Oregon and Kennedy-Western

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by Alan Contreras, Mar 2, 2005.

  1. Alan Contreras

    Alan Contreras New Member

    A while back there was some erroneous information posted in another thread about the effect of the Kennedy-Western settlement with Oregon. Here is the correct information.

    Oregon residents can acquire degrees from Kennedy-Western if they want to. This has been true for most of the past 25 years, except during a period in which Kennedy-Western chose not to offer degrees to Oregon residents. This was described to our office by KW's attorney as a "business decision" by Kennedy-Western.

    What has changed are the conditions for use of such degrees in the state.

    Owners of KW degrees can use them in Oregon today. KW agreed in the settlement that its users must always provide a written disclaimer when the degrees are used, stating that the degrees are unaccredited and unapproved by ODA. Any user who does not include the disclaimer is in violation of Oregon law.

    We now apply the same standards to a user of any degree issued by a state-approved degree-granting entity. We have asked the legislature to change the statute accordingly. This proposed change is in House Bill 2182, which we expect to be heard in late March. Anyone who wants to testify on the issues may do so at that time.

    Foreign degrees will be treated the same way, except that they must be from a degree-granter that can prove that it has proper authority to issue locally-valid degrees in its country of origin.

    Note that Oregon still prohibits the use of unaccredited degrees for state employment, and in any licensed profession. KW agreed in its settlement that the state has a right to do this.
  2. Alan Contreras

    Alan Contreras New Member

    In my recent post on KW, I mentioned 25 years. I am not sure they have existed that long.
  3. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    Hoo boy, Alan. Clarity. Precision. Calmness. Are you ever irking the trolls!
  4. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

  5. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    They'll continue to ignore the facts and continue to spew the lies, so it really doesn't affect them.

    You know who ought to be ticked off about the ODA/K-WU settlement? People living in Oregon who hold degrees from other unaccredited schools. Before, the law said you couldn't use the degree, but who was going to stop anyone? Now, they have to make that gawdawful disclaimer to use the degrees they paid hard cash to get. But will they enjoy the same lack of scrutiny as before? Maybe. But if this law gets enough publicity, we might even see a case or two prosecuted! Wouldn't that be grist for the media mill?! :cool:
  6. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    I'm sorry if I'm being a bit slow on the draw here but when you say, "Foreign degrees will be treated in the same way..." does that mean 1) in the same way as they were treated before the legal revision, or 2) in the same way as the unaccredited, unapproved degrees, or 3) some other thing? The way it's written (above) is somewhat ambiguous.
  7. That would be a great moment.

    Maybe, the US Federal Court, can decide the legal mania of accredited/unaccredited in US. Not by a opinionated Group; that simply articulate: !My Way or no way!:rolleyes:

    The Jus are in the Courts, not in the Media Trials.

  8. Oh boy, i remember the Dark Ages:

    “Contreras threatened to fine Benton $25,000 each time she was caught mentioning one or both of her BJU degrees, and said she might go to jail if she persisted. Despite laudatory reports on her teaching by supervisors and students, Benton lost her Umpqua position for a time, was embarrassed by the widely publicized attack on her competence, and worried that her family would be unable to pay its bills.”

  9. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    Au Jus

    Troll crap in incoherent Spanglish.
  10. miguelstefan

    miguelstefan New Member

    Dear Mr. Contreras,

    First, let me say that I applaud your efforts, specially when it comes to educating potential students and employers about the status of a particular educational institution. The ODA is not perfect yet, but substantial progress in both policy and content has been made since it began.

    Second, I am curious if the policy of allowing the use of a degree from institutions not approved by Oregon by providing a written disclaimer stating that the degrees are unaccredited and unapproved by ODA applies only to KWU degrees or to all the unapproved institutions on the list.

    Finally, may I sugest dividing the ODA into three categories. Similarly to the way Doctor Bear has it in his book. For example: Approved Institutions, Unapproved Institutions, and Degree Mills (Dr. Bear's guide splits it into Acredited, other institutions, and degree mills). Such a categorization would make it much easier for the consumer to know what they are geting into.

    Best of Luck and keep up the good work,
  11. Alan Contreras

    Alan Contreras New Member

    To clarify my comment about foreign institutions, they will be treated the same way as domestic institutions, except that the user will have to show that the foreign degree is approved by and valid in the country where the degree is issued.

