12% of voters are illegal immigrants in Frederick County (Maryland)

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by me again, Mar 21, 2017.

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  1. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator Staff Member

    Yes. OK. I think you're right. I think it's the part about the subpoenas and the search warrants that require probable cause, right? So some evidence has to be presented to take those steps, I think. So that's the reason for the Grand Jury, to hear evidence in order to continue to pursue criminal charges.

    Summary of U.S. Special Prosecutor Rules

    Yes, it is. We were told at the start that he ran a tight ship and there would be no leaks. I guess they were right.

    I think I remember hearing that it had to do with jurisdiction. If charges are brought against someone, which court the case would be heard in. Could that be true? In any case, it sounds like someone who knows the system and how to work it.
     
  2. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    It's not character assassination when people point out failings you really have, and you try to make her this pitiable figure set upon by implacable unreasonable enemies, even though she sought power over others for her entire adult life and simply faced justifiable resistance from those over whom she would rule.

    Maybe, but that's a bit like praising Stalin for being a more prepared leader and better person than Mao. You have this ridiculous image of her as some pleasant selfless person, but she's a ruthless politician who thinks she knows better for people than people do for themselves, and it's no surprise that so many people responded by treating her like the threat she is.

    Not that it matters anymore. She's done.
     
  3. FTFaculty

    FTFaculty Well-Known Member

    I am an attorney, no longer active, just teach the stuff now, but that's right, a grand jury is about finding whether there's probable cause or not, it's not conducted only after such a finding. Also, the deck's stacked heavily in favor of the prosecutor, they're generally the only one speaking unless they bring witnesses (of course entirely for their side). Have sat on one grand jury, and we true billed 97% of the cases brought before us. Some of those cases surely ended up being garbage and later were dropped, but when the prosecutor's giving you his or her spin and you don't even hear from the other side and the standard is basically just 51/49, a lot of cases look really good at the time.
     
  4. FTFaculty

    FTFaculty Well-Known Member

    I know, saw that, and am red-faced. I meant the number of Xs or Ys was different, wasn't implying either of the candidates has Down's Syndrome! My bad.

    No, just that I wouldn't hammer Hillary over something I'd not hammer in a man, such as Trump. This election was the worst devil or the deep blue sea dilemma since Nixon-McGovern.

    What you need to understand--and Hillary supporters have a hard time with this--is that there are millions of people who see in Hillary a person who can be verified to have acted in self-serving ways, completely aside from public personas, a person who has lied with impunity when it served her ambitions. This is part of the public record, it is verifiable, you know it, and the best you can say is essentially "They all do it." But they don't all do it, not every public servant lies as consistently, some people don't lie to look good, lie to cover up crooked dealing. Some people are generally honest and some are not. Lying is not leadership for either a man or a woman. When she says "X" and it's verifiable, then later says "Anti-X", then someone asks her a question about it and she gets that look on her face of the liberal arts professor who's never had a real job chiding a freshman or gets sing songy smug or hissingly chides the reporter who dares to call her on her inconsistencies, that is extremely off-putting, enormously arrogant, and it disgusts most people, as it should. Has nothing to do with gender. She lies and just will not come clean and admit it, she comes up with asinine stuff like "I was on my meds", or "You just misunderstood", or more often, even though there's video evidence to the contrary "I never said that, that's a lie of the extreme right!" I hate that in women, men, white, black, red, blue. Has absolutely nothing to do with an X or Y chromosome. Zero.

    Has to do with her lack of integrity, and it's nonsense to claim that those of us who notice this are applying a double standard. I am not and definitely do not see that behavior as a sign of great leadership in men, it's a sign of a Machiavellian personality, a liar, a person not fit for public service. I'm not the only one who notices this, and it's wrong to label us all as conscious or unconscious misogynists. Her public persona is crafted in large part by her, and until she and her supporters understand this, they'll never get it.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Aug 12, 2017
  5. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member


    I don't know if your practiced eye would agree but I thought this Rockford Files episode well done, way back when.

