How is your DL degree working out for you?

Yeah, like it would need to be typed! Comparing a dissertation from 1950 to one in 2011 has to be one of the stupidest things I have seen in a long time.

 

It's stupid to compare a dissertation from 1950 to 2011? But not stupid for a person to insult another person's dissertation work? Interesting.

My point in bringing up Nash's dissertation was to illustrate that perhaps the content was what mattered, not how many pages the lit review was or how verbose the author is.

Since I am merely an average person without the astounding education credentials that you have, perhaps you could illustrate why comparing dissertations from different time periods is the stupidest thing you have seen in a long time?

 

Perhaps standards change? Ask yourself this - would Princeton accept a 23 page hadwritten dissertation with two references today? If read the words (yes, really read them) the dissertation was not insulted. It was referred to as "quite interesting" and the only thing in question was the length of the lit review and formatting, which NCU has guidelines regarding.

*Note - No astounding education credentials need - just 3rd grade reading comprehension.

 

Perhaps standards change? Do they or don't they? Yep, I'm saying Nash's dissertation would be accepted at Princeton today, it's brilliant...1950 or not. Are you saying that Dr. Nash's thesis would not be accepted at Princeton today?

Apparently it would not be accepted at NCU since you have such rigid requirements as to length of literature reviews and such.

My comprehension of Sue's comments were that she was insulting the other persons dissertation because of the length of the lit review. We're all familiar with the tactic of giving a false positive statement before delivering the negative statement. I saw the negative critique in her statement, that's all. She came back and clarified for us that she had not intended it that way.

I think your education credential ARE astounding. They put 99.09% of people to shame.

Admittedly I'm not that smart but my reading comprehension is probably close to that of a 9th or 10th grader.

 

My reading comprehension comment was rude and uncalled for. For that I do apologize. As far as his dissertation being accepted today, I would say no. not due to content but due to length and number of references that may be required.

 

Surfdoctor,

As I recall, most of the crticism of late about NCU is not about its educational practices, it is about its business practices and lack of respect for the student -customer. The critics (myself included) feel that NCU is doing a disservice to itself by alienating its customer base, and losing its competetive edge of schedule flexibility and lower cost. Without lower cost tuition, and flexible and stable program offerings, its only distinguishing characteristic is to not require a residency.

 

Hey Connie,

I see you have an MBA from Cal Coast. I received my BS from there!

Abner

 

Abner;

I loved Cal Coast! I learned quite a bit from the MBA program.... they were also quite reasonable in cost and schedule.

 

Are you happy with your DL degree?

Answer: I'm happy that I've had the opportunity to be educated and that I was smart enough to take two years to review all of the various distance options before choosing my first DL school. Truly, I think that some misunderstand and assume that the convenience of accessing the education means that the decision making process for selecting a school needs to be equally convenient. Back in 2005 it was and should remain much harder if you want to get something out of the process in the end.

Have you run in to issues with the utility of your degree?

No, it's never given me any problems. It rests on the wall like a good degree should and doesn't require walkies or periodic grooming beyond an occasional dusting. It's been there when I needed it, looks like any other degree on a resume and allowed me to get into UMass Amherst, which is another example of taking several months to a year to choose a program. Thankfully I had found this site by 2007 and was able to use it to cut my search time down significantly.

The real catch is making sure your final, terminal degree comes from the best place you can get in to and making sure that every school you go to improves in reputation over the last one you went to if you take on the next level of program. (Ex: I would not go to WGU for a Masters until I got one from UMass, I would not go to UMass for a doctorate until I got one from a better institution or one of equal stature in a different discipline.. but if I got that MBA from UMass I'd think about going back to WGU for one.. )

The idea is to constantly improve your position so you can tell that story as part of your interview processes when you're inevitably asked about your distance programs or your educational process in general.

Dissertations from the 50s vs. Dissertations from 2011

People owning either are still called Doctor at the end so stop the sillyness. If they're in the same field there's a good chance that one builds off the other.

NCU

The work done in a doctoral program galvanizes a person in a unique way. While I doubt considering my own background and the process I take as presented in the answer to the second question that I'd go there I don't discount the effort or the piece of paper at the end.

Really you're just jumping through hoops to get a door opened. Once that door is open, it may still be slammed shut but if you're the right person for the gig you're going to get it. Some positions require a combination of doors to be open (PhD from someplace specific, connections etc.) but if you don't have the right combination for the lock on the door you're wasting effort.

Moral of the story is, research your targets before you shoot, determine the range, determine the prevailing winds, select your ammo and weapon appropriately and you'll give yourself the best chance of hitting the target provided you did your work properly. From what I'm reading most think that the choice of just the doctoral school has all the bearing on your final position in academia. It starts WAY earlier than that and doing the right things can offset not going to the "best overall" as opposed to the "best for you" school in the end.

