My Own Timebomb (sort of)

Re: Re: Re: Re: One last RA thought...

Thanks Rich I am still trying to figure all of this out.

 

AMU

James,

Good luck at AMU. I have only good things to say about my own experience with AMU.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: One last RA thought...

I happy that you are no longer mad at anybody. I was only trying to advise you to avoid degrees that would only meet your past needs and pursue only degrees that will meet both your present and future needs.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: One last RA thought...

Why would someone earn a degree to meet the "past" needs?

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: One last RA thought...

I believe the English call it sheer bloody-mindedness.



Cordially,
Richard Kanarek
37 1/2 and considering a BSEE.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: One last RA thought...

The answer is simple. In the case of James Lyons, an unaccredited degree did not meet his past needs but a degree from a DETC accredited school obviously could have met his past needs. If he intends to pursue a graduate degree, a degree from a DETC accredited school may not meet his future needs. My advice is that people should avoid degrees that only meet their past needs. They should rather pursue degrees that meet their present and future needs. James should not pursue a degree from a DETC accredited school only because such a degree could have helped him secure an open position in his company in the past. Degrees from DETC schools have better recognition than degrees from unaccredited schools but their utility is by far less than the utility of RA degrees. Ask me again Russ.

 

As I understand it, as it is written in the World According to Bear, non-accredited schools came into being because there were few if any accredited D/L options. Thus, the choice was between a CCU degree and no degree at all.

In most fields of human knowlege, this appears to be no longer the case. The choices include accredited, D/L programs at least through the Master's degree and through the Ph.D. with short residency required. Under those circumstances, I find it hard to understand why anyone would deliberately choose to work for, and pay for, an inferior credential.

However, there remain popular areas of study where there are STILL no accredited D/L programs, and where maybe there SHOULD be. In my own field, law, there are NO accredited D/L J.D. programs (accredited in this case means ABA), maybe ONE U.S. D/L LLM program and NO D/L J.S.D. programs. If a law student wants to engage in academic research or acquire a basic professional education without residence, the only options are state-approved and unaccredited.

The same thing is true in engineering at the B.S. level. Here again, the choice might well be K-W or nothing (accreditation being defined as ABET).

I dunno. The situation is as much political, I suspect, as it is technical and until the vested interests are overcome, there will be a place for the unaccredited degree.

Nosborne, JD

 

Credentials & Certifications

Whoa, you're certified to use Powerpoint?

I will be using it for the first time tomorrow morning.

 

does detc get you there?

There have been many postings questioning whether a detc degree has the utility of a degree from a regionally accredited colege/university. I think Rich Douglas found courses did not necessarily routinely transfer from a detc school to a regionally accredited school.
So I would not only check with my company, but also with other companies I might work for and colleges where I might someday seek a masters degree fully accept people with detc degrees. Maybe AMU does the job for you. Maybe it does part of the job. Maybe it does none of the job.
I'm curious why the company would simply reject CCU (unless it they are in Oreg) but willing accept a detc school? Detc has a different accreditor than the reginally accredited colleges/universities. Does the company have other AMU graduates?
Several posters have pointed out legimate methods of earning college credit including the "credit for life experience" sometimes referred to as portfolio. In this process one writes a "portfolio". For each class you want credit for life experience you demonstrate competencies, knowledge, abilty, etc. It is not necessarily an easy process. But since you have the combination of work experience and some training, you have the potential of earning a great deal of credit for life experience.
The other option mentioned was testing through programs recognized almost everywhere for offering standardized tests in a variety of subjects. CLEP/Dantes/ Excelsior/TESC all offer subject tests. I think a poster mentioned that AMU does accept/recognize Clep/Dantes for college credit in specific courses. Some colleges allow you to "challenge" a course if you feel you know it. The college then offers you an examination which is usually an extensive final exam. If you pass you get the credit. Some form of testing out is at many colleges. My daughter tested out of 2 courses in her Bachelors degree program at U. VT. You might try to test out of courses at AMU which are repeats of CCU. Or try to get them through "credit for life experience".
In short, if AMU meets all your needs, then make the most of your prior knowledge, experience, and savy by succeeding in the program as quickly and cheaply as possible.
All the best!

 

Re: does detc get you there?

There have been many postings questioning whether a detc degree has the utility of a degree from a regionally accredited colege/university. I think Rich Douglas found courses did not necessarily routinely transfer from a detc school to a regionally accredited school.

Actually, John Bear did wiith his survey of AACRAO members.


I'm curious why the company would simply reject CCU (unless it they are in Oreg) but willing accept a detc school?


Probably because DETC-accredited schools are accredited by a recognized accreditor while CCU is not. We're not sure how acceptable DETC accreditation is in the workplace, but it does answer the question, "Is it accredited?" CCU does not.

 

Has there been any published studies on the acceptability of:

- Degrees from DETC schools
- Degrees from CA State Approved schools

in:
- The workplace
- Academia (for DETC transfers, and perhaps for CA State Approved terminal degrees)


If so ... where could one find this document (or documents if multiple folks pursued this endeavor) ... I would be interested to read it.

 

Are AMU credits accepted at

AIU - Yes
Roosevelt University - Yes
Bradley - Yes
Strayer - Yes

All above are RA.

Is K-W , CCU accepted at the above?
No.


