Sexual assault claim leaves Kavanaugh nomination in limbo

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by Abner, Sep 15, 2018.

  1. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

  2. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member

    You would convict someone without any supporting evidence and a wealth of contradicting evidence.
  3. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    We already have one admitted sexual predator in the off of POTUS, it figure he would back another one in SCOTUS! Bunch of band of sickos!
  4. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

    I actually think is more than a Duh. Was she looking for justice, or was she was looking to stop him from becoming a Justice, two different things? To me, it seems hypocritical not to pursue the matter in privacy using professional law enforcement agencies when you already took the biggest stage in a political melee. I refused to tie my belief system and conscience to politics. It is just weird when I see learned people who are not politician doing it. For my situation, you have no idea.
  5. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Convict to not serve on Supreme Court? In this case, we're all serving life sentence here.
    And oh btw, "due process" presupposes LE and prosecution are willing and allowed to do their jobs. It's not something sex crime victims are guaranteed to have. Stanford swimmer was caught raping someone, eyewitnesses and all, and still got a slap on the wrist. How many witnesses was FBI allowed to interview during the so called 'investigation' last week?
  6. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    The FBI supposed investigation last week was a total farce. They did not interview all witnesses, and
    Yeah, that so called "investigation" was a joke. Many potential witnnesses were not interviewed. It was all a sham!
  7. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    No, I have no idea about your situation - and I don't try to school you on how to "fight for justice".
    I don't see how preventing a predator from having a say on laws for an entire nation is unjust. May not be your idea of "justice", but she certainly thought it was legitimate motivation. She wanted to stay anonymous BTW.
  8. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member

    The FBI interviewed the people relevant to the charge. Again, the accuser's ostensible witnesses acknowledged knowing nothing of any such party.
  9. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    I graduated HS more than a decade after 1983, drank almost no beer, and was a true nerd - been to very few parties (went to a STEM-focused commuter HS that had very few parties to begin with). I would not confirm any details on any party I might have attended under oath. No one tried to rape me, see. But it's symptomatic seeing your side insist anything was "contradicted", against evidence and common sense. Even DL forum participants who have nothing to gain from this charade. That's why I believe Dr. Ford's account over Kava defenders.
  10. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member

    You might be the least logical CompSci Ph.D. evah.

    My first year of high school was at Brooklyn Technical High School but I voluntarily left at the end of that year. Big deal.

    No one tried to rape Blasey Ford, not even by her account. Stop making shit up.

    I'm not a 'side' but an individual, Mr. atavistic, Old World, collectivist, groupthink fella.

    Nothing could have been '""contradicted", against evidence" as there was no evidence.
  11. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    Dr. Ford's account sounded like attempted rape to me.
  12. heirophant

    heirophant Well-Known Member

    I attended lots of alcohol and drug fueled parties in the early 1970's and can't recall most of them specifically. I couldn't say whether I was at a particular party on a particular evening. I certainly couldn't testify as to who else was there.

    I wonder if Ms. Ford can either. By all accounts she liked to drink to excess and sometimes passed out entirely. I'm sure that some mornings she woke up hung over, feeling like shit, with little recollection of what had happened the night before or what she had done.

    It isn't clear that anyone tried to rape Ms. Ford either. While I don't specifically recall many of the parties I attended, I'm pretty sure that I would recall if any of my friends had told me that she had been raped. (Never happened.) That's something that would stick in your mind

    Ms. Ford's "witnesses" didn't corroborate her account. So claims that she had witnesses that would back up her allegations seems to have been contradicted.

    So why are you continuing with it???

    It doesn't matter what you believe. You are a Ukrainian. You live in Canada. Is it any of your business who is on the US Supreme Court??

    You seem awfully wound-up about US politics for some reason. Why is that?

