Oregon Standards - A Double Standard

Discussion in 'Accreditation Discussions (RA, DETC, state approva' started by russ, Aug 14, 2005.

  1. russ

    russ New Member

    SECTION 3. { + (1) A school that obtains an exemption under
    section 2 of this 2005 Act or that, on the date preceding the
    effective date of this 2005 Act, was a school described in ORS
    348.594 (2)(d) may not:
    (a) Award more than 25 percent of the credit toward a degree
    for noninstructional activities, such as challenge examinations
    and professional or life experiences;

    It is common knowledge here and elsewhere that one may obtain a regionally accredited degree by almost entirely challenge examinations including CLEP and others. Oregon, nonetheless, in their infinite wisdom has denied that opportunity to any school which is not accredited. Why the double standard? The professional and life experience is understandable but not the challenge examinations. It reflects an automatic assumption on the part of the ODA that unaccredited schools will dilute any challenge examinations they give a student. This is simply not fair to legitimate unaccredited schools.
  2. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    so russ tries to slip in a post after midnight on a Saturday. Coincidentally, here I am to ask russ a question.

    Hi russ - can you name half a dozen "legitmate unaccredited schools" that might be affected by this rule? Can you name two?
  3. russ

    russ New Member

    Re: Re: Oregon Standards - A Double Standard

    It is not midnight here Jack. The world does not revolve around you Jack.

    It doesn't matter how many schools it affects now or in the future. One is too many.
  4. CalDog

    CalDog New Member

    Different interpretation

    Russ does not indicate the law in question, but I believe that he is quoting Oregon Senate Bill 1039. The full text is here.

    And I may be wrong again (admittedly, the law is confusing), but I believe Russ is mischaracterizing the intent of the law in question. The Summary at the beginning of the bill states that it:

    "Directs Oregon Student Assistance Commission, through
    Office of Degree Authorization, to exempt certain schools from
    statutory provisions regulating conferring or offering of
    degrees. Requires school to apply for exemption, meet certain
    requirements and comply with specified conditions. Establishes
    appeal process if exemption is denied, suspended or revoked."

    Basically, the law establishes the conditions by which a religious school can be exempt from the ODA restrictions. There are many such conditions that a legitimate religious school must meet, and one of them is that it cannot award more than 25% degree credit for challenge examinations.

    So as I read the law in question, it does not apply to "any school which is not accredited", contrary to Russ' interpretation. Instead, it applies to Oregon schools that want to claim a religious exemption from Oregon's normal rules regarding degrees.

    For unaccredited, non-religious-exempt degrees, it appears that Oregon does not care how they were earned, as long as the appropriate legal disclaimer is attached:

    '(Name of school) does not have accreditation recognized by the United States Department of Education and has not been approved by the Office of Degree Authorization. '

    So as I understand it, an unaccredited, non-religious-exempt degree can still be earned by challenge exams or by any other means. But the disclaimer must be attached in any case.

    I may be confused, and would welcome those with more legal experience to review the law as well.
  5. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    Re: Re: Re: Oregon Standards - A Double Standard

    Well russ, since you are just a troll, and an anonymous troll at that, since you refuse to say who you are or where you are, I can only make generalizations. I'm glad that you realize that the world doesn't revolve around me. However, I'm not certain that you've come to understand that the world doesn't revolve around you.

    As for the identification of specific schools, you say that it doesn't matter how many schools this rule affects...you say, "One is too many." Yet you fail to identify even that one school. You can't even name one school? Not even one?
    "What a maroon!"
    (B. Bunny, 1949)
  6. russ

    russ New Member

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Oregon Standards - A Double Standard

    Calling me names, Jack, just indicates what playground you come from.
  7. DesElms

    DesElms New Member

    Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Oregon Standards - A Double Standard

    Uh, huh. Nice dodge of Jack's question. How 'bout naming a school, russ. Just one.
  8. russ

    russ New Member

    Hi DesElms,

    Never did convert me did you? It was a nice try though and I do appreciate the "good cop, bad cop" approach when done effectively.

    I would answer Jack's question if I felt he was sincere in his desire for an answer but for Jack this is just a game of trying to make me go away. He is not the first to play it and I doubt he will be the last. As to the question, many people on this site have listed legitimate unaccredited schools (Rich has quite a long list). Take your pick.
  9. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    How do you determine which unaccredited schools are legitimate and which are not? You've been asked this question many times and have dodged it completely.

    This isn't a "double standard." It is a standard. Accredited schools do what they do reliably. Unaccredited schools do not.

    Knee replacement surgery is can be a successful approach to providing great relief to certain patients when done by a licensed surgeon. This is much less true when conducted by a some guy pretending to be a surgeon.

    It is not a double standard. And I continue to look forward to how "russ" is going to determine which unaccredited DL schools are legitimate, or even which ones they are and why. Waiting....waiting....waiting....
  10. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    This is very revealing, showing that, for "russ," these discussions are about personality, not about issues revolving around distance learning.

    Here is one definition of an internet troll:

    An Internet "troll" is a person who delights in sowing discord on the Internet. He (and it is usually he) tries to start arguments and upset people.

    Is "russ" a troll? It would seem a simple decision, and I certainly have drawn my conclusion.
  11. Guest

    Guest Guest

    " This is simply not fair to legitimate unaccredited schools."

    Great news thanks!
  12. Jack Tracey

    Jack Tracey New Member

    I don't mind if you stick around russ. Every time you post you set back your cause.
  13. Bill Huffman

    Bill Huffman Well-Known Member

    russ russ russ :(

    I really had much higher hopes that you would be more able to engage in discussion. All you seem to do is to make outlandish unsupported claims and disappear until your next outlandish unsupported claim. (Yet another definition of a troll.)
  14. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Why do you care anyway? It is a hopeless cause. If you have an unaccredited degree just get rid of it and get a real one.

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