Keep in mind that any university can accept or reject
credits from another institution rather RA, DETC or
Mail order at their will. It all depends if they feel it
fits into your studies at their institution.

In short, show me the money!!! Remember many cannot pay for those lavish grounds and take care of their sports stars without your cash. No Virginia, there is NOT a Santa Claus.

Sorry, but as long as I see some not so wonderful schools
( in my humble opinion ), granted RA status I will continue to
question the process.

 

Re: Are AMU credits accepted at

You bring up a good point.

Charter Oaks rejected many credits of mine from a traditional NJ State College. (RA of course). Regents accepted all these credits. So ... RA wasn't the only factor in determining acceptance.

 

Some thoughts

Happy Fourth of July, as an American, I am blessed to live in the greatest nation on earth!

I will not suggest that ACE evaluation equals regional accreditation, however, it's worth mentioning that many of AMU's courses have been evaluated by ACE. Many RA colleges will grant transfer credit based on the ACE recommendation, as stated in TESC's response to questions 4 and 5, below from an earilier post:
(http://www.degreeinfo.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3896)

"Inspired by Rich Douglas' guest column, I recently ask several colleges your question along with a few others. Here are my questions along with the responses from Thomas Edison State College (note questions 4 and 5):

1. Would your college or university consider accepting an American Military University Master of Arts degree as a qualification for admission to a doctorate program?
No, Thomas Edison State College requires students to be graduates of regionally accredited colleges. Since American Military University is not regionally accredited we would not recognize the student of having a required bachelors degree, which is required to enter our master degree programs.

2. Would your college or university consider accepting an American Military University Bachelor of Arts degree as a qualification for admission to a masters degree program?
No, see the answer to question #1.

3. Would your college or university consider accepting graduate level transfer credit from American Military University?
No, they are not a regionally accredited university.

4. Would your college or university consider accepting graduate and undergraduate level transfer credit, which has been evaluated by the American Council on Education (ACE), from American Military University?
Thomas Edison State College would accept the credit recommendations from the American Council on Education. However, we would not consider these transfer credits directly from American Military University.

5. Would your college or university consider accepting transfer
credit and degrees from other degree granting institutions which are accredited by the Distance Education and Training Council (DETC)?
Thomas Edison State College only accepts credits in direct transfer from regionally accredited colleges. If DETC institutions have their course evaluated by ACE we would accept the ACE credit recommendation.

FYI. Although I gave my questions an AMU focus, my findings (thus far) are consistent with Mr. Douglas'. Many RA schools do not recognize DETC accreditation.

I believe that AMU compares very well with many RA schools. However, achieving regional accreditation should be AMU's primary strategic goal."


AMU has achieved a great deal in the ten years since its founding. Its undergraduate programs are even more recent additions, beginning in 1996. The acceptance of AMU transfer credits and degrees appears to be on the rise, see:

http://www.apus.edu/amu/General_Information/accreditation.asp

 

more comfortable with accredited

I look at a degree as something that will last over an entire career. The safest (though not perfect) level is an accreditied degree.
If one ever decides to be a school teacher, the accredited degree will fulfill the requirement for a subject major.
Generally the accredited bachelor will allow one to enter a masters level program. Although if you have a radical change of career it may require extra courses.
So in general the utility of a regionally accredited degree is hard to beat.
All the best!

 

Re: more comfortable with accredited

irat,

I agree with you absolutely. Regional accreditation is the gold standard.

My point is that AMU is a fine school, compares very well with many RA schools, and has had plenty of utility for me.

I would love to see AMU achieve regional accreditation. My opinion, as I stated in a previous post, is that regional accreditation should be AMU's primary strategic goal.

 

In 2000, John Bear surveyed members of AACRAO to determine the acceptability of credits and degrees from a variety of sources when applying to RA schools. I applied statistical and qualitative analyses to the results. He presented the survey results to an AACRAO convention in April 2001 in Seattle. I was also going to present, but I could not attend.

Credits and degrees from DETC schools were significantly less acceptable than those from RA schools. Credits and degrees from state approved schools (both from state with some regulations and those from states with little or no regulations) were rejected roundly.

The subject of my doctoral dissertation is similar, but as applied in the workplace.

 

TESC

Funny, This is the same school that I placed in the
Not so wonderful arena which questions my faith in
RA.

I lived ( 10 years ), 20 miles from this so called institution of higher learning and visited them before I turned to AMU.

I am actually surprised you received a response.
Instead of furrgetaboutit?

I know there will be some disagreements but sorry.
Having a College (?) in a musty building with offices
that looks as though they could vacate in 30 seconds if
an inspection crew arrives is not my idea of RA status.

Then if this is the case then Washington International University,
30 miles away should apply RA.

Im my humble opinion RA requirements should be top shelf.
Sorry, TESC looks like the bottom shelf blue light special.

 

I would be EXTREMELY interested in reading your doctoral dissertation when you complete it. (If that is at all possible.)

- Ellis

 

Re: TESC

Hi Veteran

Are these the same building and offices shown in the TESC brouchure?! In the brouchure they look top rate. Even if we accept the offices are as you describe, does that mean the learning/assesment is inferior? Wouldn't it be better to judge TESC on their actual product? I guess ironicly even if we assume TESC is inferior to AMU, its degrees have quite a bit more utility. In any event, good luck with your studies.