Has anyone got a job using a Fairfax University Degree?

I feel Fairfax University is a school that can serve the needs of a mature learner with an unusual educational background. However I'm left with a practical question hanging : Can you actually get a job with a Fairfax University degree? Can anyone provide useful information regarding this issue? Thank you.

 

Sure. You can also be excluded from one. That can be said regarding just about any university's degrees, but more so with degrees from schools lacking proper accreditation (like Fairfax).

Degrees from Fairfax university would be useless in--and possibly detract from--any situation where a properly accredited degree was required.

 

In general unaccredited degrees have very minimal utility. There are exceptions but Fairfax is not one of them. Typically when I've heard of any real utility being made from an unaccredited degree it has been due to a mistake on the part of the employer when evaluating the degree or the degree was not a requirement for the job in the first place.

The only area that I've seen clear utility being made of an unaccredited degree is when the the degree was to satisfy a personal need.

 

Go ask them at Fairfax!

Although you may get a biased response, I'd go and ask Fairfax itself! Fairfax (or any other institution's) bias is not going to be any stronger than the often ill-founded views expressed by some people on this board who 'pronounce' without supplying ANY empirical evidence to support their sweeping statements about the utility of a Fairfax award and indeed those of some other unaccredited institutions. I've just looked at the Fairfax web site and if you go to the various newsletters posted there they do provide some unsolicited evidence from graduates who comment on the value of their Fairfax degrees. The fact that major universities in the US, UK and elsewhere have accepted Fairfax graduates onto other (accredited) programmes at least tells me there is something positive going on there!

'telfax'

 

Interestingly, the Senior Editor of Bible Reference at Tyndale House Publishers in the U.S. holds a Ph.D. in theology from Fairfax University. Dr. Philip Comfort has served as a professor of New Testament studies at Wheaton College (regionally accredited) and Trinity Episcopal School for Ministry (accredited by ATS), and is the site coordinator for Columbia International University's seminary extension (regionally accredited) in Pawleys Island, South Carolina. Comfort has published numerous books in the field of biblical studies, including Text of the Earliest New Testament Greek Manuscripts, Origin of the Bible, and Essential Guide to Bible Versions. He's also published articles in noted journals such as New Testament Studies (a major accomplishment in this field!), Tyndale Bulletin, and Notes on Translation. Dr. Comfort's work has earned the praise of noted scholars such as Bruce M. Metzger (Princeton Theological Seminary), Michael W. Holmes (Bethel College), and J. K. Elliott (University of Leeds).

With that said, I think Dr. Comfort's various positions in academia are largely owed to his extensive publishing record and held in spite of his Ph.D. from Fairfax University. In other words, Dr. Comfort is a noted exception amongst those who hold such a degree in his field of specialty (I cannot speak for other disciplines). He was, in my opinion, destined for success in his work due to his enormous capabilities in research and writing. If I'm not mistaken, Dr. Comfort was teaching Greek at Wheaton College before he received the Ph.D. from Fairfax University, and I have a hunch his publication record would be just as extensive without it.

 

Accredited

In my situation, such a degree wouldn't be worth much. I work in state government, and any degrees or college credits that qualify an applicant for a job must be from a school accredited by one of the following:

Middle States Association of Colleges and Secondary Schools
New England Association of Schools and Colleges
North Central Association of Colleges and Secondary Schools
Northwest Association of Secondary and Higher Schools
Southern Association of Colleges and Secondary Schools
Western Association of Schools and Colleges

On a similar note, I wonder if someone has a degree from a school a potential employer has never heard of, I wonder how many check it out. Some stories I've heard suggest not. I went to a very small school most have never heard of, but it is RA(Southern Associataion of Colleges and Schools), and its business school is AACSB accredited. Still, its name is not well known outside of my state or the surrounding area.

In my situation, it doesn't matter if the non-RA school gives me a better education than the RA school, my employer, and I'm sure some others, will simply not recognize the credits or the degree. That is just the way it is.

RedStickHam

 

Re: Go ask them at Fairfax!

Taking your comments further, California Coast graduates seems to have some success ... as quoted by Salmon on the other site..

