Apollos University DBA

Discussion in 'Business and MBA degrees' started by Blair, Mar 7, 2019.

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  1. Maxwell_Smart

    Maxwell_Smart Active Member

    I have serious reservations about that one. University of Phoenix has had no shortage of issues and declining enrollments, so I don't know where that confidence comes from.
     
  2. Steve Levicoff

    Steve Levicoff Well-Known Member

    Twenty years ago, Argosy was at its peak, having taken over and successfully run several APA-approved psychology schools and successful business programs (not to mention the then-successful Art Institutes chain). One could easily say at that time, "Say what you want about Argosy University however they will still be in business 20+ years from now."

    Much as I'm opposed to gambling, I'd be tempted to wager today that the University of Phoenix will not still be in business 20+ years from now. I predicted Argosy's demise a few years ago, and it came much faster than I imagined back then. Phoenix? By their very nature, they're already starting their slippery slope down the tubes.

    Fortunately, I'm a fan of schadenfreude, so I'm already starting to enjoy the impending demise of Phoenix as much as I laughed my ass off at the closing of Argosy.

     
  3. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    I worked for the Evil Empire on two occasions, and generally tend to look at them in ambivalent way. They are not as bad as their reputation suggests. That being said, Steve might be right on this one. I simply don't see what would lead them on growth trajectory. Doesn't seem they offer anything unique or especially appealing to the market anymore; one can have blah degree program at gazillion of places now (and in some cases, for a fraction of the price - eg. WGU). I was involved in one of their last expansion attempts (Meritus U. in Canada) - that didn't last long.

    P.S. I'm mildly curious how Apollo's British property (BPP University) is doing.
     
  4. felderga

    felderga Active Member

    I think UOP will be a survivor in the changing landscape of online learning. The one thing UOP has in its favor is the huge number of corporate partners that are aligned with them. For working adults looking to go back to school to earn an undergraduate degree UOP will still be a top destination for many as oppose to the tougher requirements established by many traditional brick and mortar schools.
     
  5. Junkmal

    Junkmal New Member

    Finished my DBA at Apollos last year took me 4 years to get it done ,trust me it was not easy and worth every penny paid .
    Already starting to reap the benefits .I found the course material very challenging and was mentored very professionally.
     
  6. SamSam

    SamSam New Member

    I wonder how the course structure is at Apollos. Are they semester/term based? Do they have set start/end dates for courses? Deadlines (weekly?) for submitting assignments?
     
  7. Junkmal

    Junkmal New Member

    They have a choice of both , i found this quite handy as time is always a challenge for me ,thus swapping and changing helped me stay on track.
     
  8. adventuresaddict

    adventuresaddict New Member

    There are a few basic questions to ask:
    1) Does being a private, NA and for-profit institution makes a university automatically bad in terms of academic standards? If that's so, there are many such universities, and you should petition for their accreditation to be removed.

    2) Are you looking at RA only? If that's so, then no matter how good an NA university is, it doesn't fit your needs. There's no need for you to waste time airing your opinion about non-RA universities. If NA universities are good enough for the experts in the U.S. Department of Education and CHEA for recognition, they are good enough for at least some people. The fact is, many who hold NA degrees had been promoted or found a good job which wouldn't have been possible without their NA degree.

    3) Who would be more cautious about meeting high academic standards: large state universities or smaller unknowns? If you were an operator of a small, private, NA university, wouldn't you be even more concerned about the higher level of scrutiny which your institution is under? Since the media, authorities, accreditation agencies, sponsors, students and employers are much more likely to suspect that NA universities are diploma mills and have poor academic standards than they would large RA universities, DEAC-accredited universities in particular would be even more concerned that their courses meet high standards. Their owners spend millions of dollars from their own pockets to get their accreditation, build up their online education platforms, etc. Would not they be much more motivated than salaried administrators and academics in public RA universities to ensure they can keep their DEAC accreditation?
     
  9. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    A former head of University of Phoenix said that the problem with the for-profit college industry is its short-term outlook. They're more concerned with short-term profits than longevity.

    Most non-profit schools I've come across have become a part of their surrounding communities. They are longstanding institutions, and the locals will fight for them to stay open. It's similar to residents getting angry about the neighborhood elementary school being closed down by the district. I haven't really seen this attachment to for-profit colleges.

    The U.S. government does not oversee colleges closely. They've delegated most of these tasks to private organizations aka accreditors. Some accreditors have higher standards than others. I'm not saying that DEAC is bad, but there's a reason why many online schools earn DEAC accreditation long before they earn regional accreditation.

