I have Resigned from NCU

Theo, That was my understanding as well. And, it was true at NCU at one time. However, the NCU policy de jure is to not allow the first DIS course to be retaken a third time without some difficulty. I felt that I would not be able to complete my lit review in two 12 week courses. In any event, my AA blithely accepted my resignation after I explained this to her. NCU has compressed the courses and intervals, removed the Leave of Absence, and has made it difficult to repeat the first DIS course more than once.

It has never been about the money. I have prepaid for all course work and have a considerable balance. It was about hitting the wall after one retake due to lack of time and not being allowed to take the course a third time. I saw no way out but to resign.

 

truckie270,

Clean out your PM inbox when you get the chance Ranger.

abnrgr275

 

Done - I cannot seem to stay on top of the weekly carpet-bombing of inquiries about the Valdosta State DPA.

 

I don't know that what I am about to say applies to NCU. When Trinity Theological Seminary was in the accreditation process with North Central, a former VP posted some unflattering stuff about Trinity. I think it eventually led to Trinity withdrawing from the accreditation process. One of the things I remember (IIRC) had something to do with the fact that Trinity counted on a certain number of withdrawls for profit. In other words, students who paid money but did not get refunds and did not drain faculty resources. I imagine this (if true) might apply to a number of schools, at least those that either charge large amounts per semester or for blocks of classes. The former VP said trouble would have followed had all of the students enrolled stayed active (I suppose draining resources).

 

Speaking generally, with no specific school in mind, I've always wanted to ask uncooperative schools with doctoral programs the following question, "Look, you're charging money for a degree that you have no intention of ever conferring on 90% of your students. How is that different from collecting money for a product that you have no intention or ability ever to ship to the consumer? Seriously, what is your plan for staying out of prison?"

 

It's not as simple as paying tuition and getting the degree. The student must also provide work that is worthy of being awarded a doctoral degree. The dissertation committee makes that decision.

 

I'm confused by your story. Do you have a completed doctoral proposal that has been accepted? If not, you're not a PhD Candidate, are you?

 

Dave, Yes, I am a PhD Candidate. I have completed the Comprehensive exams and my Concept paper (CP) has been approved by NCU. I was enrolled in the DIS sequence of courses at NCU. However, the deliverable for the first DIS course is the Dissertation Proposal, which I did not submitted by the end of the first DIS course, since I was not finished with the Lit Review. Now, there is a two strikes and you are out philosophy for the first DIS course, and MUCH less time to complete it at 12 weeks and a 21 day gap. I did not think that I would be done by this time, so I resigned. Since NCU is not honoring learner programs anyway, no harm, no foul when I return to NCU at my pace.

 

Things have changed since I completed the program just a few months ago but I thought it was two stikes and you are out (not out but up for academic review) if your DP is rejected twice and not dependant on the course sequence.

 

Wow, that really seems to support what Dave is saying. They don't seem to want you to make it. Two strikes and you could be out, with that philosophy there would be a great many doctoral candidates at traditional B&M universities who would wash out. Dude, you deserve a medal for making it through NCU.

 

Did I ever mention that, when I was going to NCU, I turned an "A" quality paper through their file exchange application where you turn in assignments. When the paper uploaded, some sort of glitch in the process destroyed the careful formatting I did on the paper so that the paragraphs and spacing was all wonky. The professor said the paper was top quality but graded me down severely because of the formatting. When I explained about the uploading glitch and sent him another copy via standard email to prove that I had done the formatting perfectly the first time, he refused to change my grade saying that the formatting issue was not his problem. I think there was something wrong with their system, but I could not prove it. But the paper was perfect when I sent it via standard email.

It was at this point that I began to realize that NCU couldn't care less about you, your education or what happens to you, all they want is your money.

 

Dr. O

As you are aware, the NCU program policies are changing with increaing frequency and are implemented with great alacrity.

The language was sufficiently scary to give me pause about undertaking a repeat of the first DIS class without being sure that I could complete it in time, since the school is frowning on "three peats." When you were at this stage, you had the luxury of LOAS. I also think that at that time, you could repeat the first DIS class with impunity, that it was almost expected, given the shortened class length.

