The Nixon gambit?

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by nosborne48, Jan 9, 2021 at 9:58 PM.

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  1. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    This is not really a political discussion, either. Whether to charge Trump should have nothing to do with politics. We're talking about serious, very serious, felony crimes of violence resulting in death.
     
  2. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

  3. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I knew it would be a waste of time since it's Mark Levin, but I gave it fifteen seconds. Sure enough he starts out with a theatrical declaration of martyrdom and self-aggrandizement. Give me a break.
     
  4. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    The more I thought about it (obsessed about it?) the more convinced I've become that Trump could face one or more capital charges. Then I realized that the reason Trump doesn't resign and let Pence pardon him could well be that Pence refuses to go along. The President, and therefore the President's armed mob, announced that Pence was a traitor to the movement. Mob tweets state that Pence was a specific and high priority target for capture or killing. In this scenario, Trump has no way out. I wonder if some prosecutor with jurisdiction hasn't already obtained a sealed warrant and is just waiting for 12:01 pm January 20 to arrest ex-President Trump wherever he may be found.
     
  5. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    According to the U.S. Constitution, "Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying War against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort." There's no minimum size of war nor need the war be successful.
     
  6. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Oh, yes...treason is a capital charge.
     
  7. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Thanks for saving me 15 seconds. :)
     
  8. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    Turbulent times indeed.
    As non law professional I can't add anything to the legalities of the discussion.
    But I did read other opinions,
    BTW
    Are we under a state of emergency since 2018 which gives the president many powers to act.
    Again, I don't support or defend acts of Jan 6th.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2021 at 5:48 PM
  9. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    I think Dershowitz is wrong yet again. I have elsewhere questioned his competence in constitutional questions. I think his professional judgment is a bit clouded by his incandescent support for Netanyahu and Greater Israel. But that's just one lawyer disagreeing with another and I'm no constitutional scholar either.
     
  10. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Well here, look at it this way. One of the specified consequences of impeachment and conviction is a lifetime bar on holding federal office. If Dershowitz is right, Trump could avoid that consequence merely by resigning prior to the trial in the Senate. Well, no defendant should be able to deprive a tribunal of jurisdiction once jurisdiction is established by taking any unilateral action. In courts of law, there is a doctrine of mootness but mootness needn't necessarily result in dismissal.
     
  11. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    There is nothing about the Pandemic that would authorize a President to launch a violent attack on the joint Houses of Congress to keep them from doing their work. That's nonsense.
     
  12. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I'm reminded of how mob bosses on the phone with their subordinates authorizing criminal activity would end with "...but keep it legit" in case they were being wiretapped.
     
  13. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    I'm not convinced that president launched or ordered any of the violent attack. If anything I heard the opposite.
    I understand the tension and the possibilities for violence it was volatile and also not ruling out some assistance from non conservatives Trump supporters and Antifa.
    Why the right is so enraged? Mostly because of what perceived as Democrat lead Marxist revolution.
    many conservatives think that they are are in a battle for our republic against elites that are attempting the very coup that they are accusing Trump of doing.

    Now the state of emergency of 2018 is not about pandemic. I don't know legality of this just posting as it is still active.
    Executive Order on Imposing Certain Sanctions in the Event of Foreign Interference in a United States Election
    https://www.whitehouse.gov/presidential-actions/executive-order-imposing-certain-sanctions-event-foreign-interference-united-states-election/
     
  14. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    As to what Trump ordered or did not order, that will be for a trial jury to decide.
     
  15. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    I think the new administration has a golden opportunity to bridge the divide.
    I hope that Biden will find a way to bridge the divide and heal the country.
    This presents a great opportunity to go in to history as great President.
    A lot of challenges a had.
    The rocket man is preparing for his biggest extortion yet, he waved to put the US on it knees saying US is their biggest enemy.
    Pandemic is out of control.
    Economy and small business suffering just to name a few.
     
    Last edited: Jan 11, 2021 at 11:22 PM
  16. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    Some compare what you are saying more to the Georgia SA phone call.
    But the speech of the president on 01/06 is all public info, I didn't hear it entirely but bits here and there and I didn't hear any such incitement to violence.
    Lack of evidence that Trump’s speech incited violence will be a ‘challenge’ for Dem's.
     
  17. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    I admit I'm not exactly interested in "healing" or "bridging the divide" just yet. I want these criminals hunted down, charged, convicted, and jailed first.
     
  18. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    From what I see and read in the news this is what is happening now. And all sides what justice served.
    The people are being arrested and charged?
    What I posted is not something that president can magically do overnight.
    Once he is in the office the type of policies and actions will enable the healing or increase the divide.
     
  19. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    That, Lerner, is the truest thing you've ever posted, I'm afraid.
     
  20. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Messages were sent out around the country telling his supporters to come to Washington DC on January 6 to "stop the steal", save democracy, fight back, we won this election by a landslide you know it everyone knows it. So people did. They showed up with their guns, bombs and zipties to restrain the hands of their intended kidnap victims. They were wearing their Auschwitz shirts and their 6MWE shirts (6 Million Wasn't Enough, referring to jews killed in the holocaust ). They are told to fight to stop the steal. Somehow this didn't seem to heal the divide in our country.
     

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