48-72 Hours: Will Cal Coast Become USDoE Recognized?

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by Guest, Jun 2, 2004.

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  1. Jeff Hampton

    Jeff Hampton New Member

    Oh, I'm certainly not threatening to sue you. I have no vested interest here, so I wouldn't even have the standing for a lawsuit. Moreover, I hope you do not get sued. I apprecieate your vigilance.

    But I would sure like to see your evidence to support the following statement:

    "DETC is a paper mill agency where you supply them bunch process, procedures, handbooks, faculty information, gather bunch of RA qualified professors and off course lots of money and that will ensure DETC accreditation."

    Particularly the part about DETC being a mill.

    Can you tell me why CCU was not accredited? Did they not supply the process, the procedures, the handbooks, the faculty information? Did they not gather a bunch of RA qualified professors? Did they not supply lots of money?

    I'm looking forward to your answer, since you obviously have the definitive information.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2004
  2. Peter Chin

    Peter Chin New Member

    Let me clarify, I am not at all suggesting that DETC is a Mill. My argument is that accredited CSU which was known to be a notorious Diploma Mill. Even upon getting accreditation the conduct of CSU did not change and their diatnce and online courses are offered exactly as I described earlier.

    DETC and most oif the accrediting and qaulity assurance bodiesperform a comprehensive audit initially but really lacks the mechanisms whereby contnous monitoring can be achieved. The insituions are basically left alone to maintain their quality standards.

    But in CSU case that had been a diploma mill before DETC accreditation and tendency to continue to operate in the same manner is very likely. And in my personal opinion their staus is ACCREDITED DIPLOMA MILL. Probably State of Oreagon needs another category labeling then as AD.

    Peter Chin
     
  3. Jeff Hampton

    Jeff Hampton New Member

    They were primarily known as a diploma mill because they clamied bogus accreditation, right? Well, that certainly changed (unless, of course, you believe DETC accreditation is bogus, which you seem to do.)

    Good point. Even the RA bodies only re-examine accreditation every 10 years.

    Again, that is some very strong language. I hope you have the facts to support it. And keep in mind, we are not talking about CSU being substandard, even by what you would consider the minimal standards of DETC. We are talking about them being an accredited diploma mill. This casts aspersions on both CSU itself, as well as DETC.

    Strong words, indeed.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2004
  4. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator Staff Member

    I'm not a big fan of CSU, but I don't agree with that statement at all.

    I trust DETC, as well as all the other DOE/CHEA accreditors, that they are doing the right thing.
     
  5. Casey

    Casey New Member

    Your name and comments have been forwarded to DETC and CSU

    Mr Chin: Might I ask what a "Maqlaysian" education is all about? What do they teach you in "Maqlaysia"? How to commit human rights violations? How to beat women? How to murder babies? How to work for 5 cents per hour? Are you saying we should trust your government as a reliable indicator of educational quality? ... Doubt it!

    All U.S. accreditors must meet the same standards in order to earn USDE and CHEA recognition. Likewise, all accreditors re-evaluate their member schools every few years. If I recall correctly, DETC reviews member schools every five years, at most. Your assertion that DETC and CSU are mills is completely false, reckless, and possibly actionable. There is no way you can prove your allegations, and I hope that DETC's lawyer, Mr. Luman, makes you eat your words.

    The United States of America is the best country in the world. Our higher education system is not perfect, but it is by far the best on earth. You should be so lucky to possess an accredited U.S. degree. There is a reason that you do not. I agree with you in one respect, though. I think you are much better off with your alleged "Maqlaysian" post graduate piece of toilet paper.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2004
  6. Peter Chin

    Peter Chin New Member

    Re: Your name and comments have been forwarded to DETC and CSU



    It is Malaysia and not Maglaysia, sorry for my typo errors. Silly mistake I should have done a spell check before posting the thread.

    Please hold on to your emotional burst and keep tight tab on it. I have an undergraduate American degree and I am proud of it too and I totally agree with you that US has the best education system in the world. But at the same time there are hundred of diploma mill operating from US and creating a bad reputation in this region for US education.

    DETC has accredited CSU and considering many other not so great school for accreditation that would undermine their quality standards and I think a five review might not be sufficient for distance or online learning and it should be done annually.

    Following remarks are uncalled for and totally absurd and perhaps look into the mirror and you just might find the answer:

    “”How to commit human rights violations? How to beat women? How to murder babies? How to work for 5 cents per hour?

    Peter Chin
     
  7. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    For WASC at least, ten years is the maximum amount of time they let a school go without reexamining it. (In real life it may actually be 9 or 11 years, because of scheduling the visits.)

    But for many schools, the visits are spaced five years apart. And for a few insitutions that are being watched for some reason, formal site visits may come as little as two years apart. I guess that some of these schools are in some kind of trouble while others may be trying something experimental.

    I believe that there may be less formal visits and reports in the interim as well, if a school wants to put in a new program or if the accreditor wants to see how a particular practice or change is working out.

    So the schools are pretty much contantly in touch with WASC at some level. It's not a passive relationship.

    Some examples, with last site visit and the next scheduled one:

    CIIS 2001-2006 5 years
    Cal Tech 1998-2008 10 years
    CSUDH 2001-2006 5 years
    CSU Fresno 1994-2004 10 years
    Christian Heritage 2001-2005 4 years
    City of Hope 2001-2005 4 years
    Naval PG School 1999-2009 10 years
    New College 2002-2004 2 years
    SFSU 2001-2011 10 years
    SJSU 1995-2004 9 years
    Stanford 2000-2010 10 years
    UCLA 1998-2008 10 years
     
  8. Casey

    Casey New Member

    Utilize the services of your friend Google

    You argue that several of my remarks are absurd. Don't take my word for it then; just do an internet search. Enter the phrase "Malaysia human rights violations" into Yahoo or Google and see what pops up.

