English-language Título Propio Degrees - Master Thread

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Messdiener, Jan 8, 2023.

  1. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I like that. But the providers run the whole gamut. From what you described, all the way down to low-grade ticky-box "master-stuff" listed as 1600 hours, that people have successfully done in speed-runs in less than 50 hrs - WAY less in some cases. You can get what you prefer. I think they're pretty smart. They cover the whole market, from rigorous to dumb.

    And from what I've heard, you don't pay much for an ENEB - Isabel 1 Master's but you sure have to do a lot of writing for it. I've come to the conclusion that those degrees are better than I thought. The Grouponistas were right. I wasn't. Me disculpo por mis comentarios desagradables. (I apologize for my unpleasant remarks.)
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
  2. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    If you have about $6,000 and a year, Lingoda can help get you to B2 in Spanish which might be enough for a program like that.
  3. Johann766

    Johann766 Active Member

    Seems to me that ENEB still has some kind of monopoly in the English language very low cost program sector.
    Tech Universidad and UCN and all the others mentioned here are more expensive as far as I´ve seen.
  4. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    True. And ENEB / Isabel 1 also don't have the types of negative "baggage" that some accounts associate with TECH or UCN.
    You pay an extremely low fee, you do your work and you don't have to chase people or wait 6 months or forever for your diploma, either.
  5. Messdiener

    Messdiener Active Member

    And I think this is why individuals need to be nuanced in how they present their credentials.

    If someone is doing a proper (but inexpensive) MBA via ENEB, he or she could legitimately use this as a degree in the 'Education' area of a CV.

    A 50-hour 'master' from a little-known provider would be better listed in the 'Professional Development' or 'Continuing Education' fields, no?

    The catch is that ENEB, by design, focuses almost exclusively on business. TECH has philosophy and many other subjects. UCN covers psychology and other fields as well.

    If you're looking for a business degree, ENEB is a great fit. If you want to study health studies, pedagogy, or something else, some of these lesser known títulos propios may be able to check a box for you, depending on the usual factors (where you live, what field you're in, etc.).
  6. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    To me - the catches are:
    ENEB delivers, well and reliably at a low price. enough said.
    TECH is comparatively expensive and problems reported in the threads.
    UCN - my principal objection is (and has long been) the number of dual and triple programs, often with schools of a grade inferior to UCN itself. Cost is far out of the ENEB ballpark. Reports of non-receipt of diplomas etc. with partner schools. Hard to know sometimes, which of 3 schools is issuing you the "best" diploma - how many will actually arrive - and when. Too many 'ifs' for serious money.

    I think UCN used to do things far better than it has lately. All these cross-validations... :(

    And why do we have to go over and over some of the lowball schools. Surely we've squeezed out and microscopically analyzed the very last drops of whatever value there is, long ago. No sense living in hopes forever.
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
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  7. Messdiener

    Messdiener Active Member

    Does that mean no Máster Universitario en Arqueologia for you? For 169 EUR, I still think it's a steal, even if as a hobby degree!
  8. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    It obviously doesn't mean it's not for you.
    I just don't think much of degree-collecting as a hobby. A collection of papers and postnominals does not excite me. Nor do I think that one needs a degree (except possibly, psychologically) to document learning every hobby.

    But hey-- at 169 Euros... that's not serious money at all.

    And I wouldn't call Mastercursos a "bad" outfit. It's not on my radar as such, like some others. They deliver. I just think an academic degree should have a certain amount of rigor - and some people who have speed-run through there say that is lacking in some of their degrees.
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
  9. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    Lingoda also has "sprints" a couple of times a year. Depending on which option is chosen choose, you can get 50-100% of your money back when you fully participate in a sprint.

