Rushmore MBA

There are two different issues here. First is the JD from an unaccredited law school, which cannot be used to obtain a license in Oregon and the fact that the person passed the bar examination or in some other manner obtained admission to the bar in California or some other state. There are other means of becoming an attorney besides graduation from an ABA law school. In some states, including NY, one can take one year of coursework, do an apprenticeship with an attorney for not less than 3 years and then petition to take the examination. NY and several other states also allow the admission of a faculty member at an ABA law school. While it would be difficult to imagine, one could go to “Fred’s law school” in beautiful down town Los Angeles and then become a faculty member at a law school and petition for admission (which often does not require an examination).

So, back to the point. (1) I hold a JD from Fred’s…. I come to Oregon and want to become an attorney. Sorry, pal, no can do, school is on the list. (2) I hold a JD from Fred’s, and have been a practicing attorney in California for 5 years…. I come to Oregon and want to become an attorney. Under the current rules of many, but not all states, if you are a practicing attorney in another jurisdiction you can request either admission on motion or a special bar examination given to attorney applicants, which generally deals with the civil procedure statutes of the testing state. Many state, however, do put in a caveat that the person would otherwise be eligible to sit for the normal bar exam. In this last case, then I could not be admitted, since my degree from Fred’s would not allow me to sit for the exam in the first place.

NY, by the way, allows for admission on motion for an attorney who has practiced for 5 out of the prior 7 years, was admitted by examination, and is from a state that offers reciprocity to NY attorneys.

Again, however, I think this is missing the true point. ODA is not hiding out behind every bush waiting for you to mention Fred’s, they are simply saying that you may not use this degree in order to obtain admission or a license in Oregon. And, all in all, I support their efforts. If states like California, Louisiana, Hawaii and the like aren’t going to clean up their act as regards diploma mills, then it is reasonable and appropriate for states like Oregon to use their powers to stop the “graduates” of those schools from going to Oregon.

 

Re: withdrawing

Good Move, I believe that in this case is better not having a degree at all than having one from Rushmore. You better spend your time in somethig that will give you more satisfaction. Your experience in this board was just a taste of what you would experience all your life. If time is a concern and you don't care about the letters MBA, I would suggest you a graduate certificate in management that in a way is a mini MBA. There are many schools that offer such a program.
Regards,

 

Re: withdrawing

Now you know why I focus on the credential, not the educative process. Twenty-four years in this field tells me that they are distinct and separate. I didn't spend a word on the quality of a Rushmore education. But the credential.....oy.

 

Re: withdrawing

What interested you the most about the Rushmore program? Wa it the format of the course? If so, Touro's format is similiar.

Do a search on Touro, I had questions for a recent graduate about the program format.

 

Excellent points - which is why I’m concerned about the dual treatment. There are usually non-bar track students in many of these programs (paralegals and others who want to expand their knowledge of law). Would the State sanction the use of the degree by the attorney while criminalizing the degree of the non bar track student? What about the attorney with only a year’s experience, or the retired attorney who wasn’t interested in “practicing?”

I fully support disclosure; however, I know believe that it should be expanded to include all degrees. After all, I’ve now seen examples of:

50 unit MBAs that take 2 years
40 unit MBA’s that take a year.
Accredited BA degrees that include four years of intensive study
Accredited BA degrees that you can earn “in as little as four weeks.”
Unaccredited programs that require Study
Unaccredited programs the sell diplomas

While I may have dropped my RU program, I still feel that many of the for/against arguments are a bit hypocritical. Truth in advertising is requested for the non accredited programs, yet I’m sure those with a “four week” BA probably feel justified in listing their degrees from universities they never really attended (100% portfolio assessment). Many DL programs assure students that their transcripts and diplomas will never reflect their DL status- something I would actually be interested in seeing on a resume. How does the four week BA candidate reflect his time “in school?” I’m betting that the resume only reflects the graduation year. This wouldn’t be dishonest, but it does omit important information that most HR departments would be very interested in. I personally don’t think I’d even consider a job candidate who has gone this route (at least not when they’re competing with those who have “true” four year degrees). Of course, the way things are currently arranged, I would probably never know the difference. I’m sure the residential degree holder would feel just as harmed by the degree by proxy student.

The education value argument would probably make an excellent physiological study.

The Ivy Leaguer feels superior to the state school student
The state school student feels superior to the degree by proxy student
The degree by proxy student feels superior to the non accredited student
And so it goes…

As I delve into this topic deeper It seems to be a more a “Mine’s bigger than yours argument.” “My education may suck, but boy his education REALLY sucks.”

I came to this board I thinking I was going to find information about education. Instead, I found that many people are more interested in credentialization than scholarship. Maybe that’s representative of the nation as a whole. We’re more interested in getting a job than actually learning anything.

Well, I’m off to send my $$ to EBS. Bubble test, here I come.

 

Re: Re: withdrawing

Thanks. I will. Is this a research based program?

 

Can you give me any information from a student's point of view about Touro's MBA.

Certainly!

I am torn between Touro and Amberton. Although Amberton is cheaper per credit you have to factor in books.

I understand that Touro is $300.00 per credit, but there is no cost for books.

This is correct - all material is included on the CD-ROM for the coursework. There are no hidden fees for textbooks.

What type of examination did you have?
If by examination you are implying entrance examination, such as the GMAT - Touro does not require an entrance examination.

If, on the other hand, you are implying what types of examination (i.e. multiple choice, essay, etc.) are given to evaluate coursework - Touro does not utilize exams. Proficiency and competence are demonstrated in your ability to write about certain topics. Each course is divided into six modules that introduce a different aspect of the course you are studying. Minimally, for each module, you will write a case study (usually 3-5 pages), develop a session long project (usually 2-3 pages and spans all modules for a given course), and interact in an asynchronous discussion forum with your fellow classmates. To complete my degree, I usually took two courses a semester - which presented a lot of reading/writing - but was manageable. To finish with the concentrations I desired - I was required to do three courses during my last semester. This scenario was doable but required a lot of time.

