I hate to beat a dead horse but Excelsior name change?

Re: a good question

Oh, I think that there may be a few worse...

American Public University System (WV)
Transylvania University (KY)
Teikyo Post University (CT)
Ursinus College (PA)
Rutgers-The State University of New Jersey
Ramapo College of New Jersey
New School University (NY)
University System College for Lifelong Learning (NH)
John Jay College of Criminal Justice of the City University of New York
Alliant International University (CA)
Hope International University (CA)
Maharishi University of Management (IA)

...to name just a few.

This, of course, does not include the many colleges and universities named after people with unusual last names or after the cities in which they are located (many with pretty wierd names).

Tony

 

Well, let's see if I can recap the interview acurately.

Him: So, I see you have a 4 year degree in Administration
Me: I have a Bachelor of Science in Liberal Studies with focus in Administrative Management
Him: Were did you graduate?
Me: I graduated from a college in New York named Excelsior.
Him: You went to school in New York?
Me: My first 2 years were at Local_State_College_Name_Here, and then I transferred to Excelsior's Distance learning program to finish my degree.
Him: Oh, so like an E-degree. You take classes online and stuff?
Me: Excelsior allows its students to take online classes or do sort of a indepedent study and then take a final exam to grade their learned knowledge of the subject.
Him: So if you're taking a test online, how do they know you're not cheating?
Me: *chuckle* No, you have to go to monitored testing centers to complete such tests.

Conversation sorta swithced gears from here. A few minutes later...

Him: Oh, so let's see, you took a class in organizational behavior, huh? So, you should be able to tell me what the main organizational prinicple is.
Me: Oh..hmm...I can't recall that off the top of my head.
Him: *says something like* You can change someone's action's, but never their motivation for the actions.
Me: ahh
Him: *smugly* Did you test that class out?
Me: Yes
Him: I guess you should have really taken that course. Ya, you can never change someone's reason for doing something.
Me: *smiles* oddly enough, there are probably some management classes that would teach you definitely can change that.
Him: *looks at me like I'm an idiot*


Okay, that was a recap for Mark and Rant. ^_^ I'm not so sure the excelsior name had much to do with his perception of my degree, or if it was the way I explained it, or just biases he already had towards non-traditional education. I suppose I could have went into a whole thing explaining its accredidation and history, but to me it seemed that having to say all those things makes it look like my degree needs to be defended. I don't naturally defend it, because I feel it needs no defense. I think in the end, this particular employer felt uneasy about me and thought I was trying to be decietful.

 

And just WHAT is wrong with Transylvania University?
Not to mention Ursinus (where are the Calvinists on this board?).

 

Randy_Excelsior wrote:

> Him: So if you're taking a test online, how do they know
> you're not cheating?
> Me: *chuckle* No, you have to go to monitored testing centers
> to complete such tests.

It might be worth mentioning that Excelsior College Exams are accepted for credit at over 800 other colleges. You can't say that Excelsior's degrees are more rigorous than other RA degrees (since they accept all other RA credits, they can't be); but you certainly can say that Excelsior College Exams are rigorous.

You might also say that Excelsior College was founded by the New York State Department of Education in 1971, hence somewhat precedes the "e-degree".

 

> So, you should be able to tell me what the main
> organizational prinicple is.
> Me: Oh..hmm...I can't recall that off the top of my head.
> Him: *says something like* You can change someone's action's,
> but never their motivation for the actions.

Curiously, Google seems never to have heard of this principle! Wouldn't the main principle be something like "Behavior is learned through reinforcement"?

 

I would have probably taken the interview in a different direction, focusing on the fact that Excelsior not an "e-degree". To many people, particularily those inclined to look down on distance learning, an "online class" means sitting in your underwear or pyjamas on a computer taking a DL course. I take my courses and standardized exams at real, accredited institutions or authorized testing centers and transfer results to Excelsior for credit.

Sounds like he's the idiot, and prejudiced. If your degree said "Harvard" would he ask stupid questions as well? Did he read that organizational behavior question that morning in the paper or something and was trying to prove something? Who knows...

What if you had completed the degree 10 years ago - would you still remember this? Was the question relevant to the position you were being hired for? For example, was the position related to organizational behavior? What if he'd asked you a question about Keynsian economic theory?

Assuming your recall is accurate, the question was poorly worded to begin with. As a suggestion, the next time you get asked this type of question (i.e. really ambiguous) send it back to him as opposed to admitting defeat - "Can you tell me the context of the question? There are many aspects to organizational behavior". If he doesn't know what he's talking about he'll drop it, or hopefully tell you where he "read" it. If he's an expert, then he's obviously above you - as you only took a one semester course (or equivalent exam). I'm assuming that you remember SOMETHING from this exam of course!

