US Fake School Scamming Students from India

HikaruBr, I can tell you were upset and I don't take offense. However, be careful assuming the students are not part of the sham, when, in all likelihood, if the school's not really a school, the students are well aware of this fact. Wouldn't a bona fide student with an F1 visa immediately transfer to legitimate school once they realized their school was a sham? That this school had any students enrolled for any length of time is quite telling. I respect your experience as someone who has traveled between the US and Brazil often, but I'm not creating the things I'm saying out of thin air. To the contrary, I have literally seen thousands of immigration cases from an insider's perspective in my professional career in government. While the majority of students are really bona fide, lots aren't. There's quite a bit of F1 fraud, unfortunately, and the students we're talking about were probably not all innocent victims.

 

I have learned something from this thread, because I started it thinking that students would always be the victim in this sort of thing. Thank you for you insight from an insider's perspective.

 

HikaruBr,

I am sorry that you feel that you are the target here. However, we or at least I do not single you out. If you have done nothing illegal to against the United States laws, then you don’t have to worry about it. Obviously, I only say what I have seen. For example, my brother-in-law’s cousin, who has been to the United States to learn English; however, before her student visa expires she hires someone to marry her. She pays someone $30,000.00 for a fake marriage so she could stay in this country. There are many more that I know in the Asian-American community, but I don’t single them out. First of all, I have no business with them or evident to report them.

Of course, the majority of foreign students come here for education; however, certain people are seeking for the loophole to stay here. The students at Tri-Valley University are in the same boat. I am sure these students know the school is FAKE because if you look at the school campus itself. Maybe 2 classes in a small office, a school name banner looks like printing poster on the door. Even though I am a stupid person, I still recognize this school is FAKE.
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Speaking of F-1 visa fault, I believe the owner went through this issue. She came from China to student at UC-Davis, then UC-Berkeley. Wasn’t by law she had to return to China after she graduated?

 

Um... whatever happened to "innocent until proven guilty"? To date, only the fact that the school is a sham has been established. Of course, some students might have been fully aware of the scam. But there is NO EXCUSE for the government to treat such students as criminals until they've been proven guilty. In fact, they should look at themselves and punish themselves first for their INCOMPETENCE in awarding F-1 visas to these students via an illegitimate school.

 

In this case, the government was apparently fooled into issuing the visas, and is now seeking to correct its mistake.

The students aren't entitled to the presumption of innocence you mention because they're not facing criminal charges, just immigration violations. The government will have to establish, by clear and convincing evidence (not beyond a resonable doubt like criminal cases) that the student has committed the charged voilations and is therefore removable from the U.S.

Generally those awaiting a removal hearing who are not dangerous/criminal/etc. are released from custody in the interim. The use of tracking devices might be slightly overbearing, but it addresses a common problem: the govt dosen't want to lock them up, but also wants them to show up for their hearing. I guess they've assessed these students as flight risks (if the evidence is strong and they've got no other form of relief available the chance of no-show is high) and utilized the ankle bracelets save some resources (i.e., tax dollars) tracking the absconders down later.

It's easy (and fun!) to trash the government as mean, incompetant, dumb, etc. But once you get past all the BS, you realize there's a lot less "there" there than you first thought.

 

It might be interesting to know that, out of 1400-odd students of this "University", only a small portion (about a 100) actually came from India with a fresh I-20. Rest are transfer students from other US Universities.

So, it is obvious that these transfer students are well aware of the Accreditation status of this University. Still they took the transfer, because they claim that the University lured them with employment and OPT from day one.

I am not a student so I don't know the laws concerning OPT, but from what I heard from my colleagues (who were students before) that usually OPT is something offered towards or after the end of the course work.

 

A government agency made the mistake and to clean the mess another government agency decided to adopt extreme measures. That said, the US laws are the US and foreign students have many other choices when deciding that they one a degree from overseas. For example, Canada, Australia or Europe. No one forces anyone to apply to a US school...

That said, I have to agree with HikaruBr that getting a US Tourist Visa is much easier than getting a Student Visa. Also, some of the initial remarks did sound xenophobic.

Also, there's a clear double standard... I wonder what would be the general reaction if something similar happened to US students abroad. Remember a few years ago when Brazil decided to emulate the US policy to take pictures of all the Americans visiting their country (as happened with Brazilians travelling to the US)? The media uproar in the US was incredible and the American Airlines pilot that gave the finger to the Brazilian authorities was received as a hero when he returned to the US...

JFO

 

Was that the reason why Hollywood produced the movie, Touristas? lol

 

I totally agree with you, but they should be assumed not guilty until proven guilty. I don't think for a moment that any government has the right to treat a foreigner in a way that wouldn't rtreat your own citizens. I wouldn't agree with that in Brazil and I won't here in the USA.

