Why is law school so expensive?

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by MaceWindu, Aug 9, 2023.

Loading...
  1. MaceWindu

    MaceWindu Active Member

    Reasons please.
     
  2. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Chicken and egg. Law schools charge a lot of money because they can. Lawyers - same thing. People think if they go to law school, they will become lawyers, charge a lot of money and get their school debt paid --- and then some... a good life. And so it goes... Some get their dream. A lot are already beaten, coming out of the gate. Crowded horses make a dangerous track.

    To the tune of "Streets of Laredo"

    I see by your J.D. that you are a lawyer.
    If I earn a J.D., then I'll be one too.
    Let's all earn J.D.'s and then we'll be lawyers.
    If you earn a J.D., then you'll be one too. "


    Whoops! the ABA heard me! Now they'll do something to increase law school prices --- again, to "limit entry."
    Won't stop the lemmings. Only a piper can do that.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2023
  3. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    Supply and demand. Also, law school professors have some of the highest salaries. It's hard to attract good talent to academia when industry pays a lot more.
     
  4. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    When I received my JD from the University of New Mexico in 1986, my total tuition for all three years together was around $3,000. Nowadays, total in state tuition runs around $50,000. That's still a very good deal by current standards but it's still a lot of money.

    One cause is the reduction of state funding for professional education. Basically, the Legislature has decided that, since the law degree largely benefits the graduate the graduate should pay most of the cost.

    The fallacy behind this reasoning is that the law degree does not benefit only the recipient. Society as a whole and the state itself must have lawyers to function. I was able to accept low paid state jobs earlier in my career because I did not have huge student loans to service.
     
  5. Asymptote

    Asymptote Active Member

    Is it possible some people do not want society to function?

    Serious question.
     
  6. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Sure. Look at the Freedom Caucus in the U.S. House. Smashing things is Chip Roy's admitted purpose in being there. He says so. But I don't think that's the main cause.
     
    Rachel83az and MaceWindu like this.
  7. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    You know, not so long ago I would have suggested that you're conflating government and society. But in the last few years it has come to seem like many of the people who want to "drain the swamp" has an increasingly not-just-Washington definition of swamp.
     
    Maniac Craniac and MaceWindu like this.
  8. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

  9. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    How about a little macroeconomics? Supply, meet demand.

    But wait, what about all those lawyers serving lattes at Starbucks? First, it isn't true. Second, law schools (like any training or education program) sell a dream. And the dream lives.

    Finally, mix in all that borrowed money chasing these degrees and you're bound to experience inflation.
     
    Maniac Craniac likes this.
  10. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Good point. Law school is actually FREE while you are in it. It's only once you're out in the world that the weight of student loan debt becomes real.
     
    Maniac Craniac likes this.
  11. Asymptote

    Asymptote Active Member

    And the “macroeconomics” issue is part of the problem. The neo-liberal dupes who carried water for the Trilateral Commission following their “Crisis of Democracy” study, which claimed that the world was enjoying too much democracy.

    You get the lawyers (who historically are an important “class” for civil society to function in a healthy way) on the hook in a neo-feudal indentured servitude status through high tuition and heavy loan debt. In so doing, you ensure they don’t “get out of line.”

    Similarly, you strangle civic society in the crib by no longer teaching basic civics. Heck, you don’t even have to worry about lawyers protecting citizens and civil rights after a generation of that!

    Ah - the hand that rocks the cradle is the hand that rules the world.
     
  12. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Professional wrestling
    NASCAR
    Soap operas
    Reality TV
    Faith healers
    The Deep State
    QAnon
    Conspiracy theories
     
    nosborne48 likes this.
  13. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Professional wrestling
    NASCAR
    Faith healers
    Reality TV
    QAnon
    The Deep State
    Conspiracy theories

    I'm sure there's more, but you get the idea.
     
    nosborne48 likes this.
  14. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    My oldest son is graduate of Wittier Law school 2007 - 2010 and was admitted to Cal State Bar in 2011.
    His BA was completely covered by the college as at the time his mom worked there and it was part of the benefits.
    Law school was also covered but there was a limit so I remember paying for some of the tuition.
    If I remember correctly in 2010 for students who paid full tuition for law school the cost was 60K per year and the cost of attendance for three years was closer to 180K.
    Lucky for us we paid fraction of that, even when at the time he enrolled I think they were on notice by the ABA, the notice was fully removed a year or so before his graduation.
    After passing the bar his first FT job as an Associate Attorney handling
    Medicare Claims Appeals payed in lower 70K per year.
    His second job as an Associate Attorney was already in 6 figures.
     
    MaceWindu likes this.
  15. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    How nice for him.
     
    MaceWindu and SweetSecret like this.
  16. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    Delayed suckification?
     
    Xspect and nosborne48 like this.
  17. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Yes...in the nature of a well baited trap. More like "Would you like a piece of candy, little girl?" But if the child's parents have done their job well, the kid sees the flashing red warning lights and runs. Law students aren't so well prepared.
     
    Maniac Craniac likes this.
  18. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    Isn't it the case that first professional programs are more expensive than other graduate programs at private universities? Private universities don't rely on state funding.
     
  19. sanantone

    sanantone Well-Known Member

    This is an angle I didn't think of. Similar to sports, the degree programs that bring in the most revenue subsidize other degree programs in lower-paying fields. State funding for higher education has been drastically cut across the board, so public colleges are deciding how they're going to allocate limited funding and which programs can survive higher tuition rates. If tuition rates were based on importance to society, medical school would be cheap.

    Another good point made in this article is that law school is more expensive because it's longer. You're paying for an additional year in comparison to most other master's-level programs.

    https://elawtalk.com/why-is-law-school-so-expensive/#:~:text=Law schools have to pay,for less financially successful programs.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2023
    MaceWindu likes this.

Share This Page