    I don't follow Ukrainian domestic politics and don't have any strong opinions about it. I do follow Canadian politics a little, but I've never tried to lecture Canadians on the subject or cast any grand moral judgments about which Canadians are good and which are evil. Shaping the Canadian future is a matter for Canadians to work out for themselves.
    Last edited: Oct 10, 2018
  13. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member

    What you chose to have it sound like is of no relevance.
  14. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

    With due respect, I think you are being disingenuous by calling Kavanaugh a predator. I was one of those people who thought there should have been an FBI or DA investigation. After the FBI investigation, I believe Kavanaugh version. However, I am still not satisfied. There should be a more thorough investigation. This position is not about defending Kavanuaht. It is about coming as close to the truth as possible. Bill Crosby got what was coming to him done by independent professional investigators. I have daughters, sons, grands - I will choose to believe them base on veracity, not politics. The Democrats are going to have their turn to appoint Justices. Should I just believe any allegation against them (and there will be) because I may lean right? Truthfully, if I start becoming that person, then I am going to stop pursuing education. I will take a shopping cart and go live on the street.
  15. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    Sure it matters in the schoool of publk
    It's relevant to me and many others.
  16. Phdtobe

    Phdtobe Well-Known Member

    A CNN headlines

    Chief Justice Roberts transfers Kavanaugh misconduct complaints to 10th Circuit. Good for him. (Did not read the story)

    Politics should never determine what you consider right or wrong, if so then we are just like puppets without free will.
  17. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    This comment right there speaks for itself. Nice going bro.

    First, I believe you have philosophy background, right? So you should know what ad hominem is.

    Second, yah, I follow US politics. Because it's the United States of America, bro. Also, I'm a Florida State alumnus with many, many friends and family who are US citizens.
    Of course you don't follow internal politics in some Eastern European land (that is I believe officially the poorest country in Europe; both Moldova and Belarus are less poor). Or in a sleepy backwater of the former British Empire, for that matter. I bet hardly anyone Stateside followed NAFTA negotiations - it was HUGE in Canada. Same with Ukraine - it is a country at war, and the US is its only reliable ally (even under Trump, his many Chicken Kiev moments notwithstanding). Before Trump, Joe Biden practically co-piloted the Ukrainian state, and did far better job than even our "reformist, pro-Western" crooked crooks in power. In general, are you kidding me? It's the only sane superpower in the world!

    Also, your guy quarreled with the brightest political star in Canada and fellow Toronto Ukie, Chrystia Freeland.
  18. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    From Dr. Ford's perspective? OK, pick your own word.
  19. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member

    I do and that ain't it. There was no avoidance in heirophant's point-by-point reply, one point being you using yourself as argument.
  20. heirophant

    heirophant Well-Known Member

    I'm not your "brother".

    The point is that Ms. Ford is said to have drunk to excess at the time these parties took place, and likely doesn't have a clear recollection of some of them. Her whole allegation is based on her memory and her memory might not be all that reliable.

    She admits herself that she didn't tall anyone about this alleged sexual assault until 2012, when she was in "psychotherapy". Her former boyfriend who lived with her for years says that she never mentioned having been sexually assaulted. Nor did she display any of the psychological peculiarities that she says are the result of that alleged assault, such as fear of enclosed spaces. She didn't name the alleged assailant during psychotherapy either, that seems to have only came after President Trump had named Judge Kavanaugh as his Supreme Court pick. So it looks like this whole thing is fairly recent. It's possible that it's a "recovered memory" and as unreliable as those often are. It's also possible that it's all just a politically motivated fantasy. Or maybe it really happened, just as she says.

    Given that none of us can really know, and given the over-heated political context, I choose to assign Ms. Ford's allegation a low credibility weight in my own mind and concentrate instead on Justice Kavanaugh's judicial philosophy (which I agree with) and his exemplary record on the bench. I think that he will be an excellent addition to the Supreme Court. (The Justice he's replacing, Anthony Kennedy thinks so too.)

    You weren't making any sort of logical argument. You merely posted your opinion about what you personally believe about Justice Kavanaugh. I expressed my opinion that US domestic politics are aren't really any of your concern.

    Once again, I'm not your "brother".

    You're a foreign student who once lived in the US for a few years. Having been a foreign student in this country doesn't make you an honorary US citizen, it doesn't give you greater expertise in US domestic politics than Americans and it doesn't really make American domestic and partisan politics any of your business. You're just cheering for a chosen side as if it was a sports team.

    My point is that the future of Ukraine is for Ukrainians to decide. If that isn't so, then what's wrong with Putin deciding Ukraine's future? How can we insist on national sovereignty while simultaneously denying it? The future direction of Canada is a matter for Canadians to decide. Not Americans in the US (or Russians, or Chinese, or anyone else besides Canadians). And equally, the domestic politics of the United States are a matter for Americans, and Americans alone. Not Ukrainians living in Canada.

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