FBI Director James Comey

Discussion in 'Political Discussions' started by major56, Nov 4, 2015.

  1. major56

    major56 Active Member

    I suppose you'll just pass on providing an answer to my question regarding your below quoted claim. That's okay Rich ... I consider I already know the answer. Towing the Party line comes to mind (even with incorporating your liquor store scenario)... :cool2:

  2. major56

    major56 Active Member

    While not intended as a testimonial … I’ve observed no glaring indicators to date of narcissistic personalities from Republican candidates Dr. Ben Carson and Ted Cruz or—the Democratic Socialist candidate Bernie Sanders.
  3. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    So, I had these three in mind when I made my earlier statement. I suppose if I mentioned them I would have added an asterisk beside each of their names. The problem is that I'm not sure if they have narcissistic personalities or if they are true believers. For my purposes here, I don't mean "true believer" as in someone who just has beliefs. I mean someone who holds an extremist position because they truly believe in it. I think either is pretty dangerous for a top executive position, however.

    Don't get me wrong I'm not saying that a president shouldn't have beliefs. What I don't want is a president to allow those beliefs to overrule any sort of reason. If President Bernie Sanders had two mutually exclusive pieces of legislation on his desk; Bill 1 gives every student unlimited free tuition at government expense and Bill 2 kills federal financial aid completely, I think we both know which one he would sign. He's a true believer in his cause and I have no doubt he would sign Bill 1. The reality though is that signing Bill 2 could be the salvation of higher ed in the U.S. Schools that simply cannot survive without federal subsidy would fail in a truly free higher ed market. The government could, with a fraction of the saved expenditures, fully fund public institutions and offer incredibly low tuition for students and incredible research opportunities for faculty. The underlying consequence of signing Bill 2 could absolutely jive with Sanders's platform but in a way that might make him look like a hypocrite at first (and to the uneducated eye). Would he choose what was rationally best for the nation? Would he do what made him look good? Would he be willing to see past the apparent capitalistic bend to see how the end would achieve his social goal or would he just write it off because of that veneer?

    Likewise, I have no doubt that a President Cruz truly believes in the social issues he is campaigning for and against. I have no doubt that he feels a Christian obligation to shield public servants from doing their job when they have a religious objection to certain aspects of it (a matter which has repeatedly been decided by the Supreme Court in the opposite direction, by the way) or that he feels people like him are facing some sort of oppression by a fanatical minority. The thing is, the President isn't supposed to be the nation's Commander and Chief of the Legion of Christ. But it's impossible for me to know where the self-serving and where the true belief begins and ends. But when you have a guy whose father is declaring him to be "anointed" to bring about the second coming I'm skeptical that one's head isn't a bit too inflated from a lifetime of being deemed so special by such a divine source.

    I don't want a President running every decision through the bible before making a decision. People who don't read the bible live here too. And we don't live in a theocracy. Likewise, I don't want a president to make all decisions based upon the popular notions of how a "movement" would govern. I want a rational human being capable of empathy and logical thought to evaluate what is in the best interests of the nation and to act accordingly. I do not want us to become a "socialist paradise" any more than I want us to become a "Christian paradise."
  4. major56

    major56 Active Member

    Foreign Government Gifts to Clinton Foundation on the Rise - WSJ

    Bottom-line … Hillary’s corrupt—anyone with a lick of sense certainly recognizes this. Of course the bigger picture being … how many of that knowing group possess dismissive principles? I would anticipate ... too many.
  5. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    I really don't like posting this in response to your statement. I really want to believe that Dr. Carson is, indeed, a selfless individual who just wants to do the "right" thing. However, I have been skeptical about a number of his stories. Some, like the West Point story, served no interest other than making Ben Carson look good. This isn't a slight exaggeration. This is a flat out lie. I was immediately skeptical of it because Dr. Carson also insisted that his offer came with a "full scholarship." Something that told me he is likely so unfamiliar with the service academies that he never even applied.

    This isn't like when VA Secretary Robert McDonald said he was in the special forces despite "only" being an Army Ranger. This is, to me, a potential red flag the he is a person who is willing to tell any lie to make himself look good. And that's a shame. Dr. Carson has plenty to be proud of without making stuff up (just like this guy).
  6. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    Agreed. I mean, he's a brain surgeon -- a profession people literally use as a conversational placeholder for being a genius. Why gild that lily?
  7. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    Are you assuming you're entitled to demand an answer regarding someone's vote? You're not.

