First-Time Human Study Shows Reversal in Biology of Aging - Tel Aviv University

Discussion in 'Off-Topic Discussions' started by Lerner, Nov 19, 2020.

  1. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    Sarah Knapton
    Wed, November 18, 2020, 7:39 AM PST
    HBOT chambers
    The ageing process has been biologically reversed for the first time by giving humans oxygen therapy in a pressurized chamber.

    Scientists in Israel showed they could turn back the clock in two key areas of the body believed to be responsible for the frailty and ill-health that comes with growing older.
  2. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    This is amazing.
    Especially because it proves how biological obstructions can be altered.
    This is a proof to all those people who say trans people can't change sex, that yes indeed changing sexes is possible. Chromosomes can be altered.
    You see how aging can be reversed.
    This is so beautiful.
    Humanity is malleable.
    Trans women will soon be able to have eggs and a womb. Trans men will soon be able to have sperm cells.

    I can't believe how far humanity has come in the last decade.

    We can be whoever we want to be thanks to the beauty of science.
  3. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    I personally would like this science used on health related life saving areas.
    The trans man woman, for me is hard to understand. No offense meant but this appears to much unnecessary deviation from life saving, and curing illnesses etc direction.
    But in a free society people choose their life style.
    And other possibilities is weaponizing

    China has done human testing to create biologically enhanced super soldiers, says top U.S. official.
    U.S. intelligence shows that China has conducted "human testing" on members of the People's Liberation Army in hope of developing soldiers with "biologically enhanced capabilities,"
  4. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    That was my second thought. I didn't know about the Chinese research, but it didn't surprise me. I was thinking - what if Kim Jong-Un got hold of such technology and added a million new super-soldiers to his (already) million-man army - perhaps with conversion kits for the existing soldiers?

    My first thought? In matters of gender - knowing human moral /ethical frailties, I think use might get objectionally specific. E.g. Lord Jakobovitz, the Chief Rabbi of UK made a controversial statement - he opined that it would be all right to "manipulate out" a "homosexual gene" - should such ever be discovered. His example: Parents who wanted to be more sure of having grandchildren, etc. Imagine such technology in the hands of "gay-curing" Mike Pence or other politicians with similar wacko ideas. (Remember the large-scale compulsory sterilizations in America, not all that many years ago.)

    Too often, we invent things and don't know how (not) to use them. e.g. atomic energy. I think that proper use /non-use can be learned, too - but nobody is in a rush to show up for class. They're all in the lab, making stuff.
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  5. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I'm sure Viktor Orban would go for it, in an instant. It'd be a hot seller in Iran, too. And some parts of Africa ... a remark from my (ex) barber:
    "Why don't they just kill gays here - like we used to do, back in Sudan?"

    I left - never went back.
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  6. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    Being trans is a medical condition and transitioning is life saving.
    Denying trans people proper healthcare results in suicides that could have been prevented.
    Trans women are women.
    Trans men are men.
    This is not a lifestyle.
    If there was a technology to give a trans woman a womb or a trans man testicles, it would be a moral duty to give the trans person in question access to that technology.

    Trans women have it way worse than gay men. So if there was a risk that the technology would be used to cancel out a '' gay gene '' in human beings, I still think that if enough trans women could be helped by the technology to bring body and mind in sync that the needs of the trans person in question should get priority in this instance.
    LGB have it pretty good in society nowadays.
    The same can't be said of trans people.
    Trans people still face hate and discrimination.
  7. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    I think it depends which circles they (all LGTBQ+) move in.

    I went back to college in my 40s and later worked at one I'd graduated from, part-time for a few years in my 50s. There were only one or two trans people I got to know - both trans women. And they fared OK there. With everybody. Same with gay men, as far as I could see and hear. Only knew one openly-lesbian woman there at the time. She did fine with students and faculty, but complained of frequent hard-line discrimination from Admin. staff - mostly from the cabal of arch-conservative middle-aged straight women in black dresses, who ran the entire place from their personal fiefdoms. Didn't surprise me.

    I feel properly-educated (which means more than just degrees) people are far less likely to discriminate. In fact, it's a serious error for them to do so at all. My suggestion: Trans people should try to hang with such educated people - and maybe, if looking for work, seek jobs on their turf. Maybe the rest of the gen. pop. will catch up. But until then... hang with the best. As much as you can, of course.
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  8. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    It depends what age a trans woman transitions at.
    Older trans women usually face more discrimination because they are less likely to pass ( people not noticing she's not a genetic woman).
    As a younger trans woman your chances to pass are much higher.
    My opinion (educated opinion) is that passable trans women are generally accepted, even among conservative folks.
    Enough straight alpha males would date a pretty, passable trans woman but those same men would react homophobic towards a gay man.
    Sadly gay men are often transphobic towards trans women, for no reason.
    It's so sad that a group that has known suppression themselves is now oppressing another group that needs acceptance.
    Lesbian, Gay, Bisexual people often turn their backs on trans women when it comes to fights for equal rights.
    They forget that a trans woman started Stone Wall and that they owe their equal rights to the battle that the trans community fought.

