Bill to crack down on diploma mills stalls

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by Abner, Jul 3, 2008.

  1. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    Get a load of this jack offs comment in response to the article:

    PhoenixEagle at 8:31 PM PST Wednesday, July 2, 2008 said:

    The very first step would be ELIMINATING all Online/Home Study Courses

    There is no way to have any oversite on these programs. Online and Homestudy courses (regardless of what the topic is) are all equally worthless. I suppose after the first few people are killed by the "Dr" who got his degree online, maybe just maybe our elected leaders will shut down the diploma mills. CA needs to not accept Online or Homestudy courses for any Degree, Diploma, Certification or any other type of academic credit. Of course the computer companies are making MILLIONS so the politicians don't care about quality education as long the the money keeps lining their pocket. Maybe when a politician has a family member injured or killed by a "Dr" who obtained his "medical training" online somebody will care then? I bought a PHD online for $500.00! Anybody can do it. I know somebody who took "courses' online then paid for a 1 day class in how to pass his Real Estate License Test - and of course HE PASSED! We need to end the sham - No more online or home study programs!

    This guy seems to lump online with diploma mills automatically.

    Last edited by a moderator: Jul 3, 2008
  2. Ted Heiks

    Ted Heiks Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member Staff Member

    The guy's ignorance is phenomenal ... but not surprising. :rolleyes:
  3. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator Staff Member

    It is great to see stupidity is alive and well ;) How many people here have earned their MD online...raise your hands-
  4. c.novick

    c.novick New Member

    Thanks for the info Abner.

    Online education is a thriving option, because more people are realizing the benefits. Now, with gas prices through the roof and more mid-career workers going back to school it make great sense.

    Times are changing in a positive direction for distance education. We just have to expect that an uninformed idiot will rise up on occasion.
  5. Ted Heiks

    Ted Heiks Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member Staff Member

    Hey, C. Novick! How have you been?
  6. John Bear

    John Bear Senior Member

    Randell: "How many people here have earned their MD online...raise your hands"

    John: The only really in depth research into this (that I know of) was 23 years ago, by Congressman Pepper's Subcommittee on Fraud. Their figure was at least 5,000. An awful lot more since then, surely, since the huge "University Degree Program" fraud sold many thousands more.

    I wonder how the mostly-online MD of the International Virtual Medical School consortium (major universities in the US, the UK, Australia) will be accepted?
  7. Ted Heiks

    Ted Heiks Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member Staff Member

    The first two years of med school are straight lecture and would easily lend themselves to distance learning. The last two years of medical school are clinical years and, of course, would have to be residential in nature. Post-MD, when one does the internship and residency (anywhere from three to seven years, depending on your specialty), most specialties would have to be in residence. There is, however, one exception: unfortunately, I've forgotten the name of this specialty, but what it involves essentially is you, the doctor, sitting in a control room sort of environment with several computer screens in front of you with images from cameras in the operating room being displayed from several different angles and other computer screens with images of the patient's medical test results as well as phones in your room and the operating room so that you and the operating room physician can contact each other. Sort of like being a "distance doctor."
  8. Chip

    Chip Administrator

    I wonder what happened to what I think was called International University of the Health Sciences? It was in St. Kitts (immediate red flag), but I actually corresponded with the dean of the program who was a very well credentialed professor of medicine at some Florida university (and not Sheila's either!)

    They had some really intriguing ideas for distance delivery, claimed to have agreements for internships with a number of US-based programs, and it sounded like it could be promising, but I didn't keep track after that.
  9. Ted Heiks

    Ted Heiks Moderator and Distinguished Senior Member Staff Member

    International University of the Health Sciences is here: .
  10. BillDayson

    BillDayson New Member

    I think that there's lots of skepticism out there regarding distance learning. PhoenixEagle might not have stated his ideas very well, but his views aren't entirely without foundation.

    When many people encounter DL, they don't see the most attractive side of it. Most of the so-called 'DL' that many people encounter is degree-mills. Mills are ubiquitous and it's very easy to reach the conclusion that DL consists mostly of mills. That's probably true, actually, since there are almost certainly more mills than real programs in some categories like online doctorates or online theological seminaries. Even when people are aware that real DL exists, there's still a creepy feeling that the medium is infested by con-artists.

    That impression isn't helped by the accompanying sense that a great deal of DL exists to serve a market that's focused on accelerated programs, testing out and cutting corners. With DL, it's easy to get a sense that everything's diplomas for diplomas' sake. Education is kind of trampled in the rush.

    This guy didn't express himself very well, but you can find university professors writing very similar things in more elegant prose. It's a widespread idea out there and it isn't entirely unjustified, even if conclusions are often simplistic and exaggerated. That in turn can be dangerous to DL, if it impacts hiring practices or ill-conceived legislation. DL defenders shouldn't just dismiss this stuff.
  11. Abner

    Abner Well-Known Member

    Good points. I think as DL slowly assimilates into the workplace and society, it will become more acceptable to the skeptics. I even predict heavier DL degree program enrollments due to the price of gasoline.

    But I digress. I will use my wife's workplace as an example of DL success. Her boss, a CFO in line for a CEO position, has attained all of her degrees via distance. She is now in the last phases of her PhD at NCU. Diane (our friend as well) readily accepts and encourages DL degrees in the workplace and of her workers. As the workers under her become more DL educated, they advance and retain more workers under them. They then spread the DL message, and thus DL slowly anchors it way not only into the workplace, but also raises awareness in the Human Resources aspect.

    Take it one step further, the State of California has a provision in their hiring guidelines stating Distance learning is ok as long as it is "recognized" by USDOE and CHEA, thus indicating their propensity towards DL.

    My hope is that in five to ten years DL will become so common, people will actually understand DL has the same components as B&M, and this is what makes bona fide DL schools accredited, in contrast to Diploma mills. Also bear in mind folks, DL is the issue, not NA or RA. The prejudice is in the term "Distance Learning".

    I can go on and on.

    Have a good Fourth brothers and sisters!

    Abner :)

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