Farington "University"

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by Rich Douglas, Apr 16, 2004.

  1. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    I got a resume today from a job applicant claiming a "Doctorate of Philosophy" in Human Resource Management from Farington. After the listing the school on his resume he wrote, "(on-line degree program/ awarded based upon education and experience)" (sic)

    I almost fell out of my chair laughing. Then I stopped laughing when I saw that he works for the National Guard Bureau. (He's the Chief of Retention, no less!)

    I'm sure this degree has served him well, despite the huge red flag he himself puts on his resume. Sad. :(
  2. roysavia

    roysavia New Member

    Well at least he wasn't an SRU alumni. Good to see that the phonies are more creative in their selection of diploma mills.:D
  3. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

  4. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    No, I don't. This kind of behavior, when not used on public figures, treads dangerously close to tortious interference. But I've identified his position--he's the only one in it. I'm sure someone more willing to do this can carry it out. It's just not my thing. (Public figures are, though. And I wouldn't hesitate to testify in court. But I'm not going after some guy because he sent me a resume.)
  5. tcnixon

    tcnixon Active Member

    I'm with Rich. I understand why others do it, but I would only be interested in outing someone (possibly) if it were:

    a. a teacher or principal (because that hits close to home)

    b. someone in government (of either party)

    Otherwise I'm not much interested.

    Tom Nixon
  6. MarkIsrael@aol.com

    [email protected] New Member

    Tom, are you saying you wouldn't out a fake medical doctor, or a fake nuclear plant manager?

    And who are these "others" who do it? Contrary to comments that have been posted about me, I have never reported anyone to his employer.
  7. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

    Let me clarify my point. If a resume is offered for a position and Rich is the intended hiring official he has the right to call the employer listed and verify credentials, as opposed to outing. Having spent some time at National Guard Bureau, most of these positions are dual staus technician positions (yep civil service, as in government), or title 10 active duty. The freedom of information act does apply. I am not in favor of trashing folks but perhaps the individual would benefit from learning about potential problems with presenting such a degree. I believe Rich, as a recipient of the resume could explain the situation eloquently without making an issue.

    On the other hand, with all the bought degrees within DOD and the government will it make a difference?

    The larger issue for me is more personal since I retired from the National Guard.
  8. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    No. The current employer is not requried--and may not be in a position to--verify educational credentials. They didn't award the degrees. That they didn't do so themselves is not relevant. Besides, what would they "verify"? That he has a Ph.D. from Farington? I would accept that prima facie from his resume. It isn't the fact that he's got the degree, it's the fact that the degree is from a fake school. Calling his employer to ask about his fake degree might be tortious interference, and would only serve to do one thing: alert his employer to the fake degree.
  9. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

    I get the humor (irony), which I believe was your original intent.

    Ought to make for a nice anecdote.
  10. ernie741

    ernie741 New Member

    Gentlemen and Gentlewomen,

    I have been monitoring this site for a very long time and and have seen alot of comments about "fake" degrees. I see a fake degree as any paper issued by an organization that is not authorized to issue such a credential and there are certaintly alot of them out there (i.e., UDP and its homologues). However, while those scams should be exposed, there other "paper" producers who are fully authorized to do so.

    While one may not like how these degrees are issued (experience), if the issuer is authorized and accredited by the respective government department of education (i.e.,Farington) and that government is a signatory to the Hague Convention, IT IS EQUIVALENT to an RA accredited degree and fully legitimate. The individuals involved in acquiring a degree in this manner should NOT be exposed as having a fraudulent (or fake) degree.

    If someone has a problem with this protocol, GET THE LAW CHANGED and convince the US to recant their signatory status to the Hague Convention so that these foreign-accredited degrees can then not be recognized. Until then, they are legitimate under federal law (and the Convention) and should not be declared otherwise.

    Someone who falls victim to this type exposure by this site or any other, would constitute a tortuous act, in my opinion. All of these individuals would ultimately prevail if they have acquired the proper documentation such as appostillation and documentation from the host country. But it would still be an actionable incident.

    I realize that I am in a minority here and this post may not even be released but I needed to get this off my chest. I suspect that I will not be allowed to post any more either, a chance I must take.

    Keep up the good work in identifying true degree mills and other related scams, but until the laws are changed, choose your targets carefully and wisely. Good Luck.

  11. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    Hi Ernie,

    Welcome to the board, I looked up the Hague Convention and couldn't find any mention about credentials. I find it difficult to believe that it is true anyway because one state in the USA doesn't have to recognize credentials presented in another state of the USA. I know also that medical doctors that move to the USA are no longer medical doctors in this country. There are many more examples. Could you please point out any evidence or examples that you could present to back up your unusual assertion?

