1. eriehiker

    eriehiker Active Member

  2. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I came across the link below on the NextGen website which indicates if you are not affiliated with a sponsoring university, you can still take the degree courses and subsequently be awarded your master's degree by Euclid University.

    I believe this U. is mainly located in Bangui, Central African Republic, with some kind of admin. location only in California US. Although (I believe) it has some affiliation or MOU with a legit. Central African Uni. in C.A.R., Euclid U. (Pole Universitaire Euclide) itself is not a recognized University in CAR and acceptance of its degrees has long been problematic (or nonexistent) here in US.

    We have several threads at DI which have reached this conclusion, some over the protest of Euclid U. officials. See this link from NextGen U's website:


    Other considerations aside, please note that the course appears to be intended for students in developing countries. 70% are from Africa and over 100 countries are represented. I don't think this is fertile hunting territory for free-degree-hunters from developed nations. Nor do I think it should be.

    I realize the school (Euclid U.) may have very good intentions but the prevailing opinion here at DI is that those intentions cannot not add up to accreditation suitable for US use. Use of the DI search engine will reveal some juicy arguments.
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2020
  3. LearningAddict

    LearningAddict Well-Known Member

    Euclid is one issue. Another issue is the officiality (or lack thereof) of NextGenU's medical programs. They seem to be pointing to loose associations that may lead nowhere for a student in the end. The American medical education system is so strict that it's highly unlikely any school would just use their system to offer a medical school program regardless of it being free just because that connection may make it very difficult to gain the type of acceptance needed for licensure.

    I don't know. Seems like a place with good intentions, but for a program to be valuable that's not enough.
    Johann likes this.
  4. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Good summary, I think. :) Took me many more words to say the same thing.
  5. Thorne

    Thorne Member

    Absolutely a good summary, at least for students in first world countries. I can see the value in working through such a program if you're from a developing nation and want to help your local area...maybe.
    Johann likes this.
  6. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Euclid is an interesting beast. It's an "international treaty" signed by several countries; they claim admin offices in CAR and The Gambia. They did get UNESCO listing as a CAR university, so there's that. It's an interesting beast, though I agree it's perhaps too much for a potential North American student to explain.
  7. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    They claim that their Preventative Medicine residency is developing a pilot site in South Texas with University of Incarnate Word. Google search confirms that, indeed, UIW is developing a Preventative Medicine residency in San Antonio, it somehow integrates an MPH degree, and it seems some of the same people are involved. Here: https://tigmer.com/preventive-medicine .

    If these things are indeed related, that'll confer a lot of legitimacy on NextGenU. Ecpecially if the San Antonio residency will be accredited by ACGME. Still, may not be a practical choice for most, though.
    LearningAddict likes this.
  8. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Euclid has a long history at DI. Dr. John Bear once set out to find the North American headquarters and succeded. They were in a nice double-wide mobile home in California. Euclid's DI history includes a record number of "threats of the week" -THREE of them, IIRC. Good post by you, here, Stanislav. https://www.degreeinfo.com/index.php?threads/information-about-euclid-university.22510/page-3#post-230403

    Couple by me there, too. Not among my worst, either - at least as I see things. And I was right about Mali. As it turned out, things did get a lot worse in Bamako. Glad I didn't take up teaching English there. Somebody in that thread said there were lots of jobs. Could have been big trouble.
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2020
  9. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    At the end of the day, if you need a binder full of organized documents you carefully gathered to explain how your school is legitimate then you should probably find another option.

    I put Euclid along with many other schools of questionable provenance. I don't dedicate brain power to deciphering its legitimacy. If legitimacy is not apparent to me, or the people on this board, it will absolutely not be apparent to someone who doesn't engage in this weird little accreditation hobby we all share.

    For schools like this operating in international grey areas that there is no clear answer for one can certainly pay them the money. But then one ought not be shocked if someone turns around one day and says that the degree is bogus. Euclid is weird because for every red flag they send up indicating they may be an Axact type of situation you periodically find some affiliation that makes them seem more legitimate. Normal schools don't have that sort of back and forth, however. YMMV and enter at your own risk.

    I hate to bring up MIGS since, seriously, that poor dead horse has been thoroughly flogged. But I don't see the black and white fault in all of that as our own Dr. Levicoff does. I see why people focused on the legitimate looking aspects. I see why people focused on the red flags. I see why, as time went on, those things shifted. I see why international differences and a language barrier interfered with research into it. My approach is not to write off all schools because of this one. Rather, it's to only dedicate about 15 minutes, tops, to considering whether something is legitimate (or legitimate enough, as the case often is) before moving on.
    innen_oda likes this.
  10. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    ...which seems to be the point, yes. This is an interesting concept - a course provider that is a charity. Their hope is for students to partner with locally-accredited institutions, which would be awarding credits and degrees. Euclid is there to pick up the slack if local option is not available - which, incidentally, is the whole declared point of Euclid. It's hard to tell for sure because track record is thin, but there is evidence Euclid had transitioned from a vanity project of Fr. Laurent and friends into something resembling a real institution. That would not be unprecedented.

    Here's the founder of NextGenU: https://www.spph.ubc.ca/person/erica-frank/ . She's a full professor and Canada Research Chair (a very prestigious thing) at the University of British Columbia. NextGenU ran courses it designed at accredited schools (including Uniformed Services University of Health Sciences), and published action research in peer reviewed journals. They try to build a residency program in San Antonio. So yes, this thing is a sincere effort. It may well turn out that Dr. Frank was too ambitious and the thing will collapse - but again, it may not. In the meantime, programs they offer do have value. Is this enough of a reason to go get a Euclid degree? Probably not, but I wouldn't blame someone for doing it. Especially if "you're from a developing nation and want to help your local area".

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