Ukraine - KROK + SMBS DBA - $5K Euro!

Discussion in 'Business and MBA degrees' started by AsianStew, May 31, 2022.

  1. AsianStew

    AsianStew Moderator Staff Member

    So, I was looking up universities in other countries again and decided on Ukraine!
    Please read on to see the red flag, a cheap program but unrecognized Swiss partner.

    Here's the international webpage for KROK, Link:
    And their business school programs, Link:

    In the middle, the Executive DBA caught my eye, and upon review, it's affordable!
    "The cost of the SMBS Executive Doctorate Degree distance course is 5,000 euros."

    Having said that, something else caught my eye, Swiss Montreux Business School.
    It seems they're working in partnership with this Swiss school I haven't heard of!

    Anyone got the time to do a bit of digging to see if this partnership is valid?
    Haha! I ask YOU, yes YOU who is reading this with researching the dynamic duo!
    Dustin likes this.
  2. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    There's a few of these Swiss business schools delivering DBAs kicking around. I am always suspicious because the people who are awarded them never end up teaching even on an adjunct basis or publishing. Their dissertations seem to be guarded by the schools and we rarely get more than platitudes from the students themselves, not the indepth feedback we see.
  3. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Even if the partnership is valid, the degree is pretty useless here. This Montreux thing is not a school which can award degrees recognized by the Swiss Federation. That applies to all distance schools in Switzerland. What you get will be evaluated, at best, as an unaccredited degree here - because that's what it IS. Just about any outfit can get a Cantonal License to award degree-looking papers, but they have no standing. To call a school a University - and /or to award meaningful, Swiss Federation recognized degrees, you need 100+ highly qualified professors, buildings, Research facilities and ongoing research, library holdings, yada yada...

    You get some Swiss schools that have agreements to award degrees from non-Swiss accredited (or equivalent) schools. Robert Kennedy College for example. You study there and you receive your degree from a legit British Uni. That's fine. Your British degree will have to be evaluated for use here, but you can be sure of what you will get.

    The Swiss have these rules to keep competition out and let the traditional universities serve their purpose.. and hey - it works!

    We have gone over this more than a hundred times. For how long will it be necessary?
    Last edited: Jun 1, 2022
    Dustin likes this.
  4. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I just looked up Montreux' accreditation statement:
    "SMBS holds various independent International and European accreditations that can be provided upon student’s requests."

    Not very confidence-inspiring...
  5. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    And as for the Ukrainian school -I see no evidence this is a distance program. So, do YOU want to be there (Ukraine) about now? Artillery fire is no joke. I'm not confident on how one of their degrees would be received here. It's a private not a State school. Let's ask the expert. @Stanislav Do you think this school's accreditation (KROK) would hold up, over here?

    Anyway, the DBA isn't awarded by KROK. It's awarded by the Montreux thingy, after 18 months of study with them, post-KROK. Why am I even looking at this. I can't be bothered.
  6. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    These dual and triple DBA thingys abound. A while ago, one of these Schweizerische con-job schools advertised a triple DBA - 3 diplomas, theirs, a valid, well-known Polish University and a school in Nicaragua or Costa Rica, I forget. The scheme imploded within weeks. Why? The Polish authorities clamped down. The Polish School was not allowed to award the degree because the DBA is not a recognized degree in Poland.

    Story here:

    Nothing new...
  7. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    And you have to do the Ukrainian on-ground thing first - before you do the distance Swiss thing that gets you the "DBA(?)."
  8. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    I've heard of KROK before. It's a private school; I didn't look it up recently but have no real doubt it is properly accredited. With very few exceptions, private schools are perceived as inferior to at least major public universities. I don't think KROK would be one of these exceptions (like eg. Ukrainian Catholic U.).

    "Business Administration" is not one of recognized fields of higher education in Ukraine (yet?), so their MBAs are regulated as further education credential. What KROK is doing is legit enough, but not regulated as "real" degree programs would. Kind of like these Swiss "business schools". Interestingly, KROK does seem to have doctoral and postdoctoral standing committees (in Economics, Management, and Law) - so if one is inclined to do a real doctorate with them, one can. There's an established procedure for assessment of PhDs done independently with a loose association with a school - you can ask if KROK does that.

    As for the Swiss DBA, it consists of 10 modules, each culminating in a 1500-word examining essay. The sum total of these 10 essays is their "doctoral thesis", This is not a doctorate.
    Johann, chris richardson and Dustin like this.
  9. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    @AsianStew You hear that, Bryan?
  10. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Thanks, Stanislav. I appreciate your expert opinion. Indeed, it appears possible to do a "real" doctorate with KROK, a PhD, but I think you'll agree, right now is not a good time to do ANY on-ground program in Ukraine. And that appears to be what KROK is offering, for all the advertised programs.
  11. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

  12. Johann766

    Johann766 Active Member

    I spent quite some time looking for DBA programs that are "private" or "propio" meaning from a recognized school but that are not a real doctorate. But I haven't found this program so thanks for posting ☺️

    In this case I don't really get it. Instead of offering a propio DBA by themselves Krok is promoting a school that is zero legitimate.

    They are basically even lying:

    "KROK Business School has a strategic partnership with SMBS, which has the highest accreditation from the Swiss government."

    The highest accreditation.......
  13. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Well - maybe whatever SMBS got (and I'm not quite sure what that is) is the highest of whatever type of endorsement it is. Degree granting permission from the State is what real (Federally recognized) Swiss Schools have and SMBS does NOT have that. Others may, as SMBS does, legally award degrees of lesser standing.

    KROK may have been conned by SMBS. It happens. Like the "real" Polish school that got slammed for awarding DBAs for another Swiss thingy, when no such degree exists in Poland. More than one good school has regretted partnership with some of these Swiss Cantonal things.

    Switzerland. Alps, skiing, very nice people --- but oh - some of those schools!
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2022
  14. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Besides how people design and make nice things for women to wear, my fashion course had some on-the-job advice. I liked "A watch is the first badge of responsibility."
    Nowhere did it say "a degree is the first badge ..." of anything, although the education needed for all types of fashion jobs was discussed.

    My take - if you're going to Switzerland, don't buy some ersatz Cantonal "degree" offered from a chalet someplace ... spend the same money on an excellent Swiss watch. Maybe a Girard-Perregaux, a Vacheron-Constantin, a Breguet, a Piaget, or my personal fave - a Baume & Mercier. (I can buy them here. A very knowledgeable lady in an upscale jewellery store gave me the catalog. She knows what I like.) Any one of these timepieces will last a lifetime and be a source of pride. Can you say the same for any of these loophole degrees? The watch will also do WAY more for your image. :)

    * After pandemic-delays, my last extravagance is now complete. I waited 55 years to get my custom, walnut-bodied Fender Telecaster guitar built. I think maybe one of those watches is next. And not in 55 years. :)
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2022
  15. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    And, unlike ANY degree, you can pass the watch along to a loved one when, at long last, you're um... finished with it. That's at 120 of course, G*d willing! :)

    As far as your image goes -yes, the watch will do a lot. So might the "degree" - but very likely not in a way you'd want.
    Last edited: Jun 3, 2022

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