If you were going for an entry-level position or if you had no relevant experience I could understand perhaps grilling you on your education but otherwise when I hire I look at the degree, ask a few questions about it and then drill down into the work experience as that will really tell me what the person knows.

Don't let it get to you...

Cheers,
Mark

 

Thanks for the interview play by play

I knew there had to be more to the interview then the mere mention of the name Excelsior causing a ruckus.

Thanks Tony for the names of those schools. My wife is an alumna of Rutgers and when I read the original post to her she was like: "Excelsior does not sound any weirder than Rutgers."

Hell Charter Oak isn't the most poetic name a school was ever dubbed.

 

Question - does Excelsior have a "distance learning" program?

As it has no residency requirement and accepts credit from just about any RA institution there is no available distinction between DL and non-DL. Even if you lived in Albany you'd still have to follow the same process as everyone else, except perhaps that Excelsior will proctor CLEP and ECE (and perhaps DANTES as well).

If there's further confusion as to Excelsior's legitimacy, then mention the fact that it's been around for more than 30 years, and point them to the Middle States website.

Cheers,
Mark

 

I hate the name Excelsior too, but I also didn't like Charter Oak because we have a mental hosptial here called Charter Ridge and I was absolutely terrified I'd refer to COSC as Charter Ridge and really get an interviewer in a tizzy.

 

> "Excelsior does not sound any weirder than Rutgers."

Everyone has heard of Rutgers, so there is no weirdness apparent.

Likewise, everyone has heard of Harvard, so there is no weirdness apparent. If Harvard were an obscure college, someone might say, "Harvard? That sounds a bit like Slarty Bartfast. Maybe a cross between Slarty Bartfast, aardvark, and 'Har, har, Billy'?"

(Yes, I know the correct spelling is Slartibartfast.)

 

Mark just curious....are we saying that Excelsior is some obscure college?

 

Yes, Excelsior College is obscure enough that many hiring managers haven't heard of it. A lot of people probably know of only one largely-DL college: University of Phoenix. If they know of two, the second one might be Kennedy-Western.

I had spent most of my life in academia (my father is a professor, I had a Master's degree, and I had worked mostly in academic settings); and I had never heard of "Regents College" or "Excelsior College" until I got married and bought Bears' Guide to look into degree options for my wife. Not a single friend I've mentioned it to in the past few years has ever heard of it, either.

 

Back to my original inquiry...as a lifetime academic, and son of a college professor, are there any traditional colleges with "weird names" that you have not heard of before? Are there no schools that are brick and mortar that are "obscure"? The reason that I am asking the question in the first place is that I do not believe that is merely a name that causes such an issue as there must be countless schools that you have heard of before, and that from the son of a bus driver

By the way there is an old Arabic saying that I translated recently that means: "Absence of the knowledge of a thing does not necessitate its absence."

 

> are there any traditional colleges with "weird names" that
> you have not heard of before? Are there no schools that are
> brick and mortar that are "obscure"?

There sure are.

It was a bit less of a problem in the brick-and-mortar days, because people tended to have attended local colleges, which other people in the area tended to have heard of. But I'm sure some people who relocated had college names on their CVs that raised eyebrows.

> I do not believe that is merely a name that causes such an
> issue

A convincing-sounding name can really help, as Rich Douglas's research has demonstrated. Hiring managers expressed strong approval for "Columbia State University" (a notorious diploma mill), simply because of its name.

 

???Riddle me this???

Was Columbia State University (a well known diploma mill) such a hit because it had a "convincing" name or was it because it so closely resembled the name Columbia University (not a well known diploma mill)?

The second question..in the brick mortar days did people travel outside of there locality to study at schools that may have had "obscure" names?

 

Before I forget...I am not a fan of the name Excelcior, I am sure they could have come up with a better name, but in the end a rose by any other name would smell as sweet.

 

I feel I step my foot on a mine in countering Dr. Bear, but...

As I read it, USNY can at no time have been considered an alma mater as it has never been a school. In fact, I'd say that, by the strict standards of most on this board, those listing USNY in CV are engaging an unwittingly dishonest practice.

BTW - Is L'Hommedieu not as religious a name as can be?

 

Uncle Janko wrote:

> And just WHAT is wrong with Transylvania University?

Elie Wiesel has said that, when he first came to the US, he couldn't understand the funny looks people gave him when he said he was born in Transylvania. He had never heard of Dracula. He added, "Well, now I know."

 

Do tell.

 

America is at once very diverse and very provincial.

"Transylvania" sounds like a bizarre Hollywood name - yes, Bela Lugosi and Dracula, while "Ursinus" sounds like "Uranus, " (a funny planet name itself!) or a sinus infection.

Branding is forever a very American quest!

--Orson