600 € for a PhD in Spanish?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by datby98, Jan 15, 2023.

  1. datby98

    datby98 Active Member

    I happened to see this advertisement:
    PhD in Scientific Research Methodology online San Francisco de Asís International University | Emagister

    This St. Francis Of Assisi International University (https://www.stfrancisuniversityint.net/) seems to be celebrating its 3-month birthday soon, according to the following registration record in Florida:

    The official YouTube account was opened last November: https://www.youtube.com/@st.francisint
  2. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    Their own website says that they're (also) registered in Spain. I wonder if it's a legit school that happened to get some dubious advice about operating/acceptance in the US, similar to ENEB's past "partnership". Or if it's a pure diploma mill. It seems to be the latter.
  3. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    This type of creature is quite commonly found in Florida. It lives on a diet of swamp-grass in the Everglades. :)

    Seriously, Florida will register unaccredited schools, no problem. That's why so many flock there. If you want a totally legal but unaccredited doctorate, that no right-thinking person will believe in, send them their 600 Euros. Hopefully they will still be there when you uh -- "graduate."

    See if you can get a pic of a sample diploma. These things are usually pretty nice wall-hangers. For home, not office.
  4. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    From the Emagister ad Datby98 linked to:

    Somos una Universidad Americana debidamente registrada como organización en los Estados Unidos de América, somos miembros de las principales afiliaciones americanas y europeas de formación.

    "We are a University duly registered as an organization in the US, and are members of the principal American and European education associations." No mention of Spanish University; The University crest on the page is in English and says they're American.

    I cannot find a Spanish University that has this exact (or even close) name. There is one with the exact name, however in La Paz, Bolivia. It's a private University established about 20 years ago. Nothing I saw that would link the Bolivian school to this Florida outfit -except the name.

    I went to their Florida site. Big block-thingy came over the screen, obscuring everything and wanting my info. No "close" button, so I went away, none the wiser. They want me to believe they're American? OK - I will. Florida. Unaccredited. I'm out. (I was never in.)
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
    datby98 and Dustin like this.
  5. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Before the big block-thingy came down wanting me to "subscribe" I noticed the logo of a Christian Association. Didn't have time to see the exact name - but it looks like they're operating under the flag of Florida's "religious exemption." Like the "ethereal" schools there.

    Somebody call TRACS. Looks like they may have missed a prospective accreditation customer.
  6. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    Unaccredited does not mean a diploma mill. All the schools start with no accreditation. If there is substantial work involved, the experience might be acceptable but the limitations are obvious.

    For some people these diplomas work because they are not interested in academic or research career, as long as they can be validated and the prospect employer checks that it is an earned degree and not purchased, it might work but then dont expect it to be a game changer in your career.

    Some people wants just to be called "Dr" but I believe there are some laws when it comes to that. In Canada, only certain professions can use the "Dr" title and people working in academia. Some people in Canada use the title PhD that is not regulated with an unaccredited degree but jobs that require such a level of education normally require a foreign degree evaluation if it is a foreign degree.

    However, as Johann said, it is most likely that this school will not be able to make it that far with only 3 months of operations so it is 600 euros that most likely will go to waste as the school might not be there next year.

    If unaccredited is of interest, I think DEAC keeps a list of schools that have applied for accreditation so at least you are getting a degree that might have accreditation for future.
  7. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    You are a good detective. If this is the case, 600 euros is very expensive as some of these religious exempted schools sell the PhD for $25 dlls with shipping included. When the diploma has printed "religious degree" or something like this, the prospect employer most likely will not consider it profession career training. In some countries these PhDs work because they can be apostilled in the US but there are very few countries where this can be the case.
  8. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    Yes, you nailed it down. Doctrinal doctorate in business administration for its DBA, it is more creative than "ethereal" but it is another ridiculous school.
    "Doctorado Doctrinal en Administración de Empresas"
  9. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    Not Spanish but Mexican, I'm getting a lot of emails from the school below that offers propio doctorates from Mexico. I don't know the cost but at least the Mexican School is properly accredited in Mexico but the degrees offered are not. It is similar to Azteca but perhaps the prices are more affordable.


