Did Russians successfully manipulate or change American votes?

I heard him once say he grew up in an anti Jewish home. Until this convo I always assumed that him and his family worked for the Nazi's because of that. I had no idea.

 

I still don't get how people wanted HRC as a moral choice? Let's just say all the lies and exaggerated stories about Trump are true...is HRC any better? No she's not but people will pretend she would have been. Remerber at one time she was anti gay marriage and pro life sooo?

 

Yes. Yes she is. Policies she stands for and HRC as a person. First point was the reason enough to support her candidacy.

Perhaps, but so were the vast majority of people of around her age. "Sooo?" is an apt question here.

In any case, Hillary lost; Russian-influenced Twittering Birtherist unqualified alt-left-enabling lying sex offender is now President. That's more relevant discussion topic, don't you think?
(I forgot "short-fingered vulgarian"; that's always fun to say)

 

Soros & Bank of England? Soros & Hungary? Soros and Albania? Soros and Macedonia? Soros &, &, &. When you lack the ability to back your foundationless comments, you start ad hominems, red herrings, or simply throw a man.

I am out.

 

... never mind ...

 

Heresy!!!! :shocked1: :lmao:

IMO, Aerosmith and Kiss kept rock music alive in those dark days of the Disco 70's. Of course, I'm a bit biased, being from the Boston area.

 

Wait! You forgot Malaysia!

Also, speaking of Soros and Hungary, Orban Viktor appears to be plotting his revenge.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-01-10/trump-s-win-prompts-hungarian-call-for-crackdown-on-soros-groups

 

I find it funny that people on the left truly think they are supporting the working class in America when they are funded by Soros.

 

No wonder. Viktor Orban (sic) is perhaps the only world leader who openly admires and emulates Vladimir Putin. One quote:

FYI, "liberal democracy" is what your country is supposed to stand for.

Look, it may look unfamiliar to you, but some people used to live in an authoritarian or semi-authoritarian society. Say there is a protest movement. Step one is to declare that it is a fantasy of the out-of-touch elite. FYI, Russian newspeak term is "kreakl", for "creative class". Then come claims that the whole thing is staged, and protesters are paid (no matter how implausible it is). Sometimes they'll twist some real information to fit the narrative (eg., all of the rather meager US aid for "developing democracy in Ukraine" is presented as funds directly to Maidan mutineers, even though some of those went to the government and government-affiliated political parties). At the same time, the protesters are linked to some outside force or a grand conspiracy (in Russia it is U. S. State Dept. as a primary evil and a host of secondary rogues; Soros makes frequent appearance. It is especially convenient since in the 90ies USAID and Soros's Open Society Foundation promoted a lot of the same causes. Russian equivalent of Soros is, among others, the late Boris Berezovskij, a mathematician and oligarch, conveniently also a Jew. He was, by all indications, a real immoral psychopath, but it doesn't matter for the purposes of a role to play). One of the first things you'd like to do is simultaneously defame and buy up the media (like these guys, or just about any other notable media outlet).

Possible further steps: some time after that, you'll see smears on individual opposition leaders; often claims of their real or supposed Jewish background. For example, there are simultaneous claims that leading Ukrainian leaders (Poroshenko, Yatseniuk, Tymoshenko) are Jews and also, incredibly, a Neo-nazi anti-semites, as opposed to boring corrupt centrists they are. Another tactic might be recruiting people to show grassroots support to the rulers ( Ukrainian "Antimaidan" "protests" and "titushki" thugs; Russian "youth movements" like "Nashi" or "Young Guard of the United Russia"; also Putin's pet biker gang, "Night Wolves"). In the background: co-optation of religion, bribing or intimidating cultural leaders to back the authoritarian. One instrument Trump doesn't have (yet?) is the pocket judiciary; then you start having real political prisoners (like Bolotnaya prisoners or Pussy Riot band. Oh, and assassinations (Nemtsov is just the most recent example).

 

I see your concern. What are your views on, say, the Citizens United precedent?

Sheesh! At least Sanders fanboys have a leg to stand on when giving these arguments; he really does call for getting money out of politics.

 

To answer that: no, they wouldn't.

But you're right. That was always the case. As far as I can see, as an unabashed Clinton fan, I'm in a small minority. People do not like Trump not because they like Hillary, or, often, Obama. He stands on his repulsive own. Also, he's now the President, even though sometimes it sounds like even he didn't notice he won already.

 

Are people far and wide condemning Soros for his Jewish ancestry or is it for....everything else? Sure, there are anti-Semites out there who have a beef with Soros over his heritage (amongst his other transgressions), but this is hardly the primary focus.

According to your theory, what "step" is Hungary at? I haven't read anything about Orban trashing opposition leaders over Jewish heritage (if anything, he is taking a firmer stance/having harsh words with Islam)....so...is he at Step, like, 1.75?

 

You don't have access to Hungarian-language media. Putin would never utter something direct like this; rather, he's known for talking in impressive-sounding, precise paragraphs that are impossible to decipher afterwards, punctuating by carefully-chosen off-color words to cultivate the strongman image ("mochit' v sortire" - criminal slang for klilling someone in the toilet). He has lackeys for spreading things like these. Actually, going after Soros personally is way more direct: it shows that Putin's KGB training is superior to whatever Orban had. In aggregate, I'd say he's at least at step 2 if not further along.
From your article: "Trump also accused the 86-year-old billionaire of being part of “a global power structure that is responsible for the economic decisions that have robbed our working class, stripped our country of its wealth and put that money into the pockets of a handful of large corporations and political entities.” "Global power structure" is as transparent a reference to ZOG as possible while still maintaining deniability, strenuous as it is. How is it so hard to see?

 

"Far and wide"? No. "Alt and right"? Yes. See, he won't be as convenient a stand-in for ... what's the euphemism here? "international bankers" if they'd make it too obvious. Funnily, eastward part of Soros's crimes is helping destroy Soviet Union: do you fault him for that too?
Russia's own Boris Beresovskij (PhD, DSc, Corresponding Member RAS) is prime example. He was one of the group of people directly responsible (and benefitting from) for looting of Soviet state assets, and basically installed Putin into highest echelons of power; despite my weakness for mathematicians he was clearly a very shadowy character. Yet, the fact that he was made into this nigh-omnipotent mythological force of evil, far above his oligarch peers and Putin's own securicrat mafia, unmistakably has a lot to do to the fact that he was very conspicuously Jewish. He is credited with evil deeds clearly far above his supervillain power level, even after his exile, and into death - while some of his peers are still in good terms with Kremlin inner circle. Parallels are striking.

 

Really?

Fair enough. What's step 5?

 

In no particular order, this may happen: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_people_killed_during_Euromaidan

Disclaimer: I do NOT think any anti-Trump protest will go along the lines of Euromaidan revolution, because most of it was reaction to brutal and stupid actions to suppress it. There's enough common sense in the Trump team and enough institutional safeguards to prevent this level of catastrophic mistakes. Yanukovych could have stayed in power at many junctions if he'd backtrack fast enough; hopefully Manafort relayed this experience. If Trump rule would deteriorate to this level of incompetence he won't last long.

 

Ouch; https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-01-26/dutch-regulator-accidentally-posted-soros-s-short-positions


"The 86-year-old investor lost about $1 billion by betting against the market after the election of U.S. President Donald Trump, according to the Wall Street Journal this month. The hiring of a chief investment officer may reduce Soros’s role, the paper reported"

 

I was more amused by the "accidental" release of this information.

"Oops"