Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by SurfDoctor, Dec 19, 2011.
YouTube - VIDEO
Balios has excellent advice, not only excellent but outstanding----to nip it in the bud and go forth to the professor to point out what happened, BEFORE he or she says something--just the humble opinion of a new guy here
I know this is somewhat off-topic, but I must respond.
I would argue that the Dean was wrong. The hallmark is not a student who can write but a student who can write clearly.
Executive summaries exist for a reason.
30 page responses to each case study (if two to three case studies are required each week) likely consist of little more than verbosity and drivel. That's nothing like the real world, which values concise presentations over lengthy ones.
I find it hard to believe that such extreme writing requirements would produce quality writing. 60 pages of writing per week over 30 weeks would equal 1800 pages. That's 5 or 6 books.
If this is LU, there's a way to see your SA report (unless the faculty member his disabled that feature). In the past, LU faculty were instructed to investigate matches that were more than 18%. I can't imagine that you approached that number.
Oh, no way that much. I'm talking about just a few sentences in 40 pages. It is LU. I'm going to look around to see where I can see my report.
Dick Cheney, is that you?
Don't you mean Alan Dershowitz?
CNN.com - Dershowitz: Torture could be justified - Mar. 3, 2003
I think you are worrying about nothing and shouldn't have emailed the teacher. Thats my opinion based on the limited info I have available to me.
I just finished an annotated bibliography this morning and I never go back and check my account of an article against the actual article text or abstract to see if it matches. I trust that a reasonable person can tell the difference between a random match and plagiarism.
From what I gather, these tools do matching and then the final judgement is made by the reviewer.
Congratulations, and condolences.....I would rather write 10 more Capstone papers before I do another annotated bibliography.
Of course, I saved mine on my hard drive & thumb drive, but I symbolically burned a copy in my fireplace once it was accepted.
I don't know about you, but my brain "maxises out" and I insert words that are right out of sync with the sentence. I think this happens because I am concentrating on the content or argument, not the writing. When I read my stuff back, I frequently mentally insert words that I have missed in the writing.
In short, you are human and humans make mistakes. How many people inadvertently do as you have done? If you plagarise in a lit review for a Doctorate, you would deserve to fail simply because of stupidity, as these things are examined so closely. Plagarism requires an intent, which is absent here, and the absence of intent is obvious because of your actions. The answer is no you have not plagarised, as you cannot do that inadvertently. Your innocence is proven by your actions. Don't stress over it, there are plenty of issues to stress about in what you are doing. This is not one of them.
Yup! I have authority as U.S. to perform a citizens arrest upon your person, PLUS I have been deputized by the USDOE. :smile:
We don't need no stinking badges! - YouTube
Thanks for your comments StephanM. About 1/3rd of the paper was restating the case study and ferreting out the salient issues. Another 1/3rd or more was addressing the issues and how they could be resolved and why that particular approach was being used. Finally, the balance of the paper was the conclusion. Each case study dealt with a situation which really happened in a company. The actual company solution and the outcome was revealed after papers had been presented.
Now I did this degree before the advent of the World Wide Web and electronic library sources so conducting research and finding sources was much more difficult than it is now. It's fair to say some folks didn't write very clearly, or for that matter present very clearly. After the first couple of weeks we started doing peer editing and also providing feedback on presentation performance. The main focus of the educational philosophy of the school was to form leaders who could understand real business problems and propose workable solutions.
I am a bit stymied by the assertion that 30 page papers "likely consist of little more than verbosity and drivel." Doesn't an academic paper consist of a title page, index, body, and end notes mostly double spaced. Make it single spaced and we are down to 15 pages. Many of the academic books and readers I've encountered as a graduate student are in the 400 to 600 page range so the "1800" pages you mention is maybe a book-and-a-half or two for an entire graduate degree. Doesn't seem unreasonable to me. All-in-all I have 150 + semester hours of graduate credit and have found papers in the 20 to 30 page range to be the norm not the exception. Obviously your graduate experience is different.
I have taken a number of undergraduate courses online in the last few years and have observed the nearly total lack of lengthy reading and papers. Most learning seems to have been broken down to bite sized chunks and devolved to light reading and "responding to everybody else's postings." I'm not sure more than superficial learning can happen using this pedagogy.
10 pages (1/3) to restate the case and identify the issues? That seems excessive to me, at least. It shouldn't take 10 pages to identify issues. If it does, either the person writing the paper needs to be more concise, or the case study has more issues than can be addressed in 30 pages.
That's fine, but I just don't think requiring 30 pages of writing per week is the way to do it.
Why not? It doesn't teach people to be concise. What
If your endnotes, bibliography, title page, etc. all count, then that is a different matter. I thought you meant 30 pages of content.
It depends on the discipline. Some books are 200-300 pages, some are 400-600, some are longer. Admittedly, most of my readings have been outside the business discipline, but, as in most disciplines, a longer text doesn't mean a better text.
I think the best comparison in academia is a dissertation, and in non-humanities fields, 150-300 pages is the norm for a dissertation.
I tend to agree with the discussion boards. I think they are a perfect example of unfruitful bulk.
In general, I oppose lengthy writing requirements because, IMO, they fail to cultivate precision. I remember vividly that one of the most difficult assignments I ever had as an undergraduate was to review a 500 page book in one page. Every single word was a scarce resource, and I couldn't waste a single one. I also have written lengthy papers, and they were much easier to write because they didn't require such extreme precision.
Also, instructors are much less likely to give detailed feedback when the papers are so lengthy.
If you had a one class of 10 people writing 30 pages a week, that's 1200 pages of dry, duplicated, academic material in a month. Rare is the instructor who will be able or willing to give quality feedback on that much writing.
Can you plagiarize yourself?
Here is a great example of Lincoln's Gettysburg Address made more concise by Edward Tufte: Gettysburg Cemetery Dedication
Are we the better for it?
We are limited by the extent of our experiences.
A point that you miss in your example is that Lincoln's Gettysburg Address was already very concise.
Edward Everett spoke for two hours prior to Lincoln's address.
Lincoln spoke for a few minutes.
And, yes, we are the better for it that Lincoln did not take two hours (or even thirty minutes) to say what he said in his address.
Good luck with your studies at WNMU StefanM. You will undoubtably concisely go a long way.
That dean should have done a little research. HBS students are advised to spend no longer than 2 hours on a case, a large majority of the students will tell you they rarely do more than briefly read the case before class, especially for the soft courses.
Long time no see.
Did y'all miss me? I've come and lurked around on occasion, but college football, class and planning my pending nuptials have precluded my posting.
So Boston hasn't taken the "y'all" out of you yet? :shocked1:
Congrats on your upcoming wedding.
Separate names with a comma.