    There are plenty of even cheaper options out there, too. Some of which might get one to that goal even faster. I've got a whole bunch of resources for anyone who wants to get started on the cheap without having to pony up Lingoda-levels of cash up-front. Unfortunately, time is the one component of language learning that can't be borrowed or bought.
  10. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

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  11. Johann766

    Johann766 Active Member

    Out of curiosity i tried putting a product on Groupon (i tried the german Version). Maximum price is 999 euro and you have to discount this price for groupon. If you discount it to 660 euros, the income will be split as follows: ~300 (!!!!!) For groupon and 360 for you.
    Meaning that eneb is not even getting the whole price which is already very low.
  12. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    For UCN, some (Many? Most?) of their programs involve more than independent study and require regular video meetings with Professors. The Psychology program is like that, and it also can include a year-long project (tailoring dependent on student need) aside from the required dissertation for the PhD which is a 3-year minimum program. ENEBs model being all independent study makes it easier to keep costs lower than UCNs. From what I can tell, ENEB's model is nearly identical to Ashworth College's original online study model which I remain a fan of, (although Ashworth's second version with all the interactive materials was their best. Real shame that went away).

    One big piece of news on ENEB is that (based on some recently shared evaluation result badges) WES Canada recognizes the ENEB Master's as a full accredited Master's degree. Definitely didn't see that one ever coming, but it's happened.
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
  13. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    On those terms, it's amazing to me that either ENEB or Universidad Isabel 1 would bother launching their program. I've heard the economy is really tough in Spain, and has been for years. This tends to confirm what I hear.

    @LearningAddict I'm delighted to hear about WES Canada's evaluation of ENEB degrees as accredited Master's degrees. When I recovered consciousness, I confirmed my recent decision to recognize them, too! :)
    Last edited: Jan 15, 2023
    LearningAddict likes this.
  14. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    By "lowball" I wasn't referring to price. Or at least not price alone. I was referring largely to what's known about quality, rigor, etc. I should have made that clear. Sorry.
  15. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Just because a school calls it something, that isn't enough. They can call something a "master's" degree, but if it isn't, it isn't. And if you participate in the deception, falling back on "well, that's what the school calls it" is insufficient.

    Taken to an extreme: an "MBA" purchased from a diploma mill isn't really an MBA, even though the school (and you) are in agreement that it is. Instead, it's a piece of paper with writing on it, nothing more. And if you have an MBA from Stanford, you inarguably have an MBA.

    But what about everything in between? Well, that's why we have accreditation (and foreign degree evaluation processes): to give us assurances that what's on the label is what's inside, too. But...

    As we know, most people don't check in most situations. That's why the diploma mill business is so lucrative; you've got a wingman backing up your game, as it were. Well, taking some superficial course from a real school and calling it a "master's degree" doesn't cut it, even if the school is the one doing the labeling.
    Johann likes this.
  16. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Well said! From a guy who knows.

    For the benefit of lowball (quality) Spanish schools, here is Rich's statement:

    Lo llaman una maestría. Pero si no lo es, no lo es.
    (They can call it a Master's degree, but if it isn't, it isn't.)
    Rich Douglas likes this.
  17. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I did the Lingoda Sprint! 90 days of French, one hour a day (plus another hour to prep) did more for my studying that year that anything else. I got my refund and am a very satisfied customer. Here's a blog post I wrote on that: http://dustinkmacdonald.com/i-completed-the-lingoda-language-marathon/
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  18. Messdiener

    Messdiener Active Member

    Sounds like a great topic for a new thread: inexpensive but rigorous language learning courses!
    Rachel83az likes this.
  19. BorisTBear

    BorisTBear New Member

    This is because a fairly recent spanish law stipulates that Master-propio degrees may only be awarded as "Master en formacion permanente" in two years at the latest, to avoid confusion with the official master degrees:
    https://www.boe.es/buscar/doc.php?id=BOE-A-2021-15781 (Chapter VIII, Article 37)

    Knowing this, I think Messdiener's question is all the more relevant. So, I would prefer "Master of continuing education in ..."
    Messdiener likes this.
  20. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    I had an email exchange with a Spanish school a few months back about this and they sent me directly to the law. I believe it was the second link in your post.

    I've seen it translated as "Master in Permanent Training". The title doesn't sound appealing to me either way, especially the "continuing education" part since in American education that denotes something much less than graduate-level work, but I do understand the reasoning behind adding something to make the distinction between official and propio clear since all the titles read the same and likely caused issues. I probably would've just made it "Master Propio in Advanced Rocket Surgery" and that would've communicated it all without looking as clunky, but I'm looking at it with American eyes which couldn't possibly see the whole picture when considering the cultural influence that likely went into it.
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