Free College Is Now a Reality in Nearly 30 States

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by LevelUP, Jun 20, 2022.

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  1. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    I have a libertarian streak that says I want people to take responsibility for their own personal investments, including education. I also have pragmatic streak that recognizes the need for highly educated and skilled individuals to get into mental health, education, healthcare, social work and STEM. I see a better future ahead for our country if the people wishing to pursue those paths didn't have money as a barrier to get there. If I could have had "free" college back in the day, and help with living expenses n stuff, your friendly neighborhood radiologist may have been Dr.Craniac. You'd be happy with his services, bedside manner and responsiveness, and he'd be filthy stinkin rich.
     
  2. ArielB

    ArielB Member

    All public schools should be "free" or "nearly free". I'd much rather my tax dollars went to subsidizing education than a lot of other things they go to.
     
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  3. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    For sure. And there are other countries right now - e.g. Germany, that do this.
    "In 2014, Germany's 16 states abolished tuition fees for undergraduate students at all public German universities. This means that currently both domestic and international undergraduates at public universities in Germany can study for free, with just a small fee to cover administration and other costs per semester."

    And - at the same time, they have a healthcare system that might well serve as a model for the US.
    https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/germany-s-health-care-system-model-u-s-n1024491
     
  4. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

    There is no “Euro system” in education. Between the education systems of various European countries, there are quite a few differences. However, it is true that higher education in Europe is either very cheap or 'free'.

    By the way, it seems to me that the system you are describing is actually the German education system. Strictly speaking, the system of the two German states of Brandenburg and Berlin. In Germany, education is a state matter. Therefore, even within the country, there are some differences.
     
  5. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

    [
    That is an overblown fear.

    Of course it is not that it doesn't exist at all, but it is so rare that it is usually not considered a problem. Nevertheless, there are regulations in some countries that are supposed to prevent this. For example, there are tuition fees for long -term students in some German federal states. So if you study for too long, your studies are no longer free of charge.

    Of course, every European would say that there are enough lifeboats. Some Europeans, especially those from German -speaking countries, would probably even start arguing what exactly a lifeboat is.

    Every European country has a national qualification framework. These frameworks not only include degrees, but also a number of other qualifications. Especially in German -speaking countries, these other qualifications are very important on the labor market and certain of these alternative qualifications are equivalent to a degree. The most important fact is, however, that these alternative qualifications are also open to those who do not have the necessary school leaving certificate for access to a university. In addition, certain of these qualifications also enable access to a university. So for a late bloomer that would be the way of choice.
     
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  6. Dustin

    Dustin Well-Known Member

    I believe it was Sweden that has an apprenticeship track in high school for students to begin getting work experience in professional careers. These are competitive and often paying, and students don't feel they've missed out when compared to their university-educated peers because they're gaining skills employers want.
     
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  7. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I'd like to see that here BUT - no FAANG companies need apply. Don't want to see apprenticeships that feed Amazon-AWS, Google Cloud-cert-thingies etc.
     
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  8. Rachel83az

    Rachel83az Well-Known Member

    It's not exactly the same in all countries, but it's broadly the same. In Italy, it's by high school. If you chose a liberal arts HS but discovered a passion for computers halfway in, you're not going to be able to get a technical degree without a lot more work. I think it's the equivalent of going back for an extra year of HS.
     
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  9. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I think an added year is a reasonable investment - for a young person to get the career they've discovered they really, really want. Way better than not getting there at all.
     
  10. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

    But that is really only true in a very broad sense.
    If I understand you correctly, your main criticism of basically all European education systems is that specialization in a certain professional direction occurs too early. Well, you are not alone in this criticism.

    So I don't want to say that there are no problems. However, I agree with John. If someone, as in your example, wants to take a different educational path, then this often involves more work. But I don't think that's a particularly big problem. Especially because I think things like your example happen less often than you seem to think.
     
  11. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

    The same type of vocational programs also exist in Austria, Germany, and Switzerland. However, in these countries they are held in a slightly higher regard than in Sweden. This is absolutely not to say that such programs have a bad reputation in Sweden.
     
  12. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

    Amazon actually offers apprenticeships in Europe: https://www.amazon.jobs/en/landingpages/apprentices
     
  13. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    In Europe, nobody will stand for any nonsense. Here they do. There - if Amazon doesn't treat people right - Amazon gets kicked -VERY hard. I'm sure of it. As it should be. Here, big money is generally a law unto itself.
     
    Last edited: Jun 25, 2022 at 1:55 AM
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  14. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

  15. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I don't quite share your benevolent streak, Maniac. Under those conditions, I'd probably have become a Mob lawyer. :) And yes, they'd be happy with my services - or no one would ever see me again.
     
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  16. mintaru

    mintaru Active Member

    You're not entirely wrong, but it's not that simple either. If companies like Amazon behaved the same way in Europe as they do in the US, it would certainly be like that, but they don't. There are always cases where companies try to circumvent labour law and sometimes they are successful. At least for a while. If at some point it becomes known how exactly they circumvent the law, then there is first a scandal in media and then there is always a new law that eliminates the loophole that these companies used.

    I think that's the difference. To be honest, I find it very difficult to imagine that there would be such a law in the US.
     
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