U of Phoenix stuck it to me

IMHO, We as distant ed folks are a small part of a multi-faceted society bulging at the seams with college grads and brick and mortar institutions competing in degree one-upsmanship, with that said, many Joe's outside of distant ed circles view UOP smacking of a corporation generating profits by spawning Bachelor's/Masters graduates. With this lurking in the background, I simply would not want an individual in Human Resources sublimely provoking me to anger by asking about the course content, it simply is not a yoke I care to carry around.
UOP nevertheless is good school, I feel sure of that, but it is simply the image others perceive that gives heavy weight to degree utility. As to degree availability, many B&M schools offer the same degrees in a completely online format at a considerably less rates than UOP and without the looming online shadow. Until the world changes about distant ed (remarkable progress in that arena!) most people (college graduates) polled and being HONEST would admit to wanting their hard earned degree to reflect a firmly based B&M institution. Unless suffering from euphoric giddyness we must admit it is a competetive world out there and degree "snobbery" reigns supreme!

Here is a classic example, I attend a grad school in the south (not naming the school) it is a highly competitive environment smacking of a school who fancies itself as some kind of Southern Ivy league institution. I, just the other day approached my academic advisor about taking some grad classes online for the summer with FHSU and transfering the allowed 6 hours over, well he saw the syallbus, knew of FHSU...he seemed ok until he realized it was an online format, he quickly said I need to see the graduate office about that! I contacted the graduate office, they said your advisior makes that call.....I pushed it no further! I respect the guy, he is tuff but fair and absolutely brilliant but still it is reality, online is, but not always perceived differently. Heck I for one enjoy the online format, outside of the homerun this college name envokes, I would have gladly gone to FHSU, academically I have compared the two syallbi, both offer substantial rigor...and hell FHSU is well half the price! Sorry for any past, present or future transgressions!
best,
Gavin
PS, sorry armywife for burglarizing your thread but I still remain adamant about UOP's prices and their lack of concern for your plight until a boiling caludron erupted!

 

A genuine question; here's an honest -no BS- answer. I would give them serious consideration. In fact, I was considering them for my MBA but decided to attend a local school (Our Lady of the Lake). My finalists included:

• University of Phoenix. Pro’s: I know the system, is going for professional accreditation, very flexible schedule; Con’s: price, no name recognition locally, limited recruiting/networking opportunities.
• Touro. Pro’s: price, flexible schedule; Con’s: accreditation woes, no name recognition locally, and I don’t like the name either.
• Amberton. Pro’s: price; Con’s: don’t know of anybody attending, they are in near Dallas… I am in Houston.
• University of Houston. Pro’s: local name recognition, AACSB; Con’s: program duration, inconvenient class schedule.
• OLLU. Pro’s: B&M, recruiting/networking opportunities, professional accreditation, program duration, opportunity to travel abroad and earn credit; Con’s: not the same name recognition as UH, UT, Texas A&M or Rice, but known locally.

So there you have it… I did give UoP serious consideration but simply found what I think is a better option (for my needs this time). I have never said that UoP is always the best option, but I disagree when people refer to it as a “poor” choice. I gave consideration to at least a dozen other schools.

In 1999, when I first enrolled at Phoenix (for my bachelor's), the list was definitively shorter... and UoP had the least cons. DL offerings were less back then and I could not attend a B&M school due to a hectic schedule.

I rather not mention names; this person is no longer teaching for IC. Besides, you're in TB and this person never worked at that location. If you are really, really interested, send me a PM (as long as you give your Police Officer word of not posting his name).

I'll send you a PM next time I'm in Tampa... seriously.

 

Hi Alex

Again, I think we are in a situation where we just have to agree to disagree. I think we are probably both right for the most part. I understand you had a positive experience and have a lot of pride in your alma mater. At the same time, I think you are dismissing others experience way too easily. We have report after report of people who were very dissatisfied with the quality, pricing and service of UofP. Dismissing these becasue they come from a message board is ill-considered. Whether from a message board or other source they are valid experiences. As for accreditation, I believe you are correct that it provides a minimal standard. For renewal, I think that bar is very low. Much lower than I would consider as a minimum and nowhere near what I actually would want in a school. All of this is not to say that UofP can't be a good choice in isolated instances, just that most can find much better choices at much lower costs.

