Who are the fascists?

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by decimon, Sep 19, 2017.

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  1. decimon

    decimon Active Member

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  2. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly

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    Anti-First Amendment are just as fascist as those they supposedly hate.
     
  3. decimon

    decimon Active Member

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    And attempted murder is what Sherlock would call a clew. I loved how deftly that cop parried those strikes.
     
  4. me again

    me again Active Member

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    Antifa = Facism & Communism Combined

    Antifa are facists. They are also paid subversives (not grassroots).

    Antifa uses Nazi and Communistic techniques to accomplish their objectives.

    Antifa incorrectly re-labels things in an effort to garner public support e.g. while Antifa are fascists, they conversely label all who oppose them as fascists. It's a communistic word game that is used to elicit public sympathy (but it's not working as they planned). Their methodologies are backfiring.

    Nazism and Communism have been studied for many years. As a result, their methodologies (to influence public opinion) will no longer have the same impact or public influence that it had in the 1930s in Germany. Antifa is using outdated methods for public manipulation. Patriotic United States citizens see right through the Antifa charade.
     
  5. decimon

    decimon Active Member

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    There was no internet in the 1930s. People saw B&W newspaper pictures, or newsreels at the movie house, of strutting marchers that could well have been Bolshevik, Fascist or Nazi. They would have been hard pressed to grasp what was going on in Europe.
     
  6. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    Oh? And who are these terrific individuals, on many sides? Do I take it that you support Antifa opponents?

    Again, I believe the Antifa ideology and tactics are misguided at best, or directly counterproductive. I believe some might be useful idiots for shady interests. Still, they explicitly define themselves as being in opposition to certain groups, so how about looking at these first? We saw some in Charleston.
     
  7. me again

    me again Active Member

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    Antifa's communistic reverse-psychology tactics not working

    Stanislav, your scripted question demonstrates the exact reverse-psychology that Antifa facists/communists are desirous of achieving. Antifa's methodologies may work on clueless foreigners, but not on patriotic United States citizens, particularly with the advent of the internet, as decimon aptly noted.

     
  8. Bruce

    Bruce Moderator

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    I oppose Antifa.

    Sorry for not falling into your attempted word trap, now you can't come back with "Oh, so you support WHITE SUPREMACISTS??? :lmao:
     
  9. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    You see, the thing is, "Antifa" is short for "Anti-Faschist Action". It's defined as a loose collective of individuals and groups seeking to emulate earlier European movements, that specifically were set up to oppose neo-Nazi groups with direct action. This is all that all these guys have in common. So it's rather hard to "oppose (all of) Antifa" without being either white supremacist or an "all sides, all sides" weasel, or just not thinking one's position through.

    Having said that, to "support" Antifa is well-meaning but unwise. Most of "Antifa" are silly teenagers that'll grow out of it; some are online SJWs with various degrees of effectiveness. Assuming that the country is not totally lawless (and it is not),about the only use for club-wielding pseudo-uniformed guys in legitimate protests is defence of non-violent protesters from the thugs from another side (and there were reports of anarchists and Antifa in Charleston doing just that). Anything beyond this is, at best, a misguided tactic.

    Then there are people with Antifa swag who get filmed beating up some randoms that are either Trump supporters or participated in stupid but non-violent "Free Speech" rallies. Or taking the bait and disrupting some third-rate ideologue's (Milo, Coulter) speaking gig. Members of this last group are criminals and should be arrested.
     
  10. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    We're at this for a while, and your supposedly superior grasp of these thing don't impress me. Then again, I do not make a mistake of equating all "patriotic United States citizens" with you.

    From all I can grasp, "Antifa" tend to come from the Left's fringe; their tactics are obsolete and stupid. Which, nevertheless, does not make them "Fascists", except if you adopt the more primitive word usage and just use "fascist" as synonym to "bad" or "thing I do not approve of". Soviet propaganda did just that.
     
  11. heirophant

    heirophant Member

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    I'm proud to be an antifa opponent.

    As far as I'm concerned, antifa is the functional equivalent of Hitler's brownshirts, and the corresponding left-wing groups in 1920's Germany. All of them were political thugs, who sought to silence opponents by threats of violence or by actually physically injuring them.

    Trying to silence political opponents with violence is certainly undemocratic. I wouldn't say that it's specifically fascist though. Many others with different ideologies have used political violence too, notably radical parties of the left.