    I might vote for Sanders in the primary. I might vote for Clinton. Or not. To answer your question, we'll see.
  8. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    I think a lot of it has to do with context. A brain surgeon, as you note, is a conversational placeholder for being a genius. Within a hospital you are at the top of your game (and, arguably, at the top of the food chain). In a political race things that don't matter in a hospital start to matter, a lot.

    If I'm getting brain surgery I care very much how well educated, experienced and skilled my surgeon is. I couldn't care less if he or she served in the military. However, when I look at political candidates it is something that I take note of. That doesn't mean I would automatically vote for a veteran over a non-veteran but if it was the only thing to break a tie for me, I might very well sway to the veteran.

    Dr. Carson has had a brilliant career. Cuba Gooding Jr played him in a movie about him. He's an inspiration because, whether you grow up poor, middle class or wealthy, he shows that a smart person can rise to the top of a top shelf profession.

    But, if you look at that Navy captain I referenced earlier, he had everything in the world going for him as well. A Navy Captain (an O-6, the equivalent of a full Colonel in the USMC, Army and Airforce). A physician. He was also an ordained Episcopal priest. This is a guy who had reached a point in his military career where people had to yell "Attention on Deck" whenever he entered a room. He was made an honorary marine by the Commandant of the Marine Corps. And yet, he fell into a fantasy world where he told his nurse/girlfriend that he was running secret missions. The guy had an impressive medal stack but he just had to wear an unauthorized Silver Star, Purple Heart and a few other goodies.

    The guy rose to positions of prominence in religion, medicine and the military. But, he wanted more.

    Is it narcissistic? I think it may very well be. I think it also illustrates that the further you climb up Maslow's hierarchy the more "stuff" you'll decide you want and need.
  9. SteveFoerster

    SteveFoerster Resident Gadfly Staff Member

    I'm not so sure about that. Self-actualized people don't feel compelled to do that sort of thing.
  10. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    Well, that's my point, they aren't self-actualized. They haven't reached the top. They have much more than say, I do, but they are seeking out little nit picky "things."

    The difference is that while I'm sitting around wondering if I'll be able to pull of retirement their "needs" are less concrete. They have emotional needs that compel them to do weird things like this that seem peculiar to folks lower on the hierarchy.

    Saying you want "more stuff" was an inarticulate way of putting it, in retrospect. It isn't that you want more it's that the nature of what you want is shifting. When Ben Carson was young he probably had a relatively low bar. He probably felt "Boy, if I could get a career with a steady paycheck, my life will be drastically improved over my childhood experiences." So, he got that. Then he probably said "Boy, if I could have a house in a safe neighborhood, I'd be all set." Check. Soon, you have as nice of a house as you will ever have. You don't have to worry about money like you did at the beginning. Your needs are more social. At this stage, he's at a point where he doesn't "need" any physical thing. What he "needs" is for people to respect him in ways he hasn't been in the past (in addition to the ways he has been respected in the past). No more, but different.

    Trump wants us to think he's self-actualized. That he's reached the pinnacle of existence and he's just willing to give this presidency thing a go because he doesn't have anything to prove. Neither are truly self-actualized. And I suppose I have my doubts that a self-actualized person would go through this sort of routine for a (relatively) low paying job with an excessive amount of stress.
  11. major56

    major56 Active Member

    My repeated comment was more a playing-off your unindicted Hillary text. You’re absolutely right though, in that I’m not entitled to know your actual casted vote—wasn’t expecting it.