    "The Rockford Files" So Help Me God (TV Episode 1976) - IMDb
     
  6. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator Staff Member

    The reason that I dislike Hillary goes deeper than this and I believe that that what you've said is a symptom of this. I simply believe that she is not genuine. I believe that she is the manufactured product of thousands and thousands of public opinion surveys, focus groups, action committees and marketing campaigns that have taken place over the last thirty years. She is the product of 100 million compromises, each one designed to buy her a vote. Her hairdo, makeup, clothing, her smile, her walk and all of her gestures are manufactured, synthesized and distilled to create a political candidate that can be elected to the Presidency. In all that there might be some core entity that is Hillary but you never see it and you never will. You might not like Bernie Sanders politics (and that's ok) but I think you'd have to say that he's genuinely what he portrays. If he has far-leftist views he really believes them and doesn't try to disguise them. He is a Democrat/Socialist and he says so, all the while knowing that it's costing him votes from the right. Also, if I can say anything good about Trump it's that he is who he shows himself to be. He's genuine. I may not like his politics or the things he says/does but he is true to himself. Perhaps maddeningly so, but genuine nevertheless.
     
  7. FTFaculty

    FTFaculty Well-Known Member

    My eye isn't that practiced, wasn't a great and distinguished practitioner. Trust me, almost to a man and woman those of us who slid into academia were not great rainmaking attorneys, otherwise we wouldn't have gone into gigs where we make maybe one fifth what the hots shot big law attorneys make. Anyway, I just watched the episode from start to finish, loved it. Loved Rockford Files back in the day, was just a kid, but still think it's one of the greatest TV shows ever. Thanks for the recommendation!
     
  8. FTFaculty

    FTFaculty Well-Known Member

    Bern is like that crank of an uncle a lot of people have who makes an ass of himself at the Thanksgiving or Passover get together, but whom everybody tolerates because he doesn't have a mean bone in his body and is a straight shooter. I'd love to have a beer with Bernie.
     
  9. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    I remember that show when i was a kid. It was a big deal that Rockford had a answering machine back then!
     
  10. FTFaculty

    FTFaculty Well-Known Member

    I don't think we had one til the 80s. Those things were a big deal back then. Had a classmate in law school back in the early 90s who was an agent and had a cell phone that he was always talking on between classes. Thing was as big as a brick, and probably as heavy. First one I'd ever seen.
     
  11. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    When I was a kid, there was a show that had character named Dantana? Anyways, this guy had a HUGE telephone in his car! That was a huge deal back then! This was in the late 70's (or early 80's?) I think.
     
  12. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member


    Vega$ (TV Series 1978
     
  13. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    In high school, I used to dismay my mother by leaving funny answering machine outgoing messages.

    (Fake Arnold Schwarzenegger voice: "Hello! This is Ahnold. I'm not here to answer ze phone right now, but please leave a message, because... I'll be back!")

    (Fake Pee Wee Herman voice: "Hi! This is Pee Wee Herman! I'm at the movies, so leave a message! Hahahahahahaha!''
     
  14. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator Staff Member

    Depending on the authority of the special prosecutor, reasonable suspicion might be all that's required. A VERY low standard.

    Hillary Clinton approved the sale of 20% of our Uranium reserves to Russia, benefiting a group of donors to the Clinton Foundation. That's not smoke, that's fact.

    When can we expect a special prosecutor and/or grand jury to investigate that?
     
  15. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator Staff Member

    Dan Tanna, who drove a sweet 1950's Thunderbird.
     
  16. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    Ha! That's hilarious!
     
  17. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    No, in fact, she didn't. That mine is prohibited from importing uranium, no matter who shareholders are. And that's what we find when looking into any Hillary controversy: big, fat nothing.
     
  18. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator Staff Member

    Well, the Special Prosecutor is appointed by the Attorney General, currently a guy named Sessions. You would guess that if there were any real evidence this would have already have been done.
     
  19. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member


    Mueller was appointed by Rosenstein.
     
  20. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator Staff Member

    You're correct. Sounds like you've been doing some homework.
     

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