендеровцы - The Banderivtsi are members of an assortment of right-wing organizations in Ukraine. The term derives from the name of Stepan Bandera (1909-1959),
Bandera is revered as a hero by many Ukrainians for leading the political wing of the anti-Soviet independence movement,
the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN). Its military wing -- the Ukrainian Insurgent Army -- waged partisan warfare during and after World War II.
Bandera was killed by a Soviet assassin in Munich in 1959 regarded as a traitor by others for leading an insurgent war against Soviet forces and collaborating with Nazi Germany.
His forces also fought against the Nazis at times during the war and are accused of carrying out murderous campaigns against Poles and Jews.
Hundreds of Ukrainians held a torchlight march in the capital, Kyiv, to mark the birthday of the controversial nationalist leader Stepan Bandera on Jan 1st 2022.
Similar marches also took place in several other cities, including Lviv, where about 500 people gathered at Bandera’s monument to honor him.

Like in any country there are far right and Nazis etc, but Russia is highly misleading that these groups running the Ukrainian government.

For someone who know something about how things work in Russia, the commanders would be afraid to report truth to Putin.
For example he maybe shown latest technology tank, but he may not be shown that many other tanks are older junk, the money was stolen.
In Russian army there was a saying that the boots must be polished the front. No body cares how they are in the back.

 

In addition Russia is using in its information war the NATO bombing of Belgrade in 1999.
Russia is trying to justify their attack on Ukraine and saying that they are more controlled, and less aggressive then NATO bombing of Belgrade.
They state:
"Western military alliance’s intervention helped realize Kosovo Albanians’ aspirations of independence from Belgrade’s rule, it remains a highly troubling issue for Serbia, where the bombing campaign is widely described by them as the “NATO aggression”.

On the Russian TV they don't show Kiev, Lviv etc, they mostly show Donbass area and refugees from those areas.
They are showing how happy the locals are and how warmly they accept Russian forces.
Strong propaganda.
The world is not buying,

 

I'm very impressed with the bravery, dedication, and solidarity of the Ukrainian people. It is very inspiring.

 

Indeed they are.
They need military help in stopping Russian aggression.
Will Ukraine be sacrificed?
Reports are now coming that Belarus forces joined Russia and crossed in to Ukraine.
World is watching in disbelieve.

Sanctions as harsh as they are will be compromised by Chaina and India etc, they are accounting for 50% or 60% of world economy?

Israel should provide Iron dome to Ukraine.
Russia is supplying Syria with missiles etc

 

I got to thinking today...there's no way out for Putin. He is toast no matter what happens. Barring a nuclear exchange, however, this is a no-lose for the U.S. We get a Europe that finally understands its need to be militarily effective and united, a China that is nervous about supporting a madman and is seeing what invading Taiwan might actually look like, and a world that stands reminded of the awsome power of the U.S. dollar in international trade. Grim way to think but...true.

 

Never interfere when your enemy is destroying himself.

 

They are destroying Ukraine and getting hurt as a result but I hope there is ceasefire soon and some kind of agreement.

 

Yes and now the monsters are attacking civilian areas. Terrorists.

 

Biden's SOTU speech was pretty good overall but a bit thin about Ukraine and what he intends to do. Meanwhile the few minutes I watched of the Iowa Governor's GOP response was shocking. All she talked about was inflation. Really? Maybe she moved on to Ukraine but she started with inflation. Lady, Ms Governor, look, right now we're worried about Putin's nuclear forces doing drills, okay?

 

Of course, I too hope for a cease fire. Unfortunately, I think it is going to get WAY worse. I'll guess that it's more likely that someone in Russia puts a bullet in Putin's head than Putin agrees to a cease fire. Unfortunately Putin being done away with is very unlikely, IMHO, which is why I think it is going to get way worse.

 

Good summary - as I'd expect from such an astute observer. I noticed one thing about Ukraine and Russia. Our guy, Justin Trudeau, said today, Canada is going to STOP buying oil from Russia. Now. Period. That's about $500+ million a year that Putin and the oligarchs won't get. The US buys more oil than that from Russia, I'm told - but Pres. Biden says only that the US will be "looking at" those purchases. Wonder why not a firmer commitment? I'm confident both our countries are on the same side, of course, and taking the best actions they can devise, but why the difference in this one matter? Any idea, Nosborne48?

 

They will pay. Their entire country is paying already, in some small ways. Not even a tiny fraction of what the perpetrators SHOULD pay, or what they WILL pay. Payment consistent with these monsters' actions will be a terrible thing to witness. And I believe it will come. It must, even though most people will have to look away.

 

Yeah, the President does not seem to be willing to ask Americans for even the slightest personal sacrifice in this time of genuine crisis. I was disappointed by that. I think he could have done so and the effect would have been to inspire a sense of unity. We don't need any Russian oil. Far from it. But prices might rise.

 

While this may be invoking Godwin’s Law, listening to the news is a tear jerking reality check on how people may have once been able to support Nazis. Sigh

 

Here' they've already risen to 50% plus over the level of a year ago. Another 10 cents a litre is expected within days. that's around 38 cents per US gallon, I think. We're in record territory.

Still, this is NOTHING, of course, compared to the suffering of Ukrainians. But I can't help thinking there's something more than supply and demand affecting the price of gasoline that's already here. I suspect big oil execs are contemplating huge bonuses.

 

You won't get any trouble from me, re: Godwin's law. I think what you said is appropriate - even indispensable, in this context. Many of the people who supported Nazis did so for only one reason: because they were afraid of them and what they might do, if opposed.

Regrettably, a new villain has appeared and things don't seem to have changed much, in some ways. That time (Nazis) many, many incomparably brave people either lost their lives or were wounded in the struggle. Right eventually prevailed -- at tremendous cost in human lives. People said "Never Again" and they meant it. But here we are...

I have no doubt Right will prevail this time - but I hope with all my heart, that there will be nowhere near the loss of life and limb as in that other dark time, to which you were aptly referring.

 

Well, there were plenty of Ukrainian concentration camp guards and troops fighting with the Germans. Finnish too, come to that. And Balts. We even let the German Army keep its weapons for a short while in the Baltic to keep order.

All this solidarity came in part from sincere Jew hatred but mostly from loathing the Russians. Russia starved Ukraine deliberately in the 1920s and memories were much alive by 1940. The Balts were re-conquered by the Russians in 1940 and the Finns beat them back.

Eastern Europe is complicated.

 

Finns and Balts fighting I mean. Not killing Jews as far as I know.

 

The point is, to paraphrase Ben Gurion, "There is no Nazi Germany anymore."