Discussion in 'Online & DL Teaching' started by DLAdvocate, Jun 14, 2005.
A 1.4% increase in doctoral degrees is "churning them out like pancakes"?
I think more people are going for them, but only a few more are actually completing their program.
We discussed this a while back and we backed it up with statistics. Yes, overall, PhDs are not growing that much but this is not the case for business doctorates from for profits that seem to be granted at a higher rate. Most people I see in the online teaching world, come from for profit schools.
If interested in stats, you can do a seach in the forum.
Mark Fiegener's research indicates that the aggregate number of all awarded doctorates increased 1.4% from 2007 to 2008. Within that aggregate number, the awarding of doctorates in business administration decreased from 1506 to 1437. An increase or decrease in business doctorates still falls within that 1.4% aggregate increase.
Mark K. Fiegener's most recent research is from 2008. Do you have anything newer?
In the humanities only around 1/2 complete anyway; however, there have been record numbers of people applying for doctorate programs because of the economic downturn.
"Hey Maud, I lost my job that I have 10 years of experience and good pay at, I can't get a new one."
"Well Jim, there is always grad school, you know those professors drive nice cars and think how cool having the title of doctor is!"
"That is a great idea Maud, I can't wait to get a PhD in that subject I really liked and got that awesome B+ in! I know I can do that job, what do they do, talk for like an hour a week or something?"
"Yeah Jim, that sounds about right, I am sure you will get a job in no time with that degree!"
Danielle Babbs claims that she makes more than 175K with her PhD from Capella teaching online classes. This is the kind of media that drives people to do online PhDs in massive amounts.
In my best moments, I was able to clear 70K teaching online and working almost 70 hrs a week, I really don't know how credible is to make 175K when each class pays around 2K. This means about 85 classes in a year or about 16 class per every 6 to 8 week term.
I know some people who have taken classes from Dr. Babbs. From what they told me, the 175K is entirely possible because she can teach a ton of courses when she does not spend any time in them.
Where is the "like" button? lol
Dr Babbs can be using her reputation to get as many courses as possible and then have a PhD from IIT in India doing her courses for half the pay she is getting.
The other issue is that I doubt that there are 80 online courses available for every PhD that graduates from Capella. The business model that she is selling is not sustainable. The bubble is about burst if it has not burst already.
Agreed. I hit nearly 100K two years ago working like a dog for several schools while holding a full time job and wrapping up my Doctorate. I work at a few great schools that pay well above the average and I honestly do not see how I could have earned any more than I was. I felt spread entirely too thin and I believe that my attention to my classes suffered as a result. Since then I have dropped a few schools and other things off my plate and now I am at a much more manageable level. 175K would be possible if every class paid 5k and required little in the way of extra work on the faculty's part, but we all know that is not the case at the schools we are talking about here.
I teach somewhat of the class for all the schools I teach for which means I can move pretty quickly. Even with that on my side there is no way I could handle the work load to hit $175K. Perhaps $100K if I did it full time and did nothing else but $175K does not seem possible without outsourcing some work or being a "paper grading / 'good job' posting" teacher.
There are more ways than 'teaching classes' to make money teaching online. Being a faculty mentor, doing course development and being a lead can all contribute to the pay. It doesn't necessarily require 80 or more classes per year to make that much money. But even if it did, with the right efficiency and the right mindset and concern over quality, it is doable. There are many incredibly dedicated instructors that emphasize quality and student-centered feedback, while maintaining a high volume of classes.
On a side note, a lot of professors on her Yahoo & FB groups admit to making even more than she does:
Online Teaching Social Media - Social Media Tools for Online Educators and Professors
She's created a viral doc that outlines the pros/cons of working at different online institutions..including information on pay. It's worth a look (check the March 2012 newsletter): Online Teaching Newsletter Archives
There are more ways than 'teaching classes' to make money teaching online. Being a faculty mentor, doing course development, and being a lead can all contribute to the pay. It doesn't necessarily require 80 or more classes per year to make this much money. But even if it did, with the right efficiency and the right mindset and concern over quality, it is doable. There are many incredibly dedicated instructors that emphasize quality and student-centered feedback, while maintaining a high volume of classes.
On a side note, there are a lot of professors on Dr. Babbs' Yahoo and FB groups that claim they make more money than she does Online Teaching Social Media - Social Media Tools for Online Educators and Professors. She's also created a viral doc outlining the pros/cons of working at different online institutions..including information on pay. Check out the March 2012 newsletter: Online Teaching Newsletter Archives.
I have done all this as well. Course development pays about 5K at the major online schools and being a lead is not much worth it as you have a to fill up endless reports and call faculty for about 300 bucks a course per term. You are lucky if you get one course development a year as this is competitive and requires a bidding process among many competitors.
Of course, you can write a book and organize seminars and sell the model to a lot of people that buy the idea and then you can easily reach the 200K.
The model sold is also not sustainable, it is impossible to have the 50 to 80 courses plus course development etc for all the people that graduate from Capella, NCU, Walden, etc.
A more realistic model is to do a doctorate from a reputable school that is AACSB accredited and become faculty at a good school for 120K to start. If you do consulting this can go to 150 to 200K easily.
The challenges are that you cannot get admission so easily to an AACSB accredited doctorate, it is not so easy to finish an AACSB accredited doctorate and it is not so easy to publish in top journals.
There is no free lunch, high salaries require a lot of effort and there are no shortcuts for this.
A realistic goal for people with low profile online doctorates doing online adjuncting as a career is about 70-90K a year and this assuming that you are willing to work 60 to 80 hrs a week. This is also becoming harder as more people are graduating from the for profits and willing to work for less teaching online.
May I ask if there is anyone who teaches at University of Maryland Europe and that would not mind answering a few questions?
Consider doing a search on Google or LinkedIn, then reach out to people that way. You're much more likely to find someone.
Separate names with a comma.