John Alexander, Spelman College: http://www.spelman.edu/registrar/catalog/faculty.pdf. Also http://www.spelman.edu/math/alexander.html

George Andrea, Baltimore: http://www.ubalt.edu/hsm/hsmfaculty.htm. Also Goucher: http://www.goucher.edu/people/people_faculty.cfm

Edward Sanders, Chicago State: http://www.csu.edu/catalogs/undergraduate/DeanFacDir440-450.pdf

James Wingfield, Illinois Inst. Tech. (adjunct): http://www.grad.iit.edu/graduatecollege/programs/mmae.html

Dolores McNany, Caldwell (lecturer): http://www.caldwell.edu/pdfs/staff.pdf. Also http://faculty.caldwell.edu/faculty_adjunct.html

Marty Ferman, Saint Louis University: http://www.slu.edu/colleges/gr/catalog/admn_faculty/fac.pdf. Also http://www.slu.edu/services/registrar/pdf_2002/administration_and_faculty.pdf

Martha Adams, U. South Alabama: http://www.southalabama.edu/combulletin3.pdf. Also http://www.fammed.usouthal.edu/faculty/Adams.htm

Michael Baldigo, Sonoma State: http://www.sonoma.edu/Provost/WASC/portfolio/fac_98-99.html

William Sink, Golden Gate University: http://www.ggu.edu/admissions/pdf/faculty_01_02.pdf

Bill Duke, U. North Dakota: http://www.und.edu/dept/registrar/catalogs/YEAR9799/GENINFO/faculty.html

Kathleen Moore, CSU Sacramento: http://aaweb.csus.edu/catalog/cat98/cat98/580.pdf

Gerald Ramey, Lewis-Clark: http://www.lcsc.edu/catalog/admin.htm. Also http://www.lcsc.edu/business/Staff/GerryR.htm

Stephanie Gordon Batalo, Franciscan University of Steubenville: http://www2.franuniv.edu/news/archive.shtm

Robert Naud, School of Visual Arts (continuing ed.): http://www.schoolofvisualarts.edu/ContinuingED/images/ContinuingEducationBulletin.pdf

George Cherubini, NYU (adjunct): http://www2.scps.nyu.edu/dyncon/mcge/gene_facu_a_to.html

Richard Burmeister, U. Alaska Fairbanks: http://www.uaf.edu/educ/faculty.html

Fleet Maull, Naropa: http://www.naropa.edu/environmentalleadership/environleadfac.html

Marlene Palazzo, Seattle Central Community College: http://www.seattlecolleges.com/people/default.asp?page=central

Judy Vargo, Loma Linda: http://www.llu.edu/llu/sph/bulletin/schadminfac.htm

William Nykiel, Lethbridge: http://home.uleth.ca/reg/1997-98/calendar/part16.pdf

Joyce Bishop, Golden West College: http://www.prenhall.com/success/FacultyRes/bios.html

Mary Sue Thompson, Missouri Baptist University: http://www.mobap.edu/academics/catalog/00-03/collegeDirectory.pdf

George Thomas, George Mason University: http://www.gmu.edu/catalog/admin/t.html

John Burruel, Morrison University (ACICS): http://www.morrison.edu/faculty.htm

F.R. Bosch, Vanguard U. of So. Cal: http://www.vanguard.edu/business/index.cfm?doc_id=38

Joseph Howells, Western Connecticut State: http://vax.wcsu.edu/physics/faculty.html

Walter Hewick, Bowie State: http://www.bowiestate.edu/psyc-faculty.htm

James Dauer, Columbia College (Chicago): http://www.colum.edu/infodesk/facultylist-d.html

Susan Barnett, Northwestern State University: http://www.nsula.edu/psych-online/faculty.htm

David Gurchieck, Montana State (instructor): http://www.msubillings.edu/catalogs/cot/COTch8.html

Richard Brasefield, Goldey-Beacom: http://goldey.gbc.edu/faculty_staff/teachers.html

Mitch States, Cal. Poly San Luis Obispo: http://www.cob.calpoly.edu/faculty/FACULTY/fac_states.html

Bob Erickson, Boise State: http://coen.boisestate.edu/dep/ipt/faculty/BErickson.htm

Thomas Saunders, Robert Watkins, and Ernest West, Pueblo Community College (part-time): http://www.pcc.cccoes.edu/faculty/ptinst3.htm

Jasmanda Wu, University of Kansas: http://www.kumc.edu/prevmed/education/faculty.html

Richard Slovacek, North Central College: http://www.noctrl.edu/academics/departments/business_administration/department_site/faculty.htm

Anna Rizzi, Webster University: http://www.webster.edu/kc/faculty.htm

William Carter, Benjamin Franklin Institute of Technology: http://www.bfit.edu/pages/academics/faculty.html

Rafael Clemente Ortega, King College: http://www.king.edu/publicrelations/archive/2000/082500.htm