    If the foreign country has an approval process equivalent to U.S. accreditation, the degree can be used with no disclaimer. If the foreign country does not have such a process, the degree can be used with a disclaimer.

    If the foreign country has no meaningful process through which it approves degrees for issuance and domestic use, the degrees will be treated as invalid for any use here.

    Degrees issued in a foreign country but not valid for use throughout that country will be treated as diploma mill degrees. Example: Knightsbridge of Denmark would be treated as a pure diploma mill because Denmark denies that it has the legal authority to issue degrees, and its degrees are invalid in Denmark.

    I anticipate a flood of inquiries about specific foreign suppliers. As always, we don't do evaluations without a fee. The fee for evaluation of a foregn supplier is $400.
  12. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Knightsbridge? A diploma mill? Say it isn't so!
  13. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    What about Credential Evaluation Services such as AARCAO or NACES member such as ECE, WES?

    Or non NACES member such as FCI or others?

    Will Oregon perform their own evaluations or have approved list of Credential Evaluation Agencies?

    After all this are professionals who study foreign systems of education and do this for living?

  14. Alan Contreras

    Alan Contreras New Member

    In practice, we almost always use AACRAO as our foreign school evaluator. The Commission for which I work has expressly approved AACRAO for that purpose, and the University of Oregon also uses them. We sometimes use other services when we think a second opinion will be helpful in a specific case.

    Any information we receive from these services constitutes advice to the state, not a decision. However, I cannot recall that we have ever taken a position that differed from that of AACRAO unless the unique requirements of state law could not be met for some technical reason.

    I mentioned in another thread that the "Robert de Sorbon" Degree Offering Globule actually filed a complaint against the Oregon Department of Justice because we did use AACRAO, which shows how much confidence they have in (a) their true status, and (b) the quality of AACRAO's work.
  15. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Do you at least have a list of which countries you consider to have a U.S.-equivalent approval process and which you do not, and the criteria by which you make that decision? That would be helpful.

    So if someone's degree is from an IHE in an unapproved country but they have a positive transcript evaluation from AACRAO they are all right, or do they still need to pay you $400?


  16. Alan Contreras

    Alan Contreras New Member

    Oregon does not maintain a list of countries with acceptable processes because we largely rely on AACRAO, which has extensive information on these processes and equivalencies.

    There are certain nations from which we never accept degrees because we have already determined that the nation in question has inadequate or nonexistent standards (Cayman Islands and St. Kitts are examples).

    There are other nations in which some colleges are legitimate and others with superficially similar "approvals" are not, which involves a more complex evaluation (e.g. Liberia). Then there are situations in which a college that physically operates in Nation X is actually licensed to operate by Nation Y, but Nation Y does not consider the degrees valid for use inside Nation Y. This is the Warnborough situation. Therefore a list containing either Nation X or Nation Y might be used to falsely assert that Oregon accepts degrees from the entity.

    A foreign degree holder has the option of paying us the review fee, in which case any AACRAO charges come out of that fee and are paid by ODA. The user can also pay AACRAO directly and have the review sent to us. In practice, we get very few foreign evaluation requests. Which process would work best for a given individual will depend on their needs. For example, ODA does not do transcript evaluations (that is, course-by-course conversions)at all, those must go to a private evaluator.
  17. russ

    russ New Member

    Re: Au Jus

    You are quite wrong, Janko. If you go to the link on Dr. Latin Juris's post you will find a very informative discussion of how Alan used the "authority" of his state office to try to intimidate a BJU graduate by threatening to fine her $25,000 every time she mentioned she graduated from the college. He even said she might to to jail for doing so (power corrupts?).

    Once the state realized that Alan didn't know what he was talking about, the state AG's office tried to drop the case since Alan had, once again, overstepped his "authority." The judge did not allow that and ruled against Alan and the state by saying that Benton's constitutional rights had been violated. She won, Alan lost, again.

    The same discussion by Donald Erikson, PhD. has some very interesting comments about accreditation as well that many of you might learn from. Unless, of course, you are afraid of hearing another side.
  18. DaveHayden

    DaveHayden New Member

    I sure wouldn't be worried about Liberian lawyers OR "St Regis". What a joke it is!
  19. DaveHayden

    DaveHayden New Member

    Re: Re: Au Jus

    More degree mill shilling. Unfortunately your actions are indicating employment by K-W or other degree mill. Very sad.

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