    Anyway.... I'm sure that DETC has made mistakes in the past, just as the regionals have. A friend of mine lives but 30 miles away from what could be the biggest mistake in RA history. Notwithstanding the mistakes, though, all of our institutional accreditors do a great job. DETC's accreditation of CSU is no exception. CSU appears to have formed articulation agreements with several well respected RA universities. If they were as bad as you allege, these articulation agreements would probably not be in place today.

    Should distance education universities be re-evaluated more often? Quite possibly. However, this is not a DETC-only issue, and should not be framed as such. 5-10 years seems to be the norm for both NA and RA agencies.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2004
  9. amused

    amused member

    Re: Utilize the services of your friend Google


    Human rights violations.... excuse me whilst I contain myself from laughing. The American 'anti-terrorist' laws make the Malaysian ISA laws look like Sunday School stuff!

    And human rights abuse...have you seen anything in the US newspapers about certain violations of human rights in Iraq or US prisons in Cuba.

    Oh, and back to education; a quick look at the web and recent articles in the Malaysian newspapers will show you that Malaysia seems to have a very effective accreditation system, and that it actually closes sub-standard schools down!

    Give me a British or Australian degree any day!
     
  10. Casey

    Casey New Member

    Aren't the British and Australians American allies?

    Right, keep dreamin', chap. United States anti-terrorism laws in no way violate the rights of deserving humans. Terrorists are not humans, and thus, do not qualify for human rights protection.

    Likewise, the alleged picture scandal in Iraq is nothing compared to what occured before our acts of liberation. We must do whatever necessary to prevent another 911. If that means taking pictures of naked terrorists, many of whom were trying to kill our troops, then so be it.

    Human rights violations in Asian countries is another story. Innocent women, children, and students (not terrorsists) are unfairly abused every day. Below is a quote from the Struggling for Human Rights in Malaysia website.

    "Malaysian Human Rights Report 2003 ... Human rights violations occur regularly in Malaysia. Despite rapid economic growth, progress on human rights has been slow. We still have arbitrary arrests and detention without trial; abuse of police powers; eviction of urban settlers and plantation workers; denial of the freedom of expression, assembly and association; curtailing of women's, students' and workers' rights, to name but a few."

    You are a typical anti-American. You stick up for the enemies and evildoers, and bash Americans instead. Shame on you.

    Cheerio, you supporter of terrorism. You are either with us or against, and clearly, you are against us. Take that Aussie or British degree and ....

    PS: Malaysian education? Real funny! U.S. education is by far the best in the world. I think most will agree. There is a reason that we are the most powerful nation on earth.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 9, 2004
  11. shirleyngan

    shirleyngan New Member

    Re: Malaysian education? Real funny!

    No terrorism and no discrimination. We are all the same.
     
  12. Anthony Pina

    Anthony Pina Active Member

    Re: Utilize the services of your friend Google

    Oh come now...don't leave us hanging...which institution is the biggest mistake in RA history? Inquiring minds want to know.

    Tony Pina
    Faculty, Cal State U. San Bernardino
    (By the way, your friend doesn't happen to live 30 miles from San Bernardino, right? :) )
     
  13. Casey

    Casey New Member

    :) No... it's an east coast school.
     
  14. Casey

    Casey New Member

    Why is it that I find this hard to believe?

    Something tells me that Malaysian newpapers are not the most reliable sources of information.
     
  15. Anthony Pina

    Anthony Pina Active Member

    I see, you're going to leave us hanging now, aren't you?

    Don't tell me, let me guess:

    Harvard, Yale, Princeton, M.I.T., Johns Hopkins--one of those east coast mills--am I getting warm?

    Tony
     
  16. amused

    amused member

    Re: Why is it that I find this hard to believe?

    What, that a government controlled newspaper would 'boast' that it has closed down sub-standard schools that they had been allowing to exist? Sounds like the sort of self-criticism you would only find in the West.

    But then again, the US government did a great job in covering up the US human rights abuses in Iraq for how long?????
     
  17. shirleyngan

    shirleyngan New Member

    I supposed it is a bit off-topic, "48-72 Hours: Will Cal Coast Become USDoE Recognized?"
     
  18. amused

    amused member

    True. But then again, the whole topic is now irrelevant for at least another 6 months.
     
  19. Peter Chin

    Peter Chin New Member

    Re: Aren't the British and Australians American allies?

    Thanks a lot AMUSED for your fair and unbiased comments and my guess is that you must had visited Malayisa and do have reaonably good knowlede about the country, its education system and its economy one of the top grwoing economies in the world.

    Lets not waste our valuable time on a trash like BUSHo4 who probably lives in somewhere remote area such as viillage in Wyoming and for his limited knowledgs it is the world and the rest people outside US are ignorant, inhuman and terrorist.

    To reason with Bush04 is a total waste of energy and time and I have a policy that not to bring politics, religion and racism in my discussions and therfore I got nothing to say to him and Just hope that God bless him with some brains.

    Peter Chin
     
  20. Bill Grover

    Bill Grover New Member

    Re: Re: Aren't the British and Australians American allies?

    ===



    Wait a minute. Calling someone "trash" here is not a violation of TOS?
     
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