 

Re: Re: Hmm...

Hi David

I agree with both you and Adrienne. It is not simply a matter of for profits vs. not for profits. Both have a range of schools of varying quality.

 

Dave,

I guess we'll leave it a that then...

Perhaps I'm too naive and inexperienced with the system, but I like to think that RA is more than a rubber stamp...

 

Contact Appolo

I would agree with this approach. Remember Apollo Group is a PUBLLICLY TRADED company. When I have had problems with publically traded companies I often find that the best approach is contacting the "Investor Relations" department or the CEO's office (You'll end up speaking to some assistant) Nothing like rattling the trees from the TOP down.

I you contact them and get nowhere, consider contacting CNBC - they might be interested as this kind of behavior could have a material impact on their business and future profits. Nothing like sicking the financial media on them.

Worst case senaria - and I have used this threat with seveal companies - Inform them if they don't address the problem, you will buy 1 share of the stock and bring it up at the next shareholders meeting. THAT WOULD MAKE CNBC news!

 

Re: Contact Appolo

Your arrest would make the news?

Threats are rarely a good idea. The threat of one share makes you the crank of the day but should you present a meaningful threat then you may get a legal education you hadn't counted on.

 

Alex,

I too am completed satisfied with the UOP. I completed a Masters of Art Degree in Organizational Management on 14 Apr 04 and received my diploma and transcripts one week later on 30 Apr 04. The material was challenging and relevant.

I had zero problems from instructors, and the many academic and financial advisors that I had did a good job. I would not expect them to be experts in anything since they are entry level postions. It is probably the same way in a lot of schools. I agree that the experience that Holly went through might be an exception.

I know that when I was on active duty in the Navy, I worked as an educational service officer at several commands. I was the liasion between the commands that I supported and the local colleges and universities that offered courses on base. At that time, it was all brick and mortar. However, the academic advisors where entry level positions that had little or no training. While I am not defending the actions of the academic advisor that Holly had to deal with, it does illustrate that a lot of colleges and universities hire people that might be lacking in experience, education, or expertise.

Anyone that thinks that they are dealing with an expert is mistaken.

When I started the pursuit of a Masters Degree about two years ago, I was working for a large consulting company, Booz, Allen and Hamilton. They provided readily accepted degrees from UOP and provided tuition assistance. I now work for the Department of the Navy as a civilian employee and they also readily accept UOP degrees. And, the military services provide tuition assistance for UOP degrees and the Veterans Administration has approved UOP for GI Bill benefits.

I also do not believe that regionally accrediation is a rubber stamp. If it is than a lot of other schools are probably in trouble with quality and service. And, if the minimum standards are not good enough, what is good enough?

Now I agree that UOP is aggresssive in marketing. In my opinion, too agressive and their price is fairly high. But I do not believe that the UOP is inferior to every college or university that is listed in the database of this website. I do not consider myself an expert in distance learning or education in particular. But, I do have over 26 years of active duty experience in dealing with service members and their families pursuing educational opportunities in the military. And, I can tell you that UOP is just as good or better than the universities that are offering courses on bases around the world which includes the University of Maryland - University College, Troy State, City College of Chicago, Touro, George Mason, etc.

I know that everyone has an opinion about UOP. But, some of the people expresssing their opinions are not based on infromed and substantiated facts.

All the best,

Fred

 

Hmmmm...Fred it seems like you are minimizing Holly and other's experiences. Short of a well-constructed and detailed survey, it seems like your opinion is based on incomplete and inaccurate data and analysis. I think a more accurate view is that UofP definately has many satisfied students that feel what they received is equal to other large schools. At the same time, there is a quite large group of students that are very dissatisfied with UofP's quality, price and service. Many of these issues have been detailed thoroughly right here at degreeinfo. It is serious enough that the major discussion board on DL is unwilling to take UofP's money until they correct these issues. Certainly, UofP isn't alone in having these issues. AIU clearly has similar issues where the system is much more important than the student and lack of focus on quality and the customer. Clearly, RA provides a very basic minimum. Just because a school meets the minimum does not mean it is a good choice for anyone.

 

Dave,

I am not minimizing Holly's experience. I think that the academic counselor that she had did a bad job. Unfortunately, in my opinion, I think that with over 200,00 students, there will be problems with entry level employees not providing good customer service at any university and there probably is. I do not substantiated facts to back this up.

