Democratic gunman tries to "kill as many Republicans as possible"

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by me again, Jun 14, 2017.

  1. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    Well, ok. But the esteemed member who started this thread could have said "Crazy Gunman . . ." but instead chose to highlight the fact that he was a Democrat so, I'm just saying . . .
  2. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Show me where do they point it out. As I see it, Kizmet is basically spot on. As for the collective blame, unless the perp is Muslim, the MSM tends to quickly move narrative towards mental health.
  3. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    It's true that a Democrat wanted to kill as many Republicans as possible" -- and tried to do so.

    It's also true that a senior Democrat (the Virginia governor) subsequently called for more Second Amendment restrictions, due to the politicized actions of a crazed Democratic gunman. However, why should Republicans be disarmed and deprived of their Second Amendment rights, based on the premise that the vast majority of convicted felons are registered Democrats?

    In summary, it would be incorrect to say that absolutely "ALL" Democrats are crazy or mentally ill.
  4. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    1. It's kind of offensive question. I do not support the use of violence against peaceful assemblies, period. I come from a country that stayed relatively peaceful all through the post-Soviet transition, even including 2004 Maidan protests. Unbelievable corruption, yes, even suspected political assassinations - but not violence against peaceful assembly. Until Euromaidan protest camp was violently removed November 30, 2013, sparkling an uprising culminating in Feb. 14, 2014, massacre, and ouster of Yanukovitch (leading to ongoing war against Russian-backed thugs that claimed 10,000 lives according to very cautious UN estimates). That is my city, hierophant, so the topic is pretty emotional. What Hodgkinson did was despicable.
    2. At this point, I'm a Canadian citizen hailing from Ukraine. I don't think I owe you explanation, but suffice it to say I'm fond of what the United States represent, and its role as a global leader on democracy and human rights. It does a world of good through "soft power" and pro-US politicians like Mikheil Saakashvili (of Georgia and, now, Ukraine. Funny thing is, he is pretty fiscally conservative, Libertarian even). This is absolutely vital.
  5. heirophant

    heirophant Well-Known Member

    James T. Hodgkinson: Bernie Sanders supporter, strongly anti-Trump -

    The problem is that ever since November public figures, intellectuals, celebrities and national media have been drifting closer and closer to the edge of sanity, with their supercharged rhetoric, outlandish conspiracy theories, play-acting Trump's assassination, and posturing as "resistance" fighters.

    That's why the self-avowedly 'responsible' figures in the media and intellectual life need to be more careful. People see what they are saying and some people actually believe it. And some of those are going to behave appropriately. After all, killing Republicans merely for being Republicans isn't necessarily 'crazy' at all if you are really convinced that the Republicans are the second-coming of the Nazis and that you are channeling brave 1940's 'resistance' fighters by attacking them.

    What I'm saying that many of our ostensible opinion-leaders in politics, entertainment, journalism and academia, are dancing dangerously close to the edge of madness since Trump's victory, which they can't seem to come to terms with emotionally. I'm saying that they do have a public influence and that they need to take responsibility for their rhetoric. If the country's established opinion-leaders don't start behaving in a more mature fashion, then more people are likely to die.
  6. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    Threats to Harm

    Full story:
    Blog: A partial list of threats against GOP and Trump from Hollywood celebrities
  7. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    I'm pretty sure that you're right about all of that.
  8. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    Yes, you're right. It is true. But take this example:

    A red Corvette, traveling at 70 mph through a school zone, hits and injures a child.

    Your headline could say "Chevrolet injures child" and that would be true. But is the fact that it's a Chevrolet really the most important aspect of the story? I would say that it's not. I would say that the fact that the car was speeding was the most important part. So you can emphasize the fact that the shooter was a Democrat if that serves your purpose but isn't the fact that the guy was crazy really more important? If you choose to emphasize that he was a Democrat then you are doing so with a certain intent. What is that intent? In my mind it only serves to fan the flames. That's my only point here.
  9. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    Killing Republicans is not a hate crime and does not have an enhanced penalty (upon conviction). In this case, it's just a garden variety homicide attempt (or premeditated murder).
  10. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    Kizmet, your point is understood. However, it's a non sequitur comparison because:
    - Red corvettes cannot hate children (to specifically crash into them)
    - Democrats can hate Republicans (to specifically shoot them, as was his declared intent)
  11. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator

    OK, well the way it's all coming across to me is that you're just determined to use this incident as a way to continue to be angry at Democrats so have fun with that.
  12. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    It's the shooter that was angry, along with these people.
  13. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    Violence against Republicans

    Here are 38 documented incidents of violence against Republicans, from July 2016 to June 2017:

    This List Of Attacks Against Conservatives Is Mind Blowing | The Daily Caller
    (scroll down to July 2016 and click on the embedded links for sources)
  14. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    I really wish you'd read this: Homegrown Terrorism and Why the Threat of Right-Wing Extremism Is Rising in America. It contains a link on a study, published by West Point, on right-wing extremism. See if you are still capable of shame.
  15. 03310151

    03310151 Active Member

    It's an opinion piece by someone who studies Terrorism. The "study" you say was published by West Point is actually a report, not a study, from the same guy. It certainly wasn't published by West Point.