 

Let me clarify- it the paper is submitted to the OAR more then twice you are at risk - not submitted to your chair/committee. I think the mentors were turning a blind eye to poor work and just pushing it to the school reviewers. The reviewers said - NO MORE. If the school reviewer rejects it twice it means something was submitted that was not up to par (rejection 1) and if it is resubmitted a second time and the first comments were not addressed (rejection 2) the student and the mentor are called on the carpet. They either can not follow directions or the student does not have the academic ability to produce the work needed.

After you get the feedback from rejection 1 there is a conference call with the school and a reviewer representitive and you can ask any questions to be sure you understand what you missed and what they want. There is also a "clarification" form you can fillout to ask follow up questions. I found the call and the form very helpful. When I turned in the final paper I knew (with some level of certainty) that I understood what they wanted and how to correct it.

 

I don't think this applies to all mentors. I have had some caring ones...but also ones that do not seem to care at all.

 

Ok, that makes more sense. We all know that it usually takes a number of tries to get your dis approved. What you are saying is that you could be in trouble if you don't fix the issues that the first review reveals. That's reasonable. All but one of the mentors I had there were useless so I can imagine how what you described could happen. Useless might be a little unkind; it appeared that the mentors were so overworked that they did not have time to do a good job with any one student.

 

What I am saying to all of you is this; it has nothing to do with DPs, it has to do with repeating the course more than once. With the shortened intervals and 12 week schedules, if you do not have a DP ready to go at the first DIS course, you are basically @#$$$%.

 

Leaving NCU also....Truckie, can you tell me more about Valdosta?

I have completed 7 courses for my PhD in BA/CJ at NCU. I then had to take a LOA due to health reasons. Now that I was preparing to return, they advised that my tuition lock is over as well as the reduction that i was getting for being in public safetry. My tuition has instantly increased from $850 per course to $2200 per course. When I ask about the public safety tuition reduction, they literally either ignore that part if the email or the entire email all together... When I began, their customer service was incredible!!! Now, I am just another check to them. My last professor was just outright rude.... I am fed up with them. Now they are trying to pressure me into registering for my next course before my 21 days after my LOA expires... I am looking at Indiana Tech's PhD in Global Leadership (although that is not really what I was looking for but I do like the curriculum) and the DPA program at Valdosta State... Does anyone have any experience with either? I know I have to take the GRE for VSU and they only take 25 new students per year so I am curious as to the number of applicants versus the acceptance level. VSU is, by far, the most reasonably priced and the DPA would fit my life goals better... I have to make a decision by Monday.... Please HELP!!!!!!

 

Gbssurvivor1,

I think you pretty much hit the nail on the head with your last sentence. The Valdosta State D.P.A. is priced the best out of the three schools you're looking at and would fit your life goals better. My suggestion is to study for the GRE and apply to Valdosta State, there are a couple of other DegreeInfo members who were accepted into the program from what I recall so you should have a good chance of making the cut. You would probably be able to transfer 6 semester hours from your NCU program into the D.P.A. program as electives which would cut the total number of credits needed to graduate down to 48 semester hours.

abnrgr275

 

Technically, Connie, PhD Candidacy is achieved when you have an approved proposal, which includes the first few chapters of the dissertation. Once you execute the proposal and write the results, then you are done, unless you are dealing with liars or people who don't know what they are doing. Then, anything goes...

 

Speaking generally, with no particular school in mind, the "doctoral program" business model depends on most everybody not succeeding, because the school can't possibly understand and process all the dissertations of all students with cash (e.g., hundreds or thousands) who start the "doctoral program". Producing doctoral graduates (at the end of the process) requires specialists in the topic to sit on the committees, but nonspecialists are the ones who actually administer the program, approve the dissertation, and confer the degree. They each can lay blame at the feet of each other or the student for the student not succeeding. Moreover, the process is designed for the student to fail because it incorporates long periods of time at random intervals, which exhausts the student's financial resources, psychological well-being, and physical health; hence, students fail about 90% of the time and generate huge amounts of cash in the process. The real tragedy for the public trust is that that scholarship is questionable because nonspecialists are given such a large role in the final research product. Of course, the "doctoral program" is not a legitimate or ethical business model, but it is quite clever... So in one sense, you could say that the perpetrators of the scam are smarter than their victims!