    In your mention of Sanders: Even though I contrast with nearly all of Bernie Sander’s political ideologies—yet, I have a respect for him personally. I view him as a principled man—a genuine campaigner for his political causes. Equally … I consider Bernie is actually driven to seek the presidency to serve the Nation to the best of his ability. I do not view that same incentive of service being remotely present in either Hillary Clinton or Donald Trump (e.g., a consequence of self-serving and ruthless personalities).
    Last edited by a moderator: Nov 6, 2015
  12. major56

    major56 Active Member

    The link you provide is a story that I believe broke today (?). The operative wording yesterday, e.g., "I’ve observed no glaring indicators to date...” Nonetheless, as Dr. Carson moves up in polling or any GOP hopeful ... the vetting process will become even more intense—and certainly not a welcome Friday morning headline for Ben either...
  13. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    The story did, indeed, break today. And I didn't intend to imply that it was somehow "olds news" or conflicting with what you said. I posted it because the story broke in the midst of this conversation. My displeasure with posting it was a "I hate to tell you, major..." But more of a "I was really hoping you were right about Ben Carson but this seems to undercut that.'

    I like Ben Carson as a person. And one of the things that worried me about his campaign was that I was afraid politics would alter his image in the sense that I would stop seeing him as an accomplished surgeon and more as just another lying politician. I don't think this incident undercuts the many good and respectable things he did, mind you, but I do think that it makes him kind of look like a narcissistic tool. And, honestly, I was kind of hoping he would have been the guy to be a serious contender for president without selling his soul.
  14. major56

    major56 Active Member

    I’m not at all dismissing Dr. Carson’s lack of candor regarding today’s headline about the USMA appointment—he’s a fallible man. Whether or not this lone incident will independently derail his candidacy remains to be seen. The fabrication will however lead to more investigative digging into his background and associations, along with those things he’s both historically said and written.

    Note: No endorsement, one way or another, intended re Ben Carson.
  15. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    It's important to note that he's been telling that lie for 25 years--and has published it repeatedly. It isn't a mere gaffe. (Not that you implied it; his camp has.)

    Now he's in the amazing position of trying to defend a story (his) that he attacked someone with a knife and another person (his mother) with a hammer. Again, he's insisting that it's true. The religious right loves redemption stories, the farther down the better. So he's been peddling that tale--that he was a violent punk who turned it all around--for decades. He insists it's true, but he won't offer a shred of evidence to support it, and gets angry when the media (in this case, CNN) looks into it.

    Can you imagine what the Right would have done if something like that had been true about Barack Obama? It would have been like feeding time in the shark tank. But instead, Carson leads the GOP polling. Amazing.
  16. major56

    major56 Active Member

    Switching back /pertaining to the original discussion thread topic:

    Hillary Clinton signed non-disclosure agreement to protect classified info while secretary of state | Fox News (11/07/2015)
    "On January 22nd, 2009, Hillary Clinton signed a Non-Disclosure agreement, or NDA, where she agreed to protect highly classified information, and a failure to do so could result in criminal prosecution."

    "The NDA signed by Mrs. Clinton as Secretary of State is significant because the State Department has never publicly acknowledged that she signed documents, confirming she was "advised that the unauthorized disclosure, unauthorized retention, or negligent handling" of top secret material was a punishable offense."

    Hillary Rodham Clinton: The mistress of deception and her self-inflicted wounds | Fox News (11/05/2015)
    "It is difficult to believe that the federal prosecutors and FBI agents investigating Clinton will not recommend that she be indicted. Inexplicably, she seems to have forgotten that they were monitoring what she said under oath to the Benghazi committee. By lying under oath, and by misleading Congress, she gave that team additional areas to investigate and on which to recommend indictments."

    FBI investigation into Hillary Clinton's email server | On Air Videos | Fox News (11/04/2015)
  17. davefranco

    davefranco New Member

    None of that unless the investigation is complete and the referral for indictment is denied by Lynch. Yes Comey would leak info to Congress then resign
  18. Neuhaus

    Neuhaus Well-Known Member

    If the only source you can (or care to) cite is Fox News then I must bow out. Fox has a horrendous record with the truth and doesn't even pretend to offer unbiased journalism, let alone thoughtful analysis. It's just a visual representation of the Tea party's "hope chest" at this point.
  19. Rich Douglas

    Rich Douglas Well-Known Member

    I'll wait for the indictments. Until then, it's just wishful thinking on some people's part.
  20. major56

    major56 Active Member

    Your prerogative Neuhaus (so bow-out if you choose)…

    BTW, Fox is not the only news outlet that report on Hillary’s current FBI investigation. By now it’s common knowledge. I merely provided some updated info. If you don't care for the source ... that's okay too.

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