    Then it also depends on whether you want bottom surgery or not.
    Trans women who have had bottom surgery ( or plan to have bottom surgery) are generally much more accepted.

    In Canada for example a post op trans woman can give blood, while a gay man is excluded from giving blood.

    What I don't like is that society puts you in the LGBT box by default if you are a trans woman or a trans man.
    I don't like that. If the trans person self feels they identify with that label, then fine.
    But if a post op heterosexual trans woman meets a straight cis man and wants nothing to do with the LGBT label, she should be fully entitled to that.
    In fact I think a trans woman who has had gender reassignment surgery shouldn't even be obligated to disclose to a partner.
    If she meets a man and the man likes her, she doesn't owe him an explanation about how she was accidentally born in the wrong body. Once she has had gender reassignment surgery that shouldn't matter anymore. The only thing the man should know is that she can't give birth. She shouldn't be forced to disclose why she can't give birth.
    That is denying a trans woman's womanhood if she is forever to be hunted by a label that she eventually wants to distance herself from. Woman is enough at one point. The trans prefix can be left away at a certain point.
    If the man has a problem with dating a trans woman, then that is transphobia.
    Not wanting to date a specific trans woman is acceptable. Not wanting to date a trans woman who is still pre operative is acceptable.
    But if a straight cis man meets the woman of his dreams and the only thing that keeps him from wanting to date her is her trans past, then that is transphobia on the part of the man.
    Wanting biological children is a valid reason for not wanting to date a trans woman.
    Not wanting to date a trans woman simply in and of itself because she is trans or because one is scared to be seen as '' not straight '' is pure bigotry.

    I'm so happy that the world has finally become more enlighted on the subject.

    I look forward to the day that discriminating against trans women is punishable by prison sentence.

    The times that I hear people say '' oh but she has an advantage in sports '' is such nonsense.
    Once she is post operative or on a high dose of female hormones, the body no longer produces male amounts of testosterone. The metabolism, everything becomes feminine.
    She no longer has muscle mass of a male, no longer has any competitive advantage compared to cis women.

    It's because people are always searching for differences between trans women and cis women but really, after a while they are so small that they might not even be needed to be mentioned.

    Victoria Secret has started to hire trans women, Belgium has elected a transgender woman as minister of labor.
    The world is finally becoming so much more enlightened.

    In a few years from now hopefully womb transplants will be possible.
    Trans women will be able to carry the babies of their heterosexual male partners.

    I have even talked to very conservative republican people in the deep south of the United States, who were initially super against trans women and they when I started to educate them, they were so amazed by what medical science can do nowadays that they indeed admitted that the differences between trans women and cis women are neglegible if the trans woman transitions at young age ( 10s or 20s) and has all surgeries necessary to pass as a woman.

    You don't want to know how many men there are out there who are secretly attracted to trans women but who are hateful towards trans women because they are scared that people might label them '' non straight '' for showing attraction to a trans woman.

    Keanu Reeves dated Jamie Clayton. Jamie Clayton is also a trans woman.

    Amanda Lear is one of the most famous trans women in the world.
    If she hadn't been outed by April Ashley (another trans woman) no one would have known that Amanda Lear was born in a physically male body.
    The famous surgeon back then was Dr Burou, a French gynecologist in Morocco, who carried out the first modern gender reassignment surgeries.
    The surgery back then was conducted in his basement in Casablanca in the '' Clinic Du Parc '' and the procedure costed 5000 American Dollars.

    Famous tennis legend Renée Richards also wanted to have her surgery with Dr Burou but then changed her mind and had her gender reassignment surgery in New York.
    Renée Richards is still alive.
    She is in her 80s.
    She transitioned in her 40s in 1976.
    She was the first trans woman allowed to play the US open.
    A judge of the Federal High Court declared that she was allowed to play and that a chromosome test was not necessary.
    Richards is a very strong woman who is still going strong. She is still a practicing ophtalmologist.

    One of my absolute role models is Robina Asti.
    She is a flight instructor. She is 99 years old.
    She is a WWII veteran.
    She transitioned at age 56 in 1976 and is still alive today.
    She is still a practicing flight instructor.
    Robina Astia made headlines in 2012 because she was denied widow survival benefits after her husband, Norwood Patton, died.
    The social services said she was not a woman at the time of her marriage.
    Lamba Legal helped her to win a court case. She got paid out the widow benefits with retroactive power and made a precedent for all trans widows to come.