What was contact like with other student and professors?
Contact with professors is incredible - I never sent an email to any of my professors that was not replied to within 24 hours. Graduate assistants are utilized in most courses (as it provides a significant reduction in tuition for a PhD) and are fairly prompt in grading coursework and providing feedback throughout the course.
Between public forums and course specific discussion forums you have amazing opportunities to interact with current classmates and students who have navigated the courses ahead of you.

Every time I think I have made a decision (just recently I was sure I was going to go apply at Amberton) I read something else about Touro that takes me back to the drawing board.

Touro provided a rich experience in which to complete an MBA. If you choose Touro you will not be disappointed.


Here are the questions I asked of Steven King who has recently completed the MBA program.

Good Luck

 

I received a USNY/Regents (now Excelsior) BS and in my case it was not a DL degree but a distance degree.
Except for one CLEP listing, my transcript lists all schools attended (around 10) in the UK and USA, dates, courses, lower/upper division, grade, and units.
My company required this transcript to document my acheivement, and of course CSUDH needed it prior to my entry into their MSQA program.
I do not have any ethical problems with stating that I have a "true four year degree" although it took me close to twenty years of coursework.

 

I’d defiantly classify your degree as a “true four year degree.” It sounds to me like you worked your b**t off.

I was speaking more to the four week BA degree. Would it be listed as: XYZ University; BA, Years attended: 1999-1999?

 

It is unnecessary to list dates attended on a resume. In fact, it is unnecessary to list even a graduation date. That you hold the degree is the issue, not how long it took to earn it, nor when it was earned.

Many job applications ask for enrollment dates. So give them. I've never once had anyone ask how I did an A.A. in two months, or two bachelor's degrees in 21 months. I was 20 years old and a veteran, when I earned my first bachelor's. It never came up then, and hasn't in the 23 years since. I wouldn't sweat it, nor would I hold that against someone. Who cares?

 

I’ve changed my mind in regard to EBS. I’m sure the program is as rigorous as people say, but after visiting the unofficial student site I’ve decided this is definitely not for me. I hadn’t realized that the each course grade was solely dependant upon one 3 hour exam (no coursework, papers, lectures or faculty interaction in the interim). Since I’m not a great test taker, this has the same attraction for me as putting a hot fireplace poker in my eye. I knew the program was exam based, but I didn’t realize tests accounted for 100% of the grade.

It looks like I’m going to take a break from B-School altogether (at least for awhile). It’s time for a little pleasure studying. An MBA is not required (in fact very rare) in my field, so It won’t hurt me to spend a year of so studying subjects I’m really interested in. - Some of the law related diplomas from the University of London seem like they’d be interesting.

On another note, I contacted RU late last week a notified them of my intention to withdraw from the program and asked that my name be removed from the student listing. I received a courteous reply from Doctor Cox only 12 hours later, and when I checked the site, they had already removed my personal information as requested.

Students leaving the program are put on “inactive” status and can pick up where they leave off (with both tuition and coursework). If RU ever decides to seek formal recognition, I may be back. For now, it’s time to spend a little time with Descartes.

 

If you are not a fan of exams, I suggest you to take a look at the MBA of the University of Liverpool. It is 100% online and consists
of research papers, assignments and discussion. Price is in the same range as Touro, Capella and JUI but from a B&M University.

www.kitcampus.com

 

Thanks! I hadn’t seen this one.

 

Hey,
What did you decide about Touro's MBA program? I am active duty in the Army and just completed it. I would be happy to provide specifics via private email if you desire. Email me at [email protected], if interested.

Kindly,
Steven King

 

blahetka wrote:

> Now that Rushmore has WAUC accredidation, which is not
> recognized by the US DOE, their accreditation page is MUCH
> shorter.

"Why unaccredited universities are usually not diploma mills
Diploma mills are universities that award degrees to students who do little or no work. Almost all diploma mills have accreditation from associations that are not recognized by the US Department of Education.
It is very easy to get accreditation from many associations not recognized by the US-DOE. Rushmore will not affiliate with any association with lax standards who accepts virtually all schools that apply."
-- Rushmore University, May 2000
http://web.archive.org/web/20000527124432/http://www.rushmore.edu/accreditation.htm

"From: Rushmore Information [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2002 11:59 PM [...]
We decided that the WAUC was not cost effective. Its accreditation was not worth the fees they charged for listing us [...]."
-- http://www.insureconsultants.com/Liz_Web_Page/Appendix_1_to_5.htm

 

blahetka wrote:

> Now that Rushmore has WAUC accredidation, which is not
> recognized by the US DOE, their accreditation page is MUCH
> shorter.

"Why unaccredited universities are usually not diploma mills
Diploma mills are universities that award degrees to students who do little or no work. Almost all diploma mills have accreditation from associations that are not recognized by the US Department of Education.
It is very easy to get accreditation from many associations not recognized by the US-DOE. Rushmore will not affiliate with any association with lax standards who accepts virtually all schools that apply."
-- Rushmore University, May 2000
http://web.archive.org/web/20000527124432/http://www.rushmore.edu/accreditation.htm

"From: Rushmore Information [mailto:[email protected]]
Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2002 11:59 PM [...]
We decided that the WAUC was not cost effective. Its accreditation was not worth the fees they charged for listing us [...]."
-- http://www.insureconsultants.com/Liz_Web_Page/Appendix_1_to_5.htm