An astonishing statement by a high US official

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by John Bear, May 17, 2005.

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  1. John Bear

    John Bear Senior Member

    I came upon a Fox TV story on degree mills, especially the one from which Charles Abell, the Undersecretary of Defense in charge of HR for the entire US military, has his degree.

    In defending his fake degree to reporter Sherry Ly, Abell said, "I don't know about accreditation. It's not my skillset."

    One wonders what his skillset is.
     
  2. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Indeed! Wow.

    So, what with THE FOX NEWS CHANNEL being the mouthpiece for the Republican Party and the Bush43 administration and all, who wants to bet against my prediction, now, that once FOX realizes just how truly bad this makes Abell look, the story will mysteriously disappear?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 17, 2005
  3. uncle janko

    uncle janko member

    I don't think anyone who uses the logoid "skillset" should have ANYTHING to do, however remotely, with weapons of any kind. That includes lawnmowers and electric toothbrushes. Or the Defence Department.:p
     
  4. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Remarkable.

    When we did the story about him on Good Morning America, I really thought there would be more follow-up by other media sources. But nothing. Then a year-and-a-half later, this? Without having seen the story, I wonder if the reporter let that stupid answer slide.
     
  5. Jake_A

    Jake_A New Member

    This is amazing! I am in total shock.

    Read the FOX News story here.

    Wow!
     
  6. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    The Undersecretary in charge of HR said that?

    That is astonishing.

    The guy essentially called himself incompetent. I hope that the media keeps the light shined on him.
     
  7. decimon

    decimon Well-Known Member

    CBS also has the story.

    And The Macomb Daily scooped them both. Always turn first to The Macomb Daily. :)
     
  8. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Thanks for the links.

    I find it astonishing that Abell is claiming ignorance of accreditation. First, he's supposed to know about that stuff, given the job he holds. Second (and very obviously), the guy got caught with a fake degree. Certainly he must know about accreditation now!

    The Fox story got the USDoE/CHEA relationship wrong, saying that CHEA was the only accrediting agency the USDoE recognizes. CHEA isn't an accreditor (it is an association of accrediting agencies), and USDoE maintains its own list of approved accreditors.

    From the second Fox article (their all-caps):

    YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE A DEGREE FROM HARVARD TO SPOT A DIPLOMA MILL. EXPERTS SAY IF THE SCHOOL REQUIRES LITTLE OR NO WORK, OFFERS QUICK DEGREES WHEN IT WOULD NORMALLY TAKE YEARS, OR ACCEPTS CREDIT FOR "WORK OR LIFE EXPERIENCE" IT'S LIKELY A DIPLOMA MILL.

    No kidding. How about fake or no accreditation? Since degrees from unaccredited schools aren't acceptable, legitimate or not, that would be the most straight-forward criterion to use.

    I really wonder if heads will roll? If they really went after everyone with a fake degree (or even just the ones who are not qualified without the degrees), some agencies could see some serious disruptions.

    They should start with Abell.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 17, 2005
  9. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    Charles Abell on "credentialing"

    There's an interesting 2003 statement here by The Honorable Charles S. Abell, Principal Deputy Under Secretary of Defense for Personnel and Readiness, on the topic of "officership and professionalism in the Armed Forces".

    Mr. Abell states that "credentialing" is one of the key "institutional safeguards" used to ensure the quality of military officers:

    Of course, you can't get rid of all the bad apples, even if you require college degrees:
    And in case you were wondering, yes, Mr. Abell proudly lists his Columbus University degree in his biography at the beginning of his statement.
     
  10. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Astonishing works, then when I think about how long this has been going on, INFURIATING is the word that pops to mind.
     
  11. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator Staff Member

    Re: Re: An astonishing statement by a high US official

    If that is true, then why did they run with the story to begin with? :confused:
     
  12. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Re: Re: Re: An astonishing statement by a high US official

    For the same reason the reporter didn't get her mind wrapped around what he said, and let it slide, in the first place. No one said everyone at FOX was quick.

    Anyway... it's moot now. My comment was time-sensitive; and relevant only earlier... before others started to pick-up the story, too. At this point FOX would look foolish to try to bury it.
     
  13. Charles

    Charles New Member

    I find it astonishing too, but doesn't your own research show that ignorance of accreditation is generally the rule in the HR world.