 

I beg to differ, I recall a number of posts a while ago, not by you, that attacked the quality of a degree from NCU. I remember one individual who posts here regularly, saying that a degree from NCU was worthless. All of your criticisms are quite valid and I agree with you on those. I'm also glad to see evidence supporting the idea that the detractors of academic quality are mistaken. I took a few doctoral classes at NCU before I jumped ship to a B&M school and I can personally support the quality of the design, curriculum and rigor at NCU.

 

I can provide a limited prospective, since my degrees were not earned via DL, but a number of my colleagues at the state-run colleges and universities for which I have worked have earned their terminal degrees online. I have also served on thesis and dissertation committees and three B & M universities (Cal State San Bernardino, La Sierra University and University of Louisville) and one DL university (Capella). I have also read dozens of dissertations from other universities.

My experience with my colleagues has been that, without exception, their degrees from UMUC, Capella, Walden, Western Governors, and Nova Southeastern have been accepted by their employers for qualityfing for promotion, raises, tenure, etc. The Capella dissertations in which I have been involved as a committee member were of (at least) equal quality to those at the traditional universities.

 

My B.A. (from TESC) qualified me to get the job I have now (check-the-box degree) and no one questioned where it came from in the slightest. My MBA (which I’m in the middle of completing) hasn’t been questioned either

*shrug* DL worked out just fine for me. Then again, I wasn’t trying to be an I-Business superstar or make $150k/year, either.

 

1950 dissertation vs. 2011 dissertation:

There are going to be different expectations given the environment of the time and the tools available to the student.

In 2011, you have word processors with spell-checking available (somewhat) cheaply and on a near-universal basis. There are an abundance of research sources online with near-universal access via Internet.

In 1950, students had typewriters (sometimes old, fussbudgety ones) and had to visit libraries in person to do research. I would imagine occasional typos would have drawn less attention in some circumstances given the difficulty in retyping a page at that time. However, I'd think the expectation for quality of writing and/or research might have been higher in some circumstances.

 

I've heard good things about GMU's MBA and MPA programs. Granted, I only know one person in each program, but neither of them is dumb (one is a lobbiest for the NRA, the other works in commercial development) and they both claimed the programs were easily managable with work but still challenging.
As an aside, most graduate programs refuse to give grades less than a B unless you REALLY don't try and I mean like skipping exams, not completing assignments, etc. I can't think of anyone at Vandy that failed out of the program. In classes of 1000 at Harvard, typically on 3-5 don't return each year and some of those chose not to come back because of job opportuntiies. I know of one person asked to leave UNC's MBA program because of his performance, BUT they told him he could come back and start over the following fall. I'm just telling you this so you know that whatyou heard isn't exclusive to GMU, it happens at most MBA programs.

 

My DL NA Bachelor's has helped me double my income in about three years. So I can't complain.

The only problem I had with it, is that one person told me I would be rejected for a particular position because my degree was non-regionally accredited. However, I took the issue up with HR, and because the job posting specifically said "regionally OR nationally accredited" I ultimately got a promotion to fill that position.

 

In your opinion (or anyone else's), why is this? Why do schools practice this, meaning, why do they let people graduate with B's who are just skating by?

It's frustrating for me because I worked my butt off at Ashford only to have to worry about HR people looking down on me because I received my education online. To hear that graduate students are allowed to miss class, fail exams, but come out with B's is so frustrating! Granted, I'm not talking about everyone of course, but I talked to my friend again today and she went into more detail about it and apparently a lot of her classmates fit this bill. She said about half of her classmates show up for class regularly and the rest only come in to fail a test. Sure, she may be exaggerating a bit (I don't know) but I would be mad too if I studied my butt off and got the same grade as someone that didn't show up for class.

Back to my original question, I think I'm about to get the runaround with the enrollment advisor. I told him that I was concerned with Ashford's IACBE (not AACSB) accreditation for MBA's and his email response was "what do you know about AACSB?" If he tries to downplay it's significance, he will have made up my mind for me. I'd rather go to GMU where I know I'll pass! :laugh2:

 

Oh, I forgot to add that I had a 150% salary increase from my B.A. I consider it a success. It paid for itself in like 10 months lol

 

It's simply that they don't want people to fail out lowering their graduation rate and appearing to admit a bunch of dumba$$es. Now someone who skips class all the time and fails exams would certainly not get a B, probably a C, which is failing in grad school. Then he would need an A in another course to balance out and maintain the 3.0 GPA. I think your friend is likely exaggerating about her classmates to some extent. Look at it this way, a B in grad school is like a D in college. If you're doing your work your mark will be higher than a B. I know of some programs where the curve MUST average out to a B+ so grades are distributed accordingly to meet that target.

 

A "B" in grad school is more like a "C" in undergrad. A "B" would be considered barely passing. A "C" in grad school would be more like a "D" in undergrad. That would take you below the point of passing.