    Are you allowed to reference your own reports as proof of something referenced in your own opinion piece, lol? If you open up that avenue, then all of the sudden me again will be posting quotes from all manner of right-wing media personality...and I know you don't want that.

    This is about violent behavior from the left. You can start a thread just like me again can start threads, and you can link to violence from the right as well.

    I wonder why the author doesn't count this violence as "terrorism"?

    Violence From the Left;

    young white, mentally ill male kidnapped, beaten, tortured, forced to drink toilet water, and threatened with death, as his kidnappers scream about Trump and repeatedly insist that he denounce Trump and white people; his kidnappers livestreamed their racist hate crime on Facebook as if it was perfectly natural --

    69 year old woman left with bloody head wound after 27 year old man brutally beats her with a chair for supporting Trump, tolerant leftist charged with attempted homicide --

    15 year-old punched and kicked by several classmates for wearing MAGA hat, punched, thrown to the ground and kicked, charges filed --

    man beaten by multiple assailants for voting Trump as they taunt him -- (his description:

    hispanic man chased and beaten by a mob for wearing MAGA hat --

    11 year old elementary student beaten by classmates, left in crutches, for voting Trump in mock election --

    Trump supporter shot during political argument --

    female in high school being beaten by another student for posting pro-Trump Instagram comment, as classmates cheer --
    British national tries to assassinate Donald Trump, tries to steal gun from Las Vegas police officer at Trump rally --
    bloody violence against Trump supporters outside San Jose rally --

    anti-police rioters kicking a homeless man for being white near anti-police riot, all cheer --

    anti-police protestors beat reporter unconscious, then try to drag him into a fire, because they're mad --

    man left bloody for attending a Trump rally, rocks thrown at cars, etc, in Costa Mesa. 17 arrests from the riot. --

    two men beat Trump supporter for holding sign, police intervene to save him --

    62 year old man beaten with crowbar for wearing Trump shirt, in front of witnesses --

    mob of anti-police rioters attacking a young white man, cheering as they beat, drag and strip him --

    high school student beaten into critical condition for posting BlueLivesMatter on Facebook. Police arrest four men who previously attended his High School --

    young woman beaten with clubs as she's trapped against a barricade --
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 16, 2017
  16. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    In the United States:
    1. Most violent crimes are committed by registered Democrats.
    2. Most convicted felons are Democrats.
    3. The left is comprised of Democrats.

    Stanislav, as a foreigner, why are you politically colluding with Democrats in American social media?
  17. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator

    So.....where are all the right-wing terrorist attacks?

    Have you no shame, now that it's been 100% confirmed that James Hodgkinson's motives were purely political?

    Scalise Shooter Had List of at Least 6 GOP Lawmakers' Names | Fox News Insider
  18. 03310151

    03310151 Active Member

    Oh that's just leftist flapdoodle, move along nothing to see. The real horror in this country is Rush and OReilly.

    Anyway, he posted a piece that's the final answer on how we're all right wing racist white racist Trump voting racist Nazis! Did you see the article, it was posted twice? It was so illuminating in the opinion piece how to author uses not one, not two, but three references to himself and other articles he wrote on right wing prove there's a lot of right wing terrorism.

    And not only are you shameful for not agreeing with him, you're a racist too.
  19. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Come on, like we all didn't talk about Brexit? It's an interconnected world, so it's not unreasonable for people to have opinions about what the U.S. government does, especially since it's one of the most meddlesome governments in the world, if not the most so. If you think he's wrong, fair enough, I often do too, but that doesn't mean he's unentitled to an opinion.
  20. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Oh, so stabbing a Black student (and newly commissioned Army officer) to death by an Alt Reich member doesn't do it for you? Not a terrorist attack, move along? How about hundreds of politically-motivated attacks by Right-wing groups the study refers to? A year, Bruce.
    I have a great doubt that this troubled individual's motives were "purely" political. But then again, so were the Pulse shooter's; clearly, Hodgkinson was a terrorist. The fact remains: some experts consider right-wing extremism, and right-wing terrorism, a serious problem in US. I don't believe their lefty countertparts are up to same scale, but am willing to be persuaded otherwise: do you have a reputable academic study ready? Something on subjects more recent than the Black Panthers and the Weather Underground? There are clearly episodes of terrorism on the left: Hodgkinsonis a clear example; a guy who shot at police in Charlotte (is being motivated by police racialised violence count as a "Left" cause? Maybe, I'll grant you that); maybe some others. But can you show it's a systemic problem? Even if you can, it would just show the balance with the Right terrorists.

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