    I agree that the Religious degree makes no sense unless you are getting a degree is a religious subject like ministry, bible, etc. It is not going to help in your career a PhD in Doctrinal Engineering or Business.
    datby98 likes this.
  10. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Back in the halcyon days of nontraditional higher education--the 1970s--California had a 3-tiered system that both encouraged alternative schools to be created and for diploma mills to flourish. Many schools established under the very lax standards of the time would cater primarily to students overseas who would not make the distinction regarding accreditation--government licensing was what mattered to them. These schools also made a convincing pitch to American students about how accreditation was "voluntary" and "non-governmental." Technically true, but academically meaningless. These schools pumped out tens of thousands of degrees over the years, degrees that represented a wide range of actual work and accomplishment.

    Just because it's legal doesn't make it a good idea.
    Rachel83az likes this.
  11. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    Very true. But many people coming to this forum are just looking for the doctorate title with the least amount of effort, least amount of money and legal. There is a market for this and the existence of all these schools is proof of that.
    The OP is an example. I want a PhD for 600 euros (a couple of days in a Spanish hotel is 600 euros) that is legal and I can use in a CV.
  12. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    Looks like they're trying the Breyer State, American Theism University approach with the "Doctrinal" jazz. Red flag.

    I don't know if Spain's government allows for religious exempt schools like we do in the United States. If not, then the Doctorates from Spain (which as I understand it are supposed to be official in order to be legit unlike Master's degrees there) would either have no standing in Spain and could even be illegal there, or would at-best sit in a grey area between baloney and propio, a type of purgatory that could land a holder somewhere between laughed at and the unemployment line.
  13. RFValve

    RFValve Well-Known Member

    The school plays with the legality of the apostille document. A Spanish citizen can claim an American doctorate if this has an apostille from the US. As the school is properly registered and entitled to grant degrees, a notary can apostille the document as a degree document. The Spanish citizen will not be able to use the degree in Spain for a career where the doctorate is required (e.g. academic) but good enough to impress a prospect employer that might not understand the issue of religious degrees in the US as in Spain only properly accredited schools can grant degrees.
  14. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    With the site being in Spanish, I assumed they were awarding degrees from their real home base in Spain.

    Propios can be granted by unaccredited schools, it just appears that many don't survive without being in partnership with an accredited school. Spaniards don't much respect the independent unaccredited schools. In that way, we have a similarity in the United States.
  15. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    Obviously, it doesn't mean it's a diploma mill. But the literature claiming some sort of Spain/EU recognition when it apparently has none is concerning. At the very least. See https://www.stfrancisuniversityint.net/_files/ugd/57f2c9_d7509fb8f15e4e7d992be29a98bed7e0.pdf
  16. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    I'd like to make a distinction here. As long as you're not defrauding anyone, it's pretty much legal to claim whatever you want. If you want to claim a PhD from Harvard, you're not going to jail for that.

    I think some people on this forum want OTHERS to call them "doctor" via the least amount of work (and money) possible. Not everyone. Not even most. Just some.
  17. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    No, not all. Some start by being affiliated with--or part of--accredited schools.

    And I think we can tell the difference between a well-funded and organized effort clearly bent on becoming accredited and an operation that is not. But I think that's your point--that accreditation (at least initially) isn't the only indicator.
    Rachel83az likes this.
  18. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    It maintains a list of active applicants.
    "Might" is the operative word here. DEAC does not have a pre-accredited status involving an evaluation (like candidacy for accreditation). It has applicants and accredited schools. Being an applicant confers no form of recognition by DEAC.

    Applicants go through training to prepare for the accreditation process. Then they undertake a self-study. This can take several years and several iterations. Then they go through a site visit, after which an accreditation decision (yes, no, or continue working on it). At no point before accreditation may they publicize their progress as to not confer any sense of their probability of becoming accredited. They can't say their self-study was accepted, for example. Thus, potential students have no way of knowing how robust the "might" part of "accredited" really is.

    It's also hard to predict from the outside. I do work with a school that has, IMO, suffered mightily from the process. And there are some schools that achieved DEAC accreditation I never would have predicted.
  19. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Do they really have one? I was unable to find it by name - and they dropped the block-thingy on the Florida site so I couldn't see anything unless I "subscribed," and then they could e-bombard me forever - so I didn't. As I said, I found a similarly-named school in Bolivia but couldn't trace a connection.

    @RFValve You mentioned a Mexican campus for this thingy - but I can't find one under the name. Your link is to Universidad San Miguel. Can you give us a link to the Mexican presence of this San Francisco Asis Internacional school?
  20. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    10-minute mail (and similar). :D

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