IRA lay down arms

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by Charles, Sep 26, 2005.

  1. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    According to there were riots in 2021 in Londonderry and Belfast. That was awhile ago but the border hasn't really hardened yet. It will. It has to unless Northern Ireland separates from the UK.
  2. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    As for unifying the island, the Protestant majority in Northern Ireland would have to willingly agree to go from running their own affairs to becoming an unloved minority ruled from Dublin. Possible? Sure. Likely? I don't think so.

    Joining the EU was a British blunder but the (understandable) decision to leave was obtained by the Conservatives through a series of transparent lies and deliberate mis-representations to the electorate. I frankly don't know where the Isles go from here.
  3. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Charles was right and everyone else was wrong. I'll quickly add though that everyone else had already expressed that they hoped Charles would be right. :D;):)

    It's actually a very complicated issue. Makes current US politics look boringly simple.
    SteveFoerster and Charles Fout like this.
  4. Charles Fout

    Charles Fout Active Member

    Thanks, Bill. Really, deep down, my recent commentary is simply an appreciation of the Clintons' contribution to the Peace process. I get it. It will be a continuing process. Many years ago it seemed impossible to me.

    November 1993, I was on the way from NAS Brunswick Maine to my new duty station, Andros Island, Bahamas. As was common, I was traveling in my dress uniform. I was on a smaller jetliner traveling from Portland, Maine to New York to catch my connecting flights. Senator George Mitchell was sitting several rows ahead of me. At the time, he was being considered for Special Envoy or some such for Northern Ireland. He was also being considered for Baseball Commissioner. Upon landing in New York, I dashed up to him - Introduced myself. He probably only stopped because I was in uniform. I said DON'T bother with Northern Ireland. It's hopeless. He laughed at this young Sailor's warnings and asked me why the Navy was sending me to the Bahamas. The rest is, as they say, history. Chelsea Clinton has every right to be proud of her parents' legacy regarding the north of Ireland. Her little cameo in "Derry Girls" was brilliant and appropriate. <3
  5. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    I should have mentioned, even though I didn't post in this thread back in 2005, if I had, I too would have been extremely skeptical that we'd see peace hold for as long as it has.
    Charles Fout likes this.
  6. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

  7. nosborne48

    nosborne48 Well-Known Member

    Ah. Well that does make a difference of course.
  8. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    The article indicates that the lines have blurred somewhat. More folks are just considering themselves northern Irish rather than British versus Irish. Blurred lines is probably a good thing for future stability.
    nosborne48, mintaru and Charles Fout like this.
  9. Greeneyedpea81

    Greeneyedpea81 New Member

    Hello all, I know this is a older thread, but I have a question pertaining to Ireland. It’s not exactly on topic, but I’ve learned if you go back in history and work your way forward, politics starts to make mor sense.

    I noticed that Ireland experienced three famines and sometime in the early 1700s some Palatine Boors or Germans were sent to Ireland and United States, per the Queen.

    Irish Famine (1740–1741)(Bliain an Áir)
    Great Famine (1845–1852) (an Gorta Mór)
    Irish Famine, 1879 (An Gorta Beag)

    Because of events that took place on the island, some natives left Ireland and the demographics changed. The famines seemed to be caused or partially by politics.

    I also noticed that some Irish were sent to one of the islands during the transatlantic slave trade to establish a trade business. But then again, some sources say that Irish migrants in US were treated like crap, but with the help of the Catholic Church were able to rise out of that position.

    Does anyone know much about any of this or history around this period?
    Side: I’m still trying to learn who the palatine Germans were. I’m interested b/c whoever they were, they were not liked by the Crown or BFranklin.
  10. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Can it also be seen as a privileged community clinging to its privileges?

    I am biased here, but I can't help myself seeing analogies with Ukraine. Consequently, I see how oppressed people (republican Irish/ independist Ukrainian) can be drawn to support a deeply flawed faction seen as the only effective unit fighting on "our side" (IRA/OUN-B). Conversely, I have a very limited patience for the "Unionist" political programme. Side with the colonizer, be treated with indifference - or as a colonizer.
  11. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    The Ulster Protestants have been there for 400 years. How much longer before they're not "colonizers"?
  12. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    Until they let go of the privileges that the colonizing regime gave them. As in, in Nosbourne's words, "decades of Unionist discrimination against Catholics along with the atrocities committed by a brutal police force" - hardly 400 years ago.

    Seriously, your argument sounds too structurally identical to putinist claim to East and South of Ukraine to win me over. "Genocide then plebiscite".

    P. S. I had an opportunity to claim an identity not unlike "Ulster Protestant" - a "Russophone Ukrainian". I'm pleased that my children do not speak Russian.
  13. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    If they're oppressors, then by all means call them that. "Colonizers" may be a fashionable epithet these days, but it implies that Ulster Protestants should "go home", which isn't particularly reasonable.
  14. Stanislav

    Stanislav Well-Known Member

    ...or, alternatively, they just can stop being pawns of the empire. Most will end up doing just that.

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