My analysis is based upon the fact that I attended UOP Online for 23 consecutive months, and recieved effective and efficient support and customer service in all areas. Futhermore, I worked as an educational services on and off for almost 26 years in the Navy. During my time as an educational services officer, I observed that entry level academic and financial counselors at the brick and mortar colleges and universities that offered courses often provided inaccurate information to service members and their families. It is not an excuse for poor service. However, it does illustrate the fact that not just the UOP has problems with academic and financial counselors and other entry level employees. I even experienced some problems personally myself.

For example, I was attending the University of Maryland - University of College (UMUC) when I was on active duty in the Navy. I was enrolled in a class that I had to drop because of my military job or family emergency. I do not remember the exact details. However, several years laters, when I attempted to enroll in my additional classes after a fairly long break, the counselor informed me that my transcripts showed that I withdrew without a reason and the transcripts reflected an F. I had to take this issue up the "food chain" to a rather high level official within the UMUC before they changed the transcripts to reflect a withdraw because of family emergency or military commitment.

Now, I am not defending the actions of the academic counselor that Holly dealt with. If what Holly said is true, then UOP should have a method to deal with this type of poor job performance. But, my example with the UMUC does clearly show that other universities have problems with entry level academic counselors. Furthermore, they are not the final word on most issues that Holly experienced with the UOP Online and I experienced with UMUC.

Finally, I do not believe for a moment that the UOP is inferior to every single university that is listed in the databases for degreeinfo.com. I would classify this type of bias as inaccurate analysis based upon a few people that post here.

Fred

 

DaveHayden wrote:

I think a well-constructed and detailed survey is needed before EITHER side can say what an "accurate" view of UofP is with any authority. Just as an off-topic data point, when I was first looking at law schools, I checked out ePinions, and guess who the lowest-rated law school in CA was -- Stanford. Why? Because ALL of the opinions on the site were from disgruntled students. Clearly, nobody in their right mind would NOT consider Standford because of the opinions on this particular website, but I think it illustrates two things: anecdotal evidence is unreliable (and that's all you have until the detailed survey is done), and complainers are more likely to be vocal than people who are satisfied. We don't talk about all of the drivers during our commute who stayed in their own lanes and signaled for lane changes; we complain about the one SOB who cut us off!

 

Hi Richard

I agree. Short of the mentioned survey there is no way to come to an objective conclusion. I believe, however, both subjective views are true. It is clear that UofP has satisfied and disatisfied customers. While it is impossible to know percentages of each, it is clear there is a significant percentage that are disatisfied. With the rate UofP charges I really believe their goal should be to create as near to 100% satisfaction as possible. It is clear that their bureacracy is built to ignore those people until they hear the word "law suit". If I were a prospective student, that kind of response would be completely unacceptable. I think UofP has a lot of potential, but it has to want to make progress and be interested in more than a short-term perspective.

 

I haven't made up my mind about the UoP.

 

Holly,

I just wanted to let you know that I had a similar experience but from the teacher end at UoP. It was for a final master's project. Due to the computer tracking one of my best students in the class was forced into a W grade. I disagreed with the way the policy was being enforced and actually would not enter a grade hoping the university would be willing to work this out. They didn't and I had to advise the student to see their advisor. An appeal was filed, I supported the appeal, and a grade was given without a course repeat and the student graduated.

This was the last course I taught for UoP as I thought the way the policy was enforced was not well done. My last conversation with UoP on the matter was in July of 2001 while I was on vacation in NYC. As such, your situation is something that has probably been going on for some time. Best wishes towards a successful resolution.

John

 

Is anyone else having difficulty reading, opening or finding threads at DegreeInfo.com?

 

I cannot find a thread opened by "dsmall" yesterday. I assume it was deleted by the moderator.

 

At the prices UoP charges, they should send out someone to give you a personal massage once a week. While it is certainly good from a stockholder standpoint to maximize profits, one has to wonder if such apparently shoddy treatment of customers could be counterproductive in the long run.

 

Bruce, thanks for the info. I just made the update.

 

Jonathan

If you check out the links on your master of liberal arts etc page, you will find that half of them don't work anymore. If you have time, updates would be nice.

Thanks

 

Unless I've missed something, the last post on your UoP issue is 5/4. Any resolution?