    Trans people need to be so strong in this world.
    There is nothing as courageous as being yourself.
  9. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I don't know whether I count as "enlightened" in this regard. But however unusual or unintuitive it may be, I do know the sexual self-identity of another person passes the Jefferson test, so... do you, boo.
  10. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Not true. In Canada there is a 3-month deferral after MSM for gay men - that is all. We can thank AIDS for that one, not any kind of public censure. I don't know whether or not there is exception for gay men in monogamous relationships / same-sex marriage. I'll ask around. Plus - from Belgium, I've heard the following: "In June 2019, it was explicitly reported by the LGBT media, that the Red Cross banned transgender individuals from donating blood in Belgium."
    Why don't I want to know? :)

    I think your support of trans procedures and transgendered people is a good thing. But please be sure of all your facts. If you aren't, detractors can and will use even minor errors to pick holes in your entire message. Just friendly advice.
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  11. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    Being trans is not a lifestyle though. That's what society needs to understand.
    Being trans is a medical condition.
    Transition is the cure.
    It's not something someone chooses. It has always been present.
    Someone is born trans, someone doesn't become trans from one day to another.
    There is even biological evidence for it. Read doctor Swaab. Doctor Swaab proved in the late 1990s that the gender dimorphic nucleus in our brains (located in the hypothalamus) is responsible for our gender identity.
    In trans women the gender dimorphic nucleus is of female size.
    The gender dimorphic nucleus in people identifying as male is larger than in people identifying as female.
    So there is biological evidence for being trans, hence it's not a lifestyle. It's a medical condition.

    I think it's very important for society to realise that.

    Trans surgery and trans health care is life saving.
    It's as necessary as treatments for cancer or for cardiologic issues.
    It's not cosmetic or optional.
    It should always and forever and without exceptions be covered by health insurance.
  12. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    You know the reason why I'm so supportive of transgender healthcare.
    It's closer to me than I'm going to publicly state.

    There is a court case going on now regarding the red cross ban in Belgium against trans women.

    I hope the court for human rights condemns Belgian government to pay a very high fine.

    Trans women are female. Trans women are women.
    If trans women can't give blood, then by default every woman or female can't give blood because trans women are women.
    So not only is this transphobia but also misogyny.

    I'm so exhausted when I see what a long battle still needs to be fought for trans people to gain full equality.

    By the way '' you don't want to know '' is a Dutch idiom.
    It's just an interjection that's often used.
    What I meant was that many straight men are attracted to trans women but publicly make hateful comments of pretend they would never date a trans woman, just out of insecurity because they think it will make them '' less straight '' or '' less of a man ''. Shrugs. The weak male ego of many men (not all men, I know I know) can ruin beautiful things. What does it matter what family or friends will think? If there is love that should be enough.
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2020
  13. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    It's also an English one. I know what it means - just a joke. :) The topic is completely serious - so much so, that I find the occasional joke helps.
    Good luck in the furtherance of your cause.
  14. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    Thank you.
    Where there is hope, there is life we say in Dutch.
  15. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    We say it in English too, but backwards. "Where there is life, there is hope." In English, we do almost everything backwards.
  16. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    Well we use it in two senses actually.
    We say '' hoop doet leven '' which means as much as '' as long as you cherish hope, you make for life ''
    And we say '' waar hoop is is leven '' which means as much as '' where there is hope, there is life ''

    Dutch is grammatically and structurally much more complex. English is much more compact.
    So that's why they might look so different from each other when literally translated but at their '' core '' they mean the same :)
    Johann likes this.
  17. Johann

    Johann Well-Known Member

    Good lesson. Thanks. I've got a "Dutch in 3 months" video/book course on my shelf. When I'm done with my Alison mix, I should make it next.
  18. Lerner

    Lerner Well-Known Member

    I'm a conservative in many ways and this changes are to match deviation from what I perceive as normal.
    I think its mental condition really and one is what they were born. \There is no measure of femininity or muscularity, some are more then others.
    But I don't force my views on anybody. In free society I understand the needs of other fellow human beings who don't think like me.
  19. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    It's not a mental condition. As TeacherBelgium explained, their physical neurology is different. But yes, I completely agree on the importance of a free society.
  20. TeacherBelgium

    TeacherBelgium Active Member

    Thanks. It's indeed a biological condition.
    Although you will sadly find that a lot of people still think it's a mental condition because in the DSM until recently it was listed as such.
    Fortunately it has been de-pathologized. Completely removing it from the DSM was not possible because gender reassignment surgery wouldn't be covered anymore otherwise, so they had to list it under another category. But it's no longer considered a psychiatric condition by the DSM, fortunately.

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