  12. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    BTW Ernie, I hope that you weren't talking about Farington. Looking at their web site for about 2 minutes was all that was needed to decide that it is a bottom of the barrel degree mill.
  13. ernie741

    ernie741 New Member

    No Bill,

    You are absolutely correct, the Convention doesn't specifically address credentials but rather it addresses the equivalency of higher education across borders. That in conjunction with the United Nations (specifically, UNESCO) becomes the lynch-pin here and until the laws (US and International) get changed, these distance (experience-based) degrees are as legal and valid as any US/R-A degree issued. Now I didn't say they were "as good" as an R-A degree, only that with the proper attestations, they were as legal. Also, I agree, that schools have the privalege of accepting or rejecting credentials issued in this manner as they may even between R-A schools.

    Also, I miss typed (sorry), I meant to use "Concordia College and University" as the reference (and no, I'm not a graduate from there; LOL).

    I did call the Embassies of Malaysia, Liberia, Belgium, and Indonesia and received verbal confirmation of Concordia's assertions regarding their accreditation status. I have also requested "written confirmation" of the same. But the issue is not really the specific status of Concordia College and University but the legal status of such a degree when the issuing entity is legally permitted to issue such a credential and has the appropriate accreditiation from the host nation to do so. That's the issue.

    Once the entity has been validated and determined to have the proper host-nation documents, one must cease any further validity declarations of another's educational credentials unless they are fraudulent in the first place. That's on the reciepient's dime, not on the entity. Also, any change in the law will probably not have any grandfather effect on previously issued credentials, only those that are issue subsequent to the change.

    Bill, I'm sorry for the long-winded nature of my response.
  14. bgossett

    bgossett New Member

    CC&U is a complete scam, a diploma selling business operated by a Belgian disc jockey who himself possesses fake credentials. All the protestations, end-runs, dodges, and sleight-of-hand manuevers that have ever been tried can't make CC&U (or Farington, for that matter) anything more than what they are - diploma mills.
  15. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    It doesn't matter whether or not a degree mill appears to have some kind of official government approval someplace. If it is a degree mill then it's a degree mill. I don't understand your argument, Ernie, as to how we can understand or accept something different? If the Liberia government passes a law that PI will be equal to exactly 3.14, it can't change the fact that it is not really exactly equal to 3.14, that's true even if you live in Liberia.
  16. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    I don't believe that's accurate.

    First of all, the agreement on international recognition of educational qualifications is the Lisbon Convention. The text can be found here:


    Article VI states that parties in one signatory should accept qualifications issued in another signatory, if they are equivalent.

    Article VIII states that each signatory should make available sufficient information on its educational institutions and accreditation system to enable competent parties located in other signatory nations to make the necessary equivalency determinations.

    I don't believe that's accurate either. The whole point of the Convention is to facilitate international academic equivalency determinations, not to prohibit them.

    Section VIII. Information on the assessment of higher education institutions and programmes

    Article VIII.1

    Each Party shall provide adequate information on any institution belonging to its higher education system, and on any programme operated by these institutions, with a view to enabling the competent authorities of other Parties to ascertain whether the quality of the qualifications issued by these institutions justifies recognition in the Party in which recognition is sought. Such information shall take the following form:

    a in the case of Parties having established a system of formal assessment of higher education institutions and programmes: information on the methods and results of this assessment, and of the standards of quality specific to each type of higher education institution granting, and to programmes leading to, higher education qualifications;

    b in the case of Parties which have not established a system of formal assessment of higher education institutions and programmes: information on the recognition of the various qualifications obtained at any higher education institution, or within any higher education programme, belonging to their higher education systems.
  17. -kevin-

    -kevin- Resident Redneck

  18. milotach

    milotach New Member

    sorry for my bad english.

    Unfortunatly Bill things are not so simple as we will like. The universitary degree in many times has the rigth for work on one area of kwnoloment. When you are using a foreing degree you are in a direct conflict against the locals owner`s. Here in Spain your bachelor degree, acredited or not, has no good name, and the most of the greaties companies does not accepted it, Master and doctoral has another qualification very good. Here there is also a doctors from USA that are fighting in the court for theirs rights to work here. During the 90 we was on need for a dentist, and the government allow many of them to work. Now the local dentist are against, even the ones that came to work with a foreing degree, and now you have to past a complete examination. So with your degrees on Bhacelor level, you should go to the university again on spain and they will give you some credits but is possible that you have to make one or two yeras more on it. They are legal, they are accepting your degree according with the law but they have the right to say "of course but this studies are not exactly the same, lets go to our university and make one year more" Why? the answer is easy, privated interest. Now there is a lot of people figthing on a court due to this, because they do not want to go again to study, and finally some cases the court give the rights to them. Sometimes the government give it to you the convalidation and may be your friend with the same degree 2 months later could be rejected. Now there is a new law that are more progressive on acceptance. Is not an easy question anyway.
  19. amused

    amused member

    Good on you, Rich.
  20. galanga

    galanga New Member

    anything you want

    From the Farington order page:
    So if you can spell it, you can buy it.


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