    In ACICS' case, they were shielding deplorable schools such as ITT Tech, which is why they temporarily lost their recognition from USDOE. I worked for a for-profit school accredited by ACCSC. It wasn't known outside of Central and South Central Texas. That didn't stop them from scamming students and taxpayers. The owner immediately reported to the U.S. Department of Education that his accounting and finance departments were mishandling financial aid. The government stripped them of their Title IV status, and they had to shut down.

    The owner sounds innocent, right? It sounds like he was punished for doing the right thing. It wasn't until a couple of years later that it was found out that the owner illegally took millions. This school had been around for decades, and no one knew that he was using the school as his personal bank account.

    And, I can say that ACCSC has lower standards than the regional accreditors.
     
  10. DALE LOKEY

    DALE LOKEY New Member

    I see many people making statements about the quality of education at RA schools compared to NA schools. What I would recommend is to sign up for a class at Apollos University in the DBA program. It is straightforward to get conditionally accepted. A good class to get a real flavor for the quality of education would be BUS 8320. I spent a great deal of time researching schools. I could have completed a few classes in the amount of time I spent researching the various programs. I realize everyone has an opinion. Most don't mind giving you their opinion whether you want it or not. I take giving mine seriously. I will cut to the chase. Apollos University is no joke. Try it for yourself, and you will see.
     
  11. Steve Levicoff

    Steve Levicoff Well-Known Member

    You mean, just like you’re giving us your unsolicited opinion now? You know, the opinion that we don’t want because others have given opinions with more substance than yours? Um, okay . . .

    But before I go further, let me take a moment to welcome you to DI, Dale.
    You have just given us a good example of the Herbalife technique. I remember watching their infomercials 20-something years ago (watching late-night infomercials was a great way of learning public speaking techniques if you could separate reality from bullshit). Their essential message was, “You don’t have to give reasons for anything. Just say that the product is great, that you love it, and that they’ll love it, too.” And that’s the way people are about degree mills, mickey-mouse schools, for-profit schools, NA-rather-than-RA schools. “I love it, and you’ll love it, too.”

    So here you come and tell us how great you think Apollos is, and that the only way we’ll find your version of the truth is to actually enroll in an Apollos class. ‘Cause you obviously love it, and obviously we’ll love it, too.

    And for that, you’re asking us “doubters” to go through the application process and pay tuition to actually enroll in a course that is likely useless to us? Interesting notion, but nothing more than a recruiting technique. Which, in addition to everything else, makes you a shill for Apollos.

    Now, here’s your reality check. Many of the folks on this forum have experience with multiple schools and multiple programs – some good, some bad, some RA, some NA, some unaccredited. We have the ability to compare those programs, an ability which you have not demonstrated. And while you may have signed up for one or more Apollos courses with which you appear to be impressed, you have no framework on how their courses compare with those of other schools. Moreover, the level of challenge or even difficulty you may have found with Apollos courses means nothing in terms of the big picture – they may have posed a challenge to you, yet they may be deficient when compared with wider academic standards.

    Now, here’s an unscientific measurement on the credibility of Apollos and similar schools. When a thread appears about them here on DegreeInfo, and when that thread spreads out to several pages in which people dialogue or even argue about the schools’ legitimacy, then the school is not legitimate. Period. And the kind of apologia in which you are engaging here is the same kind of defense you will have to make for your poor choice for years to come. As I’ve said in the past, if a person feels compelled to come to DI to ask if a school is legitimate (which is how these threads get started), the probability is high that it is not. It’s that simple.

    Um, I shall now laugh at you. But once again, welcome to DI.
     
    JoshD likes this.
  12. DALE LOKEY

    DALE LOKEY New Member

    That's a lengthy response Steve. I concede that you are right, and I am wrong because I would never have time to argue the point with you. Also, I obviously don't have the background to compare schools. I only ask for one concession since I am conceding. Please don't respond to this. You win already.
     
  13. JoshD

    JoshD Active Member

    Welcome to DI! I am not so certain I would have made this my first post as it seems a little but like you are a recruiter for Apollo’s but so be it. I am kind of big on programmatic accreditation when it comes to business programs and first thing I notice is that Apollo’s does not have AACSB, ACBSP or IACBE accreditation for its business programs. Personally, for me, this would be an instantaneous...NO.
     
