I have Resigned from NCU

Congratulations Dr. Randell. I'm sure it will serve you well. It is not the degree that makes a man but what you make out of it.

 

Thank you, by the way my comment was meant as a joke.

 

Sorry, but I'm having trouble understanding this.

Do you mean, "Better THAN nothing," or, better, and then, nothing?

 

I just don't get NCU, why are you guys still in business?

UOP does PR and other junk vs. just being BUTTHEADS!

Cheers,

TB

 

My self esteem is VERY HIGH, thank you very much!

Shawn

 

Someone who earned an NCU doctorate is still a graduate of an accredited doctoral program just like someone who graduates from Aspen, U of Phoenix. You (Randall1234) worked hard and earned a degree. Going in people going to NCU, U of P, or Aspen (DETC) should be aware that there are possible limitations to their degree in terms of perception and utility. But they are still accredited doctorates.

NCU and others like it are ways to earn an accredited doctorate for those who do not have the option or need to go to a regular bricks and mortar university. No one should enter them expecting they are going to be in academic running with someone with a standard PhD from one of the residential schools.

As to NCU's profit and business model, read again the issue with Trinity (TTS) and what the ex Vice President noted in terms of the profit model (put in lots of student but it is bad for the bottom line if they stay in due to use of resources). Also, much has been written about the business practices of U of P. Bottom line is that if you get into NCU or a similar school go in with eyes wide open about limitations and be DETERMINED to stick with it and make the system work. The academics may not be the tough part it may be the navigation of the system itself.

 

Speaking generally, with no particular school in mind... I meant all along that only 10% are ALLOWED to graduate and 90% are DELIBERATELY failed... (Again, very few students in "doctoral programs" choose their own fate in these programs, by finishing or not finishing; students are liked, get support in their dissertations, and are graduated OR students are disliked / ignored, milked for tuition dollars, and then never graduated. It is a clever, but illegal / unethical scam!) Does that help?

 

I strongly agree, People that earned doctorates from online institutions deserve credit as they showed commitment and a high level of motivation.

These doctorates seem to be in fashion now, I have few students that I noticed that they are doing doctorates at UoP, Walden and DL institutions. They don't have the intention to become academics but just do it for self improvement.

The PhD might become the next masters, I believe that if the trend continues, we will see in the future that faculty positions in business will require post doctoral work as some other saturated fields like sciences. If this is the future, then a PhD from NCU or another B&M school won't cut it as the faculty candidates will be expected to complete 3 to 4 years of post doctoral work as other fields require now.

Randell can still become a full time academic at a highly regarded school in the future as he can always complete a post doctorate at a better school.

 

Knowing what we all know about these profit-operations, the best thing for any sane person (especially, folks who frequent Degree Info - even lurkers) to do is to stay away from the super expensive doctoral programs. Like you said, "the academics may not be the tough part...," however, the fact that majority of the RA programs are overly expensive means low ROI. In fact, it would be safe to say that aside from the ego-boost that emanates from being called a "doctor," inability to secure an online teaching gig for whatever reason, which is what many who pursue these online doctorates aim at, substantially diminishes the ROI of the earned degree.

That said, if someone else pays for the degree, then the risk lowers while ROI increases. Further, where being called a doctor is the main motivating factor to pursue a doctorate - there are those posts in this forum, it makes perfect sense to pursue a cheap online NA doctorate than a $70k online equivalent. More so, while many think that just getting a doctorate is all that is required to get online teaching jobs, the reality is that those positions will continually diminish for new doctoral grads because earlier entrants into the online teaching world are snatching up almost all available positions (there are several folks in this forum that teach several online courses at different schools - 8 to 9 schools in some cases), in addition to the fact that enrollment at internet-only schools will continue to drop as more and more state schools open up new and old programs to the DL modality.

To rest my case, if I were in Randall's position, I would be extremely happy to have earned my PhD from NCU at less than $3k (the low out-of-pocket cost guarantees high ROI). However, for someone who can only attend an online doctoral program with student loans, "maxing out" those loans and then handing them over to an online school is akin to insanity and a possible financial suicide (considering that potential uses of such degrees are fast diminishing, and cheaper alternatives are sure to crop up in the next few years).

 

I used to teach at 7 online for profit schools. I made a living out of it for a couple of years but the work was getting insane and the salaries never increased. Actually, new schools were offering lower salaries, TUI was offering $50 per student and was working for an online college here in Canada paying $400 per class.
I did not see a future there, Schools know that they are getting huge pools of potential candidates as online schools are graduating PhDs like pan cakes. Salaries will continue to drop. I know few people that are starting to use online marking services to keep up with the low salaries, basically take as much work as you can and outsource the marking and pocket the difference. The business is getting just too crazy so I believe it can be a bad decision for full time work options but still reasonable for those looking for extra cash on the side but I would hesitate to spend the 70K just to end making about the same as minimum wage (but in you PJs in front of the TV).

 

I think RFValve is probably right: we haven't reached the bottom yet. It will be interesting to see just how low the compensation for online teaching can go.

There have been posts here from people wondering if they could teach for free to get a foot in the door. I suspect that some online schools (particularly the for-profits) would actually be happy to oblige.

 

I'm betting that it'll get even lower than that. Once teaching for free becomes old hat, we'll have some darn fool offer to pay the universities for permission to teach.

 

besides....free teachers will be great for quality control.
So much for the state of education...

 

• Dave Wagner wrote:
  Speaking generally, with no particular school in mind... I meant all along that only 10% are ALLOWED to graduate and 90% are DELIBERATELY failed... (Again, very few students in "doctoral programs" choose their own fate in these programs, by finishing or not finishing; students are liked, get support in their dissertations, and are graduated OR students are disliked / ignored, milked for tuition dollars, and then never graduated. It is a clever, but illegal / unethical scam!) Does that help?

Dave Wagner is correct in his allegation that dissertation committee members have been instructed to flunk 90% of their doctoral students; committee members are only authorized to "pass" 10% of their students. Heyyyyyyyy wait a minute there!!!

:saroll:

Dave Wagner, does Capella online operate in the same way? Were you part of the 10% that Capella online allowed to graduate with a doctorate?

:firedevil:

 

So that is how you arrive at your "slave wages" argument. I would agree that is ridiculous.

 

This just made my day, a good laugh. Degreeinfo is also good for the soul.

 

• 
  
  He received his PhD from TUI, not Capella

 

Before you laugh too much, note that adjunct professors are often prepared to teach at prestigious universities for a net financial loss. They do it because it's a status symbol and an entertaining hobby.

For example, consider this adjunct prof at the University of Pennsylvania (a private Ivy League school):

 

Sorry. A train ride (even return) and a dinner = $1000?
Ya. Right.