    The idea that one's opponents are just so evil that it doesn't matter ethically what one does to them, when it actually becomes a virtue to hurt them, is just another contemporary example of moral judgmentalism run amok. It's reminiscent of pogroms against heretics, Jews and witches centuries ago. (I expect the psychology was the same, the mixture of contempt for one's targets and insufferable self-righteousness. That same psychology fueled Hitler's 'final solution'.)

    'There's somebody in a red MAGA hat! Kill him!!'

    Of course we know that if the police officers, or the wearers of MAGA hats pull out firearms and defend their lives and persons, that would become the MSM headline. I suspect that those dark but wealthy forces who are funding the antifa are hoping for exactly that.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 19, 2017
  12. me again

    me again Active Member

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    Antifi = Paid by Communists

    Stanislav, your script is typical of Soviet reverse-psychology methodologies. Antifi is not grassroots in the United States. Antifi is paid by alt.left communists, such as George Soros and others.
     
  13. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    Allright, I have to ask: what about these tiki-torch-bearing, occasionally hooded, hate-spewing people? What are they an equivalent of?

    Now that's just silly. They'll just take off MAGA hats.

    Seriously, all you wrote is bad, but it's wholly unclear how well does it describe any group. Even "Antifa".

    Oh, that is quite plausible, actually. I suspect we imagine those dark forces differently, though. You see, for groups in existence, supposedly, from the seventies, a suspiciously large fraction of Antifa coverage comes from this very year. Wikipedia page is brand new, and so are all the references; also, a few short years ago this role was filled by "New Black Panthers". Antifa appeared just as the Right needed a bogeyman, and was immediately picked up by both alt-Right and allied Russian fake news bots. Putin allies are undoubtedly dark, very wealthy, and are known to fund both far Right and far Left - so they would be my first guess.
     
  14. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    Proof please. Certainly Antifa tactics are not compatible to Open Society Foundation goals, so it's counterintuitive Soros would fund them.


    On the other hand, Putin might. Now, it would fit his goals 100% to fund both alt-Reicht and "Antifa". It's Lenin's strategy of "the worse, the better" (one the KGB agent would be trained in).
     
  15. me again

    me again Active Member

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    Stanislav, rubbish.
     
  16. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    Cute how a Trump supporter just instinctively jumps to protect Comrade Vlad. But try to elaborate. Why would his tactic here be any different from what he already does in Europe? I remember how Ukraine's own right wing party, Svoboda, had to cancel their talks about joining a union of like-minded groups in European Parliament - after each and every party in that group sided with Vlad on Crimea. They also had a big neo-Nazi forum in St. Petersburgh in 2015. At the same time, Germany's neo-Commie party, Die Linke, is the largest Putinversteher group. He certainly owns a couple "Antifa" groups in Europe, here and there. Why not here?
     
  17. me again

    me again Active Member

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    Antifi is a paid uprising (Communist origins)

    Here is a video showing Antifi protestors who are demanding that Soros pay them for their protesting services. It starts at 00:44 and ends at 00:57 (13 seconds):
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6IovWPu2w44

    Antifi is a fake alt.left organization that is paid and supported by Communists. Antifi is not a United States grassroots uprising. Antifi is clearly anti-United States, which explains their violence towards people and their destruction of public and private property.
     
  18. Stanislav

    Stanislav Active Member

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    Yeah, because it's totally normal for the street-level agents to ask Soros, by name, to pay him. Totally reasonable behavior. Also, if a member of a false flag group talls you who he really works for, he surely tells the truth.

    I kind of share your feeling that the reported "Antifa" actions do not feel grass-roots. I'm just sharing observation on one force with the most experience of funding similar things.
     
  19. Abner

    Abner Active Member

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    You sure spend a lot of time talking about Antifi. Do you share the same outrage when it comes to the alt right neo-Nazi, White supremacists and white nationalist groups? What are your thoughts on them? I am curious.

    We get it already, antifi sucks. They are the equal to the neo-nazis and other groups on the alt right.
     
  20. Abner

    Abner Active Member

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    Let's not forget how the early Trump rallies were violent. Trump even offered to pay legal bills for one of his supporters who became violent against a black person. What do people expect, when you start of on a violent tone, violence will ensue. Dah george! Trump encouraged violence early one, and he did not denounce it.
     

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