 

So, just because something bad is not affecting me personally I shouldn't bother with? Geez, what a great way to think about the world!

 

True. And it's appalling to sense the xenophobic attitude by Degreeinfo posters in this thread...

 

And HikaruBr, yes, bad language will not be tolerated, but it's okay to state your prejudices against foreigners since using bad language is worse than adopting a certain attitude towards people who are not from your country... at:

 

Ok, well wearing an ankle monitor while out on bail pending trial is a common practice in the US legal system where people are assumed to be innocent until proven guilty. So our government isn't treating these people any differently than a US citizen who MIGHT be guilty of a crime. No one's civil rights were violated here. I'm not a Xenophobe, I love visiting other countries, learning about other cultures, but I think the vast majority of these "students" knew exactly what they were doing and am not bothered by how our government responded. Sorry I'm not sorry.

 

*wowzers*

So Hikaru won't calm down and is offended. I'll just stop what I'm doing and care about the people wearing ankle bracelets from foreign countries when it doesn't affect me at all.

So because I could care less I'm somehow a member of a horrible class of human being? Thank you Hikaru. I feel loved. I don't care about my mom living in Arizona either for three quarters of the year. Nothing she does affects me 75% of the time. Ain't personal.

This was never an education discussion. It was a political rage platform. Can we move this thread to the poli forum?

Last thought: First basis of law. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse allowing one to break it. If they did not do their due diligence on the school prior to applying then they broke the law by requesting a student visa if that school was not properly accredited. An argument could be made that the US Govt should have known and not issued the visa.. however that argument has yet to be heard as as AU said.. people awaiting trial for federal offenses need to be trackable, especially when they are flight risks.. which foreign nationals are.

End of day these guys will be deported and have received some vaca time in the US.

 

Sorry if I'm not sorry for using strong language in my reaction to your xenophobic comments

P.S. Just because someone like to travel doesn't mean the person is not xenophobic. Such person might like those crazy foreigners in their right place, where he/she can have a good vacation time watching their curious ways and costumes (like a human zoo) as long they don't get to her/his country where he/she KNOWS that they are just trying to trick the government and to stay there illegally...

(I'm not saying this applies to you, just a example of how someone could be xenophobe and love to travel to other countries at the same time)

 

Sure, I've been called a xenophobe, but the truth is, I'm not. I honestly just feel that America is the best country and the other countries aren't as good. That used to be called patriotism.

 

Well, actually you are.

Look, if you think it's ok to treat someone in a way that you wouldn't accept to be treated, yes, you're not a nice person. AUTiger at least gave a good reasoning for his comment (he argues that a american citizen would be treated the same way).

I'll give an example to clarify my position:

in 2007, while in Brazil two Cuban boxers ran away from the cuban delegation during a tournament and asked for asylum. According to our laws they had the right to do so and they would probably get the asylum.

But our president back then, Lula, is a personal buddy of Fidel Castro. So the government arrested the guys and send them back to Cuba.

Did this affect me? Not at all. I'm not Cuban, I'm not asking asylum and as a brazilian citizen I'll never have to face something similar in brazilian soil.

BUT I WAS FURIOUS with this. I cannot accept my country (a democracy) doing the dirty job of a dictatorship.

A lot of people didn't care about the case in Brazil because didn't affect them. Do I think they are worst people because of that?

Yes I do. Because our president only got away with this unlawful action because most people didn't care.

 

Any Government? You're totally wrong, I was born in the third world country. I have been traveled to all continent of the world except Africa and the Ice Caps. There are many countries in the world still use jungle laws, and treat people inhumanly. There was a Vietnamese-Canadian lady who was accused for possessing and transporting 1 Kg (2.2 lbs) of cocaine from Ho Chi Minh City to Toronto. In her own word, she was asked to carry a pair of Son Mai "Asian traditional handcraft art" from Ho Chi Minh City to Toronto, and they awarded her $100.00. And somebody in Toronto will pick it up once she arrived; however, the airport security in Ho Chi Minh City found out about there was cocaine inside the handcraft art. The Vietnam Government locked her up, and executed her before the Canadian Government arrived in Vietnam for investigation. Since she was the citizen of Canada, the Canadian Government had the right to involve with the case; however, the Vietnam Government blocked that connection from her.

What was about hikers were detained in Iran? Were they guilty before proven or after? What was about American Journalists entered North Korean? If you bring up the topic about the United States Government treats foreigners inhumanly than other Governments. Then you should think it twice, or even thrice.

 

Actually I pretty much agree with you - overall (foreign policy and race relations notwithstanding) the USA (sorry, for me America is the continent...lol) is the best country in the world to live in.

But you don't need to be xenophobe to be patriotic. Especially in a country of immigrants.

 

You know what? I think this is a good topic for debating....and what are what scholars do. hehehe