Looking for an affordable PhD/DBA/DSc or similar program

Dr. Douglas,

My response pertained to an application … and if the disclosure is requested. I too have had U.S. government security clearances at a high level (TS/SBI) via DIA and FBI. In fact BI information was required even proceeding my 18th birthday (as I recall; as far back as 3rd grade). In that I am now in the education industry, applications clearly require [all] education disclosure along with transcripts.

Again my response was based solely upon IF the question/s was asked regarding an application, the decision to apply, and one’s veracity in answering said question/s completely and truthfully. And I believe the initial respondent’s reply if he decides to submit, via omision, with said application reasoning ... it’s none of their %&#@* business is erroneous.

 

I've had MANY HR reps tell me flat out, that they will not hire PhDs.

 

If I applied for a corporate job I would not list my PhD. I would not list my CCU degrees either. It would just be too much. I don't think I would list my UoP degree either. Maybe just:

•Graduate Certificate in Healthcare Risk Management – University of Florida - 2007
•MS in Information Technology Management – Touro University International – 2004
•BS in Individualized Studies (Technology & Business) – Charter Oak State College - 2003
•Bio-Medical Repair Specialist Diploma – U.S. Army Bio-Medical Repair School – 1991

 

And I've NEVER seen it, nor have I heard of it directly. Ever. Just aprocryphal stories or broad generalizations.

IF I actually ran up against such a situation, I would be relieved to know about it, since, like Ted, I would not want to work for such a stupid person. And as a hiring manager, I'd be pretty angry at the HR rep who pulled that kind of stunt.

 

Did those HR reps divulge to you their reason/s for such a decision? If so, I’d be interested as to why this seeming preconceived notion would/does exist pertaining to not hire Ph.D. (s). As I mentioned earlier in this thread, it could be quite difficult coming from the outside with a doctorate unless this degree level were a stipulation for the position.

 

What business sector were these HR reps from?
In my long experience the only time my first contact was not with a hiring manager was on a classified program where the first contact was security (the interview was classified).

 

Much of what can go on in HR isn’t generally out in the open. People are people, including their bias/s (a fallibility of man); and there are HR departments /personnel as well as there are organizations and even hiring managers that do discriminate; surely you wouldn’t deny its existence (?). But someone once said “…it’s not what you know … but what you can prove.”

 

These are some of the reasons I was given by various recruiters who have attend the UF career fair when asked the question, "Are you interested in hiring a PhD?":

1. A PhD is too specialized for what we are looking for.
2. If we really needed a PhD, we would hire one on a contract basis, not as an employee.
3. A PhD would jump ship at the next better offer or a position in academia.
4. We are interested in managers, not "lab rats" or "researchers."
5. We have hired PhDs before, and they were more interested in telling us how to do things, rather than learning/working with the team.
6. A PhD would most likely demand a higher salary than what we are willing to pay.

Not everyone I spoke with had the same attitude, but an overwhelming majority did. The lesson I have learned from all this, is that unless the job requires/prefers a PhD, don't mention it.
__________________

 

Very true. Most of the reasons I listed were not given during the "official" recruitment fair, but after a few beers at "The Swamp", a popular bar along University Ave across from UF.

 

Thanks for your response to my question regarding the reasons given to you by HR personnel in avoiding doctorate holders.

 

True – unless there is an application for employment involved that requires listing the degree (e.g., list degrees conferred /awarded).

 

You missed the entire point. The prospective employer needs to know relevant education and experience. Since MBA degrees are not particularly relevant to a fast food cook position, a restaurant manager does not need to know about them. Conversely, since prior work experience in fast food is not particularly relevant to a position as a business professional, then that does not need to be disclosed. Or do you not grasp the concept of relevance?

 

Rich: If an employment ad asks for a master's degree and you tell them about your master's degree, you've truthfully given the employer the info they asked for. Do you need to tell them about working for a furniture warehouse? Only if you plan on working in a furniture warehouse again!

 

No I didn’t; and yes Ted I do identify relevance. Hey I even know what its definition is – which doesn’t make me anything unique. However, the only pertinent point I wanted to make in my posting had to do with integrity in answering questions fully and truthfully w/o selected exclusion IF the information were to be asked for on an application for employment. It’s not your or my preference on what information is or is not relevant to a potential employer if the question/s is asked; we simply have: 1) the option whether or not to apply, 2) officially decline to answer, 3) answer fully and truthfully, or 4) answer seemingly your way … deceptively via omission. Your definition regarding relevance I believe was something to the effect “… it’s none of their %&#$@ business" … what bravado!

Please don’t undertake substantiating your response by turning the point to another topic, e.g., relevance thru your eyes only. Moreover, your response/s in trying to rationalize deliberate omission merely because you believe the information request immaterial – that mind-set could be taken quite some distance. BTW, changing behaviors is exceedingly difficult; organizational development /change can/does fail because of this one dynamic.

 

Only if the application and/or potential employer ask you where you were employed during the time you actually worked for the “furniture” warehouse. That’s relevant Ted.

 

Omitting irrelevant information is not deception. Obviously, you do have a problem with the concept of relevance.

 

Once again we’re back to [your] determining relevance for everyone. Relevance is not conceptual Ted in respect of [if] the question were asked; one should just answer fully and truthfully. However, some consistently try and justify their inconsistency. Recall what I mentioned about changing behaviors. I’m done with you on this one Ted; there’s no money in it. But it has been character enlightening.

 

This is getting silly - if it asks for ALL information then disclose ALL information. If it asks for RELEVENT information then disclose RELEVENT information. I have had a candidate down to the final step and an offer was not extended because they withheld something and it would not have even mattered if they were honest.

 

Your calling my honesty into question constitutes a personal attack within the meaning of the Terms Of Service agreement which you consented to when you joined this board.

MODS: Deal with it!

 

Exactly … Your point is made and noted. Perhaps seemingly irrelevant questions are asked merely to test a applicant /candidate’s openness or not (?).