    This is the one that still astonishes me. I can only assume that he is well qualified, even without his bogus degree. Why do you think he insists on listing the Columbus University degree in his bio?
     
    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2005
  14. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Because he can. In a government lacking almost all of its normal checks and balances, people like this can act without fear as long as they have the support of their superiors. This guy has been appointed twice by the president and has the support of Sen. Warner (R-VA). The impact of public humiliation is measured in votes, and those don't seem to be at issue here.
     
  15. oxpecker

    oxpecker New Member

    A government official who shows himself to be ethically bankrupt?

    Sadly, I don't find that astonishing at all.
     
  16. DTechBA

    DTechBA New Member

    Isn't he a DM grad

    Wasn't Abell someone who had a problem with his dioploma's? Probably why he doesn't want to look too hard at accreditation...
     
  17. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Re: Isn't he a DM grad

    Fake master's from Columbus University. Subject of a piece on Good Morning America, which featured interviews with John Bear, Alan Ezell, and yours truly in late 2003.
     
  18. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator Staff Member

    Re: Re: Re: Re: An astonishing statement by a high US official

    Did it ever occur to you that perhaps it's because FOX truly is "fair and balanced?"

    Nice circular logic.....if they bury it, they're sycophants for George Bush.....if they keep running it, they'd "look foolish to try to bury it".

    Please. :rolleyes:
     
  19. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Fair and ba... you... you're... I mean... you're kiddin', right? Give a really thoughful viewing to the documentary film Outfoxed and then check back with me.

    Timing is everything.

    Anyway... why are you pushing this, Bruce? I mean... I know you know my feelings about THE FOX NEWS CHANNEL from my rants about it last year in these very fora. I know you know that my hatred of that network isn't just an idle opinion and that I can cite (and have cited, here) all manner of proof that it is the mouthpiece of the Bush43 administration, specifically; and of the Republican part, generally. Is there some reason why you want me to get into all that again, here?

    And, by the way, I've noticed alot of people around here talking about the SEARCH function being broken, but then whenever I tried it it seemed okay. But I now realize that it is broken again because I just searched for the thread from last year where I really went to town on FOX and it's not showing-up. This happened, if you recall, a few months ago. People were complaining about the search not working, but since it kinda' did Chip didn't really realize how bad it was -- and even said so in a thread where it was discussed at the time. So he went and, I presume, reindexed the search database and, voila!, the search function came back better than ever. Obviously, whatever was wrong with the search back then is wrong again. And we know from Chip's having said so that, unlike the other notices the system gives him when something goes wrong, the system obviously doesn't notify him of a degraded search capability. Could you maybe ask him to go do, again, whatever it was he did last time this happened, because without SEARCH, the utility of this place is greatly diminished. THANKS!
     
  20. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator Staff Member

    Re: Re: An astonishing statement by a high US official

    If you actually analyzed it without an agenda, you'd realize that FOX News is actually centrist. The fact that every other media outlet is so far left, makes it appear to be a right-wing organization.

    The only thing I've seen is selective citing of obviously biased sources. This thread, in particular, makes you look a bit silly when you try to say that FOX isn't burying the story because they'd look foolish.

    Gregg....think what you want about the FOX network, but it's not run by stupid people. If they truly were a puppet of the Bush administration, they never would have run this story to begin with. Here are the possible actions that FOX could have taken with this story, and my predictions of your explanations;

    1) Runs the story - Gregg says that they're too stupid to realize the damage it might do.

    2) Continues to run with the story, even after it embarrasses the Bush administration - Gregg says that they'd look foolish if they tried to bury it now.

    3) Doesn't run the story- Gregg screams "Cover up!!!!"

    4) Runs the story, then doesn't follow up - Gregg screams "Cover up!!!!"

    Admit it Gregg, no matter what FOX does or says, you'll find fault with it, and assign some conspiracy theory.

    BTW....why is it that the left is so terrified of FOX News? Don't they believe in freedom of the press??

    Obviously, we've been paid-off by FOX News to keep the search feature broken. :rolleyes: :D

    Seriously, I have nothing to do with the tech side, but I do know that the appropriate person is aware of it, but I'll send him a friendly reminder, anyway.
     

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