Why isn't regional accreditation enough for a DL degree to be accepted by a B&M?

This is good info and good advice, Tony. Thank you.

 

As someone who was B&M, I heard constantly from people on hiring comittees that a DL grad would not be considered. I was even told that UF would not consider their DL PhD grads from their own program! Such is the world of academia.

 

Ok, so I'm not crazy. I thought this was the case at many institutions. I understand that it is largely based in research issues, but it appears that there is more to it than that.

 

This is inaccurate in a couple of key areas. First, the premise that "NA degrees also derive their authority under federal law" is severely flawed. Nationally accredited schools, like their RA counterparts, receive their authority to operate from their respective states, not the federal government. You would have a very tough time showing there is a federal interest at stake here.

The U.S. Department of Education is tasked with maintaining a list of reputable accrediting agencies for the purpose of determining Title IV eligibility, but that has nothing to do with (a) the permission for a school to operate or (b) which schools get accredited.

Which leads me to the second fundamental error in the post above, that there is some sort of "federal standard" to be applied across the states. Simply put, there is not. One cannot seek standardized acceptance where no standard is available to apply.

Access to higher education, regardless of one's credentials and qualifications, is not a right protected under law, assuming other laws are followed.

The U.S. higher education system operates in a flexible human capital market--with a weak qualifications system--largely defined by market forces. The risks fall almost entirely upon the student. Pining for non-existent safety net-style assurances won't change that.

 

How sad is that? The only positive thing (jokingly of course) is that those people will die and be replaced with more open-minded people.

 

The short answer is that B&M schools are really a business when it comes to hiring faculty and they have the right to pick and choose who they want to hire. If they don't like DL educated candidates, that is their choice. If I run a business and only want to hire Penn State graduates, that is my choice. I might miss out on excellent people because of my limitation just like B&M schools might miss out on excellent faculty because of their bias. It's pretty well established that in academia, at least for now, if you want a tenure-track job, you should get a traditional education from a B&M school.

 

It is sad but when is this happening? How many years from now? The problem feeds itself somewhat. It's becoming harder and harder for traditional B&M graduates to find tenure track jobs because of a flood of PhD graduates from B&M schools, let alone DL programs. Some of the newly graduated and hired B&M faculty I've spoken with tend to want to look out for their B&M brethren and don't want to open the ivory tower to DL applicants. I forsee it getting slightly better but it's not like in 10 or 15 years when the "old school" is out, things will magically become 10x easier for DL graduates.

Even having a B&M PhD isn't a job guarantee. Publications and strong CV is becoming more important. Having a DL degree is certainly a disadvantage but if you choose to go that route, make sure you have MANY publications and a strong CV to at least attempt to compete with all the other applicants. If you have a DL degree and no publications, forget it.

 

This is false! Some B-schools deny transfer credit from certain schools(even RA). I know some will not transfer credit unless it's another AACSB school( at least at the graduate level).Some ACSBP schools will not accept credit but from ACSBP or AACSB. I know from my own experience, I asked if I could take a finance class at Strayer and I was told they would not transfer it in.

 

cookderosa said "I honestly have never ... heard of an RA college denying transfer credit from another RA college on the basis of it being distance learning." Of course schools may not transfer credit for other reasons, like you've identified (AACSB, ABET, or other specialized accreditation) but cookderosa was referring to denial of transfer based purely on the credits being earned via distance.

 

I stand corrected and Cookderosa has my sincere apologies.

 

HR departments at big corporations often use where applicants went to school as a filter to who gets an interview. While there is surely some top notch talent at DL schools, a company isn't likely to use man hours sifting through all of the DL applicants and interviewing them to find the hidden gems.

 

You are talking ACSBP/AACSB vs. non-ACSBP/AACSB which is very different. Cookderosa said, "I honestly have never, ever, not even once on this board -or any other- heard of an RA college denying transfer credit from another RA college on the basis of it being distance learning."

 

Very different is subjective really. In my example of Strayer, I was not given the AASCB answer from my school. In fact, they would have accepted the credit from the University of North Alabama (not AACSB accredited). There are indeed some schools who do say straight out they will not accept credit from non-like accredited schools. I do however have no evidence that any school will not accept credit from a school just because it's DL.

 

You are incorrect to assume that it is only a state issue. For example, a DETC school derives its authority under Title 34 C.F.R. Sec 602, which entails a federal question of law. Secondarily, if A DETC graduate resided in one state and the RA school had its principle place of business in another state, it would open the door to diversity jurisdiction under federal law (28 U.S.C. Sec 1332). Even moreso, if the events giving rise to the harm occured in a state where a RA school has established minimim contacts, such as, through its website offering degree programs, which would reach nationally into every state.

With the popularity of DL programs, we are seeing more and more NA graduates and, as a class, they will conceivably be looking to be treated equally under the law with respect to the acceptance of their credentials.

Your argument needs some improvement.

 

I'm not posing an argument. I'm participating in a discussion.

Thanks for citing the CFR that supports my point. I do appreciate it.

Of course DETC is subject to federal laws, as much as any not-for-profit organization is. But your premise was utterly wrong, and your subsequent statements don't address that void.

As for your forward-looking statements: whatever. I've been in this game for more than 3 decades and I've seen/heard a lot of predictions that didn't pan out--including a few of my own. See you in 30 years.

 

This might be the single best argument on this topic I have ever seen.

Outstanding work here!

 

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No biggie. You're not the first one here to only read some of the words in a post, I've done it myself lol.