Why DETC sucks?

I agree with your reasons why DETC is not as respected as RA. I do think that the changing of the guard with Dr. Leah Matthews has helped, since any organization is only as strong as its leader. Her background with CHEA and ACCSC makes her well qualified to address these issues. I trust that her agenda is to shore up any deficiencies and place DETC where it should always be ---as a viable alternative for adult distance learners.

 

RA & DETC people discussing ways to make higher education better.



This is what that meeting looks like after someone mentions that RA is better than DETC.

 

................:haha:

 

DETC does not suck. I have earned multiple credits and degrees from RA, TRACS, and DETC schools. Judge a school by a school against itself; the quality of its faculty and staff, how its stated mission lines up with its accomplishment of that mission, etc. etc. etc. There is a lot of mythology about the quality of various accrediting agencies.

 

What schools are all your degrees from? Pray tell?

 

Penn Foster College (Certificate - they were Harcourt Learning Direct then) [DETC]
Global University (Undergraduate Studies) [DETC]
Liberty University (B.S.) [TRACS (at that time, they've since dropped it) / SACS]
Liberty Theological Seminary (M.A.R. / M.Div.) [SACS]
Temple Baptist Seminary (D.Min.) [TRACS]
California Coast University (Ed.D. studies but I'll likely do a program change into the M.Ed. later this year) [DETC]

I have done nearly all of my education either through correspondence / online. I started that way while on Active Duty in the Marine Corps as it was the only way I was able to take courses and actually complete them. I needed the flexibility) After leaving the military and entering full time ministry I stuck with mostly with distance learning as it afforded the flexibility I needed then too and I started studies in the late 90's and studied sort of parallel to the growth of online delivery systems.

 

And where are your degrees from? Pray tell?

:scratchchin:

 

Please share examples of what you call "mythology."

 

The premise of this thread. The accrediting agencies accredit hundreds of schools. Why does anyone assume that the schools they accredit are homogeneous? To be certain there are similarities and by and large DETC schools at least all have a distance ed focus in common but they are made up very diverse people from countless regions.

From what I have read the standards utilized by various agencies are standard enough to make it very unlikely that an out and out diploma mill will find its way into any body of accreditation's certified status. By the same token RA doesn't assure you that you are going to get the best education nor does it is imply that every institution associated with Yale is going to be as fine an institution at Yale.

And I'm not so certain that Yale is as fine as Yale. For example, a divinity degree from Yale would be nearly useless for me in conservative circles of Christendom that I am a part of. A degree from Yale would make me necessarily suspect to many of my colleagues and most of the parishioners I serve. My point? Each school offers a curriculum of instruction to a various segment of the population and I'm unconvinced that the quality of vocational education offered through Penn Foster college (DETC) to someone wanting to learn how to groom a dog is qualitatively lesser than an MBA offered through University of Virginia (SACS). They serve different purposes and the curriculum has almost nothing in common.

I'm saying its a false comparison. If you want to talk about DETC doctorates being substandard then lets talk about for profit RA schools offering doctorates primarily online. Accreditation is like a date on a pack of out of season strawberries. Its a good idea to still check out the strawberries. Just because it says they have a few more days... they may not. The same is true of every accredited institution and program within an institution.

Its a myth to say that all RA schools are a better investment and value than DETC schools. It is further a myth to assume that this discussion happens with any frequency outside of contexts like this.

 

Ah very good. Thanks for disclosing.

All RA:
BS Hodges University
MA University of South Florida
DBA Northcentral University
MPA American Military University (in-progress)

 

Wrong "mythology." That's the strawman some people put up, but those concerned about the efficacy of DETC are most concerned about the utility of the degrees issued by those schools, not whether or not (a) DETC is an effective accreditor, or (b) the schools themselves offer a quality experience.

The utility of the degrees can both be measured (John Bear and I have both done it with different populations) and demonstrated anecdotally. It gets a lot of "ink" here. But it's harder to talk about the quality of the educational experience in ways that are apparent (and transparent) to other readers who are not taking those experiences. Also, it is difficult to get insight in to DETC's processes in order to judge them. But some insights trickle through anyway.

Two indications that DETC isn't so hot have been some of the really crummy schools they've accredited and (more recently) the doctoral programs they've allowed to go forward at some of the schools they accredit. So those aspects have also drawn scrutiny.

I still don't see the "mythology." Where are people wrong and making things up? You focus on varying quality among schools accredited at the same level. Okay, but no one ever disputes that! It's just another strawman. Someone says RA is better than NA (or, specifically, DETC). Someone else's defensive reaction is "yeah, but some RA schools suck." Sure, they do. And some DETC-accredited schools suck, too. What's the point? Or this: "It ain't Harvard." Okay, so Capella isn't Harvard. Was someone saying it was? No. We all accept that there are distinguishable levels of quality between RA schools.

But, as a group, DETC schools issue degrees that have less utility than those issued by RA schools. This has been unequivocally demonstrated. The question is whether or not that difference will affect someone's situation. Will it matter? In some cases, no. In others, yes. The magnitude of this is never precisely known, but it is palpable.

You know the issue with some DETC schools seemingly being unprepared to conduct the programs leading to doctorates? Please show me the RA school that looks like some of these DETC-accredited schools. Use specific examples, please. I challenge you that you cannot, that every RA school awarding the doctorate has the processes, faculties, and capabilities to do so. The faults we see in some doctorate-awarding DETC-accredited schools are not found in RA schools.

 

All RA:

AAS, Community College of the Air Force
AA, BA, BS, The University of the State of New York (Regents College Degree Program)
MBA, National University
Ph.D. Union Institute and University

(Oh, right, I am working on something at a non-RA school. It was nationally accredited, but no more. Oh, well. I hope it works out! :smile: )

 

I haven't seen much if any pushback on the utility issue here myself. As far as I can tell, it's pretty well accepted that an NA degree has less utility in general (i.e. credit transferability, tougher access to certain jobs in certain fields, etc).

 

Transferability is a concern, yes. And why? The implication is that DETC is inferior. I do not believe that to be true. Without question you could find examples where a particular school was inferior but I am certain you could find inferior regionally accredited schools as well. The real issue seems more likely to be proprietorship. There is money to be made by requiring more coursework than allowing transfer credits. Also, the idea of NA accreditation being inferior is perpetuated.

Practically, absolutely make sure your DETC degree or credits will work for your needs.

 

The utility is a valid concern absolutely. I just find it a little disappointing as to why. I think it points to a market mentality on the part of public and private education that is frankly dissatisfying.