  14. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    If the University of Phoenix is to fail at some time in the future, it will not be because of the quality of (or lack thereof) the education being delivered. Nor was its success and phenomenal growth based on that.

    It's about money.

    UoP began as a business set up by John Sperling to service San Jose State University. Essentially, they were subcontracted by the school to offer a master's program. (Sperling was a professor there and created UoP for this purpose.) Reportedly, WASC didn't care for this arrangement and pressured the school to end it. So he started his own university, taking it to Arizona (and outside WASC's jurisdiction). It became a behemoth and is now part of a multi-billion-dollar conglomerate.

    You hear a LOT of complaints about UoP's business practices, especially high-pressure sales...um...."admissions." My complaint is with its open-admissions policy--a lot of people start but not a lot graduate. What you DON'T hear is a lot of complaints about a lack of quality in the learning, nor should you. (Some people don't like the team learning component, however.) But admissions? Pure boiler room stuff.

    UoP didn't used to admit lower-division undergraduates; you had to have 2 years of college credit. Then they lowered that to 20 s.h. Finally, they got rid of it completely. Well, you can imagine that the lower you go, the more shaky your admissions get. People who've never done a college class have a very high dropout rate. But the problem there is the fixed cost of getting a student to enroll--it's expensive. In fact, the break-even point when I was there was 4 courses. So what did UoP do? It created a 5-course introductory set of courses designed to give students a baseline of skills necessary to do a degree. This was for those students with fewer than 20 s.h. of transfer credit. These courses were priced at the same level, were credit-bearing, and were extremely easy. Needless to say, you don't need an MBA to figure out what problem was solved there.
     
  15. Kizmet

    Kizmet Moderator Staff Member

    My experience has been that whenever there's a thread about a questionable school and it goes dormant for a while . . . the person who re-opens the thread after months (or years) of dormancy is almost always either a student at that school or they have some other financial interest in the school. The resulting loss of objectivity is obvious for all to see. I would also like to welcome our new member and hope he sticks around. I also would ask if he would tell us his affiliation to the school in question. It's not required but I'm sure we're all curious.
     
  16. copper

    copper Active Member

    I used to teach aerodynamics and asked the question, what makes an airplane fly? Received a lot of good scientific answers but I would take a $20 bill out of my pocket and say.......money! I'm certain if one had enough money they could make a University fly!
     
  17. Steve Levicoff

    Steve Levicoff Well-Known Member

    You would never have time to argue the point? Well, Dale, I doubt that. After all, you had the time to make your initial post. Besides, there is no point to argue.

    As for my winning already, there’s nothing to win. This is not a competition. My interest is in terms of consumer protection, period.

    But if it were a competition, my winning would be presumed from the start. That is, quite simply, because I’m brilliant. And funny. And humble, let’s not forget humble.

    Here’s hoping that you continue to hang out with us. You might actually learn something that will, in some minor way, save your professional ass down the road.
     
  18. copper

    copper Active Member

    Hi Dale,

    If ApollosU is a good fit for you, then go for it and best of luck! It appears to be accredited by DEAC which is a good thing!
     
  19. heirophant

    heirophant Well-Known Member

    As for me, I don't think that quality of education is really a function of accreditation. (Or incorporation/tax status.) It's primarily a function of individual faculty and broader program design.

    I'd suggest looking at program syllabi to see what a degree-program covers. Look at faculty and at their experience and qualifications. In the case of doctoral programs, look for publications and research productivity. Look for collaborations with other institutions. Look for grants and awards won. And (this is important) try to get a feeling for what kind of reputation the institution has in its relevant professional community.

    Yes, that will give a student a feeling for how helpful the administration is, for how smooth the DL-delivery is, for how interactive the class is, and for how well that particular instructor teaches. Those are valuable data points.

    I do too. It's a good suggestion.

    If it's accredited by DEAC, I'd assume that it wouldn't be.

    Of course, it's still an exceedingly obscure school that (I'm guessing) doesn't have much of an academic footprint. (Faculty, publications, reputation, that stuff.)

    While it probably wouldn't be the best choice for a young academic careerist who hopes to land a tenure-track professorial position, it might be fine for somebody who is already out in the business world who doesn't plan to use the degree in academia.
     
  20. heirophant

    heirophant Well-Known Member

    What kind of "background" must one have to compare schools? Just by the nature of the thing, it's prospective students who find themselves in the position of choosing programs.

    While it's very smart to seek out and listen to advice, it's still ultimately you who is making the decision.
     

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