Deanna Sutton, University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio: http://pathology.uthscsa.edu/faculty/sutton.htm

Frank Bingham, Bryant College: http://www.bryant.edu/facultyprofile/bingham_frank.htm

Richard Carmichael, Lenoir-Rhyne: http://www.lrc.edu/bus/carmichael/dick_carmichael.htm

William Bilyeu, Cumberland University (adjunct): http://www.cumberland.edu/academics/catalog/2000-2001/F00x.1DirectoryforCatalog8.8.html

Debbie Frymoyer, Amarillo College: http://archives.actx.edu/pdf/minutes/regents/9-25-01.pdf

John Collins, Seton Hall: http://pirate.shu.edu/~collinjo/prof/resume.htm

Donald Cowick, Our Lady of the Lake College (adjunct): http://www.ololcollege.edu/academics/about_us.html. (He's interesting because he got an undergrad degree at CCU then went to Louisiana State University and obtained an MD.)

Jeffrey Maddux, St. Petersburg College (curriculum designer): http://www.spjc.edu/webcentral/catalog/catalog247-.pdf

Gerald Burgess, Georgia Tech: http://www.ettc.asurams.edu/Homepage/Dr_B_Portfolio/Resume.htm

Jennifer Humphries-Spencer, Ashland University: http://www.ashland.edu/colleges/education/educf.html

 

Thanks!!

Peter:

Already mentioned on the 18 day post. But thanks for the quote (which I forgot to) of giving credit to Mr. Solomon. When I have the free time tommorrow, I am going to run Engine searches for similar with K-W graduates. When I was reaserching the school, what impressied me was how many eduactors hold and list K-W degrees, as well as, business professionals. Also, I am going to run searches for P-W. Like it or not, US State Liscenced Schools are legal, and outside of NJ and OR, who have yet to prosecute for using an unaccrdited, but legally state liscenced degree.

Regards,

RJT

 

That is a list of people whose employers allow them to list their CCU degrees, nothing more. It in no way indicates that their CCU degrees were instrumental in obtaining those positions. A lack of evidence is not evidence.

Personally, I would question--but not dismiss outright--someone with a degree from CCU. This is especially true if that degree was a bachelor's, without a properly accredited degree along with it. Knowing what I know about this field, I hold such a degree in considerably less regard than those from properly accredited schools. But....

Someone, no matter how else qualified, would be disqualified if he/she listed a degree or degrees from one or more diploma mills. Say, for example, the applicant listed doctorates from two degree mills. That person doesn't understand the meaning of the word "integrity," and would not be someone I'd want to work with. Might as well be someone convicted of two crimes. Just like someone with a master's from Columbia State or Kennedy-Western. It's not just a matter of accreditation. Rather, it's a matter of claiming degrees from scam schools. I see CCU as substandard--as are the degrees it awards.

I might consider hiring someone with a CCU degree who was otherwise qualified. (I don't necessarily think that listing a CCU degree is unethical. Substandard, maybe, but honest.) But I would not hire someone on the basis of that degree--it could cost millions of dollars of business because the contracts we serve stipulate that we will employ properly credentialed employees on those projects. I'd rather not make the argument that someone with a CCU degree is properly credentialed.

Bottom line: List a degree mill, go into the "Reject" file. List an unaccredited school with an irrelevant degree, maybe get considered. (All other factors being satisfied.) How hard is that?

 

Yeah?

Have I read this before? Have I also read opinions that do not support you from people have more clout in this area?

Yes, and yes.

Your opinion Rich ... do a lot of us a favour, and leave it there. You have already put a name to the application of this opinion before - don't bother to again.

 

Yes, are there people who would hire otherwise qualified applicants for a job if said applicants listed one or more diploma mill degrees on their resumes? Not degrees from unaccredited schools, but from diploma mills.

 

I do not understand Rich Douglas!

I do not understand Rich Douglas and his postings here. He jumps from talking about unaccredited institutions to making the wild assumption that they (or many of them) are degree mills! If, Rich thinks he is doing otherwise I would urge him to go back and re-read his postings! I am not sure what readers think about many of the institutions Peter French has mentioned in his response here but I'm beginning to get the feel, as this thread is about Fairfax University, that the assertion of many (Rich Douglas especially) is that because Fairfax is unaccredited it is therefore worthless and a degree mill as well! Am I correct? If this is the assertion of people, I completely disagree with you! Unlike many others who post here, I am actually doing my 'homework' and trying to find out about the utility of a Fairfax award. Thusfar, it has all generally been quite positive! More later.

