Oh yea, O yea. Draw near, as 'tis the Season for (DEAC) Speculation....

Of course you're right, Ted. My apologies. It's U.S. COLLEGE SPORTS COACHES who are the multimillionaires. They often get $5 or $6 Million, while a professor gets, what? $100K? Bit more, maybe?

J.

 

Leaders? Members of Parliament? :shock:

Well, it happened. Here's one. We were talking, many posts ago, about California Miramar U. The school is currently re-applying to DEAC, which they dropped some time after acquiring ACICS accreditation. When they were originally accredited by DEAC (DETC then) tuition went immediately from around $85 a credit to ~$160, IIRC.

That's because it wasn't, of course. I made yet another mistake. Lansbridge, also in New Brunswick (and now closed) was DETC-accredited. Meritus was owned by Apollo Group (think U. of Phoenix) and approved to operate by the Province of NB like the other distance universities. Sorry.

J.

 

The counterargument for that has always been "you get paid commensurate to the money you generate". No question, instructors are important, but when your coach wins a lot of games for a football program that brings in 100 Million dollars a year, naturally he's going to get the bigger salary. This obviously doesn't apply in every profession, but in collegiate sports it definitely applies.

 

My contention has always been that there should (preferably) be no such thing as collegiate sports. I say school is for learning - not sports. At the very least, no big-money stuff. If football generates so much money, why doesn't college cost 'way less than it does? I'm told one reason is that many of these college sports mega-operations are not very profitable - sometimes not at all. No good bringing in $100 million, if $102 million is going out.

We don't have that kind of nonsense in Canadian schools. Last I looked, head coaches got a reasonable living - $70+ to $150K. A (literal) handful of outliers would make $200K or a bit more. And school costs, on average, less here than in the US. That's why we have so many American students - up 50% in the last few years. They're catching on to a good thing.

J.

 

Not as it exists in the US. Even the recruiting of student athletes can be underhanded and illegal. Yet it persists.

 

Just to clarify...

The way WES handles the evaluation of NA degrees for Canada is not to say "Nope, it's total bull." They handle it, in my mind, rather diplomatically and much more so than some on this forum would lead you to believe.

It will note that your degree would be equivalent to a degree of that level from an "unrecognized school." It notes, however, that for their purposes they only consider RA degrees to be equivalent to Canadian degrees however the degree is fully accredited by a USDOE accredited institution in the U.S.

The end result, one could argue, is the same. But it's a bit more nuanced than some lead you to believe. How the government handles that is one thing. But the softened language is likely to help out with employment (at a minimum, it's better than an outright "No!").

 

I'm not sure there's any difference in this distinction, Neuhaus. Just Canadian "politeness" serving to (barely) mask low-grade anti-Americanism. WES language gives just enough cover to reject a DEAC degree.

Interestingly, I'm pretty sure there was at least one professional society that purported to accept "USDoE-approved accreditation". Can't find it now.

 

College sports are not all big-name basketball and football.

 

There too is a "second tier" of degree granters in Canada; it's just less prominent and less understood. Let's assume the "normal" degree granters, publicly supported Universities that are members of Universities Canada, are the "first tier". Below them are:
1. Private schools, like Trinity Western or Redeemer, that have both provincial chapter and are in Universities Canada. Major ones are religious. They are basically accepted, but a minority prefers public. Distinct stigma is evident.
2. Degree-granting colleges (eg., George Brown). Not everyone knows what to make of these. In Ontario, colleges have basically good reputation, but it's not like there's no distinction from universities (or Sheridan wouldn't want to become one).
3. Private for-profits approved by provinces (NB, BC and now Ontario as well). Eg., Yorkville. Non-DL: University Canada West and a college that I don't recall now. There's a school here in Toronto, RCC Institute of Technoilogy, that maintained a degree granting status for decades (it's a division of Yorkville now).
4. Religious colleges operating under "ministerial consent", or in some cases under their own Acts of Legislature. There's around a dozen of these in Ontario; some accredited by ABHE, some not. I had a friend attending FaithWay Baptist Church in Ajax; they have their own college that seems very "church basement'y" to me.
5. A handful of specialized degree granters. For them, ""tier" distinction is irrelevant: to become a chiropractor, for example, you go to CMCC to get your DC degree; it's not "second tier" because there's no "first". Same for naturopathy: the only two accredited schools are private.
This does not even go into loosely-regulated career college universe. Some provide training programs that promise entrance into regulated fields. Some operate in the shadows because the career in question is not regulated (like that Manual Osteopathy school; also, every other Manual Osteopathy school).

There is totally a "second tier". Canadians are just less honest about it.

 

I doubt WES is concerned with Canadian politeness. They are probably more concerned with covering themselves as if they worded it as though NA degrees were diploma mill degrees they would be exposing themselves to liability. South of the border, we're a bit more litigious than our neighbors to the North. And I can imagine an American having a job offer rescinded because WES tried to put Ashworth on equal footing with Almeda could very easily result in an unfortunate legal situation. Particularly, as I've noted before, since WES isn;'t going to every country to evaluate these standards. Much of the acceptance is based on a country's accreditation framework. Legally, there is nothing in US law to set the RAs above the NAs. We don't have a tiered system. WES is free to evaluate as they see fit. But if their decision is being used for government purposes, is not based on them actually lining up the coursework side by side, and causes someone to take a financial loss...

Better to instead use somewhat vague language, add a bunch of caveats and try to shield yourself from our yankee lawyering ways.

As an aside, however, I've applied to a number of jobs in Canada. I've interviewed for five or six. None of them have asked for my degree evaluation. I asked two outright and they waved it off as "an immigration thing" that interested them not at all.