'telfax'

 

What's not to understand? I didn't equate unaccredited schools with degree mills. (Although, one other poster noted that many people do.) In fact, I distinguished between the two. Nor have I called Fairfax a degree mill.

 

This from Fairfax's FAQ:

"All new colleges and universities in the USA must begin as unaccredited. "

Fairfax was established in 1986. Since that time, the following free-standing, distance-learning, degree-granting schools have been formed and have become accredited (this list is by no means exhaustive):

ACICS
Andrew Jackson
Capella
ISIM
CCHS
Jones International
American Military (now APUS)
Columbia Southern
CNUAS
Cardean
Global University of the Assemblies of God
Northcentral University (candidate)
Touro University International
USOU (now closing)

But I find this from their website to be particularly revealing:

"The University is incorporated in the USA in the states of Louisiana, Montana and South Dakota. "

Three powerhouse states in the regulation of unaccredited schools.

The website cites several recognized universities that have accepted Fairfax graduates into their programs. It does not, however, indicate whether these were one-time cases or a matter of policy. I would not rule out the former, and seriously doubt the latter. (Some people have been admitted to accredited schools on the basis of their unaccredited degrees, but it is not normally a stated policy of the acccredited schools in question.)

I wouldn't call Fairfax a degree/diploma mill. But it is an unaccredited school whose degrees are not generally recognized as being comparable to those issued by legitimately accredited schools. Whether or not such a degree fits one's situation is a highly personal decision. And if one doesn't like the criticism one receives around here regarding such a degree, get used to it. It's going to happen a lot.

 

South Dakota has a strong regulation -- but no enforcement.

 

Re: I do not understand Rich Douglas!

From my experience, it is very common for the general population to immediately equate unaccredited with degree mills. This is unfortunate but I believe a real danger in going to an unaccredited school. At one time I also equated unaccredited with degree mills. After learning more I no longer do that. However the fact remains that many people do equate unaccredited with degree mills and when you are trying to use a credential it is an almost hopeless position to be in if defending the credential, at that point you've probably already been rejected.

I look at all the schools' reputations as being on a continium from the best to the worst. There are a number of gaps in this theoritical list. One gap would be between RA and DETC. An even larger gap would be between DETC and unaccredited.

 

Clearly the general population equates unaccredited schools with degree mills. Is that an assumption without foundation? What percentage of unaccredited schools are clearly degree mills? What percentage are "near" degree mills (ie greatly substandard and no where near RA institutions)? What percentage are legitimate and academically challenging?

My guess, and that is all it is, is that the last category is a very small percent of all unaccredited schools. Probably under 5% of all unaccredited schools.

So is the public really all that wrong to assume an unaccredited school is probably a degree mill? I don't believe so. And, as Bill points out, even if they are wrong, it is totally impractical to fight that battle.

 

Serve the mature learner how? Don't mature learners have different needs in different cases?

How does one get a job with a degree? What does that mean? What kind of job requirements is the degree intended to meet, and at what level?

 

I agree with Rich. There are several California State University campuses on the list, and from what I know of the CSU and its hiring I find it very hard to believe that they would hire a CCU graduate on the strength of an unaccredited distance education 'doctorate' alone. On the other hand, I know that they do hire individuals with masters degrees who have special industry or governmental experience. That's expecially the case in applied subjects.

So in this list of CCU graduates, actually in *any* list of university faculty, no matter where their degrees come from, it makes sense to ask what the degree is doing for the person that holds it.

Was the degree what got them the job? Would they have gotten the job anyway? (I notice that in several cases on the CCU list, the degree was earned subsequent to employment.) Was the degree simply a vanity statement? Or do some schools pressure their existing faculty to earn terminal degrees, and don't care very much where they come from?

I would wonder what the CCU degree really means and what it took to earn it. In other words, it would probably stimulate skeptical questions about its holder, rather than answer them.

 

I would guess the same, that well under 5% of the unaccredited schools are worth much. I further speculate that less than 5% of the unaccredited schools even pretend to teach any courses. These are the fly-by-in-the-night type of degree mills that come into existance for just a few months and either disappear or just change their name and become a new school. Most of these we probably don't even hear about and they probably aren't even around long enough to have made it into Bear's Guide.

I believe that the general public has a tendency to automatically place all unaccredited schools into this same bottom-of-the-barrel category. This idea of worthless mail order degrees is so pervasive that many people will also have a tendency to place any distance learning degree into this same category. The public is becoming much more educated on degrees via distance learning but I don't believe that they will generally accept unaccredited degrees.