Why do people think public school teachers don't make much money?

Who would ever want to sign up for this when their whole life seems to be lived as if they were in front of a classroom. Are they not entitled to live?

 

I have a lot of teachers in my family, and I've known this for years. They all make MUCH more than my husband and I ever have- plus they work fewer days. In Illinois where I live, teachers are on a 180 day contract. An average full time working adult works 250 days.
PLUS, in New York, cosmetic surgery is covered by insurance- this year the state needed to cut jobs and offered to keep 100+ teachers if the teacher's union agreed to give up their boob jobs. I'll let you google what they decided ;p

 

Cookderosa - I heard that same cosmetic surgery fact on Fox N Friends the other day. It is ridiculous that taxpayers pay thousands of dollars on average per teacher for boob jobs and tummy tucks. I thought its supposed to be about the students, not the teachers.

 

I have been an elementary and high school teacher. I have never been one to complain about the salary. For me, it was fine and more money than I had ever made in any job previous to that. My colleagues did whine about it, and I did think they were unrealistic and needed to learn to manage their finances better instead of complaining so much.

With that said, both my ex husband and my current husband make similar money to teacher salaries with no college education. (I'm not saying that is typical but it was the case in my situation).

I am a little skeptical about the stated values of benefits and future benefits but I will admit the benefits were good when I was teaching. From what I am hearing from teachers around the country, these benefits seem to be reduced a bit each year in many areas. But I won't pretend to have any documented facts, this is just what I hear from my extensive interaction with teachers (I teach a master's degree program for teachers, online so I hear it from teachers everywhere).

Teaching elementary might still be okay, but I would not go back to teaching high school in a public school for double or triple the salary. While I am sure the 7 hour days, 180 days a year is very close to the actual work hours for some teachers, I am one of those (and I know many more) who spend almost as much time working on school related stuff, outside of school as they do while at school.

It was the attitude of the kids and lack of support from administration that I found to be the worst part of the job, and the reason I would not want to go back to it. I could tell about many incidents but here are two:

I sent a problematic disruptive kid to the office (which was my only real option). He went down and "told his side of the story." When I inquired about this kid's consequences, I was told "It is his word against yours so nothing will happen." So the word of a kid who has been in trouble repeatedly was treated equally with my word (believe me, they had no record of me making up stories about kids' bad behaviors and sending them to the office).

I had a 10th grader who came to class about 10 minutes late every day. My only option was to write this up and send to the office. After so many "lates" he would be assigned detention. Whether he ever "served" his detentions, I don't really know.

This one day he came in while I was trying to lecture and explain the day's lesson, and he plunked loudly into his seat, turned around and slammed his hand on the desk behind him, asking that kid if he could borrow a pencil.

I realized by that time in my career that raising my own voice was pointless so I calmly said: "The least you could have done was to bring your book and a pencil to class."

He shot back: "If you had to get up at 6:30, you wouldn't have your book or pencil either!"

I had gotten up at 3:30 that morning because I had two other jobs to do, needed to prepare for my day at the high school, and it was an hour's drive to the school. I did not say a word back to him, but I will admit that was the day I said to myself I was not going back the next year. Oh, and by the way, I did have my books and pencils and all other needed materials with me that day.

I highly prefer teaching at the college level.

 

Is it the entire state or just Buffalo, NY with the free cosmetic surgery??

 

I guess it is the great money. Ask any school district administrator in the 6-figure range. Interesting, if 50-70k is so great, why do the administrators need so much more?

BTW:

Thirty-five-year-old Natalie Santagata was an elementary school teacher at Kingsway Elementary School in Charlotte County, Florida, for nearly a decade. But she was fired earlier this year after scandalous videos and images were anonymously sent to school officials.

The drama that cost Santagata her job started back in June 2011, when her employer received four photographs and five videos showing her performing “graphic” sex acts and purportedly smoking marijuana. Interestingly, these videos were filmed in private localities where no students or minors were present.

Still, although she passed her most recent drug test and despite the fact that she violated no laws with her behavior, the district was so disappointed that officials decided she needed to be let go. The Herald Tribune has more on the district’s response:

Superintendent Douglas Whittaker recommended Santagata’s termination based on “personal conduct (or misconduct)“ that ”clearly rises to the statutory standard of moral turpitude“ and ”demonstrably impacted your effectiveness as a classroom teacher in our district.”

 

My sister, a former high school English teacher did the same thing. Many hours outside the classroom grading essays and such.

I hope those that think it is such a wonderful, high paying job go apply. We have many openings here in Florida that go begging for applicants. As a beginning teacher you will get the opportunity to work in interesting schools that will expose you to different cultures and languages. Interact with students of varying personalities, helicopter parents that believe Little Billy can do no wrong, and parents that couldn't care less. Be told you make too much money, have your retirement benefits reduced, get to take work home and more! Having disgruntle students trash you on http://www.ratemyteachers.com/ for the world to see is an added bonus.

 

The 8 hours a day part simply isn't a fact. It's usually quite a bit longer. My frame of reference is having taught high school.

If teaching el-hi school is such a great gig, why aren't more people applying for the job? There is an almost constant need for special ed teachers, and a reasonably good demand for science teachers. I believe the reason more people don't want the job is that most teachers earn every nickel doing things most people never realize for less and less respect and recognition.

 

My sister left teaching and is now a letter carrier for the US Postal Service. Covered by a no-layoff clause, never takes work home, 5 weeks of paid vacation and added sick leave. Overtime available. She makes far more than she did as a teacher. All for a job that doesn't even require a high school diploma!!!

 

As a fellow Floridian I thought you would appreciate this one:

Teacher fired for drawing phallic-like Florida | Plog

Teacher Ryan Haraughty was fired from from Mission Valley Middle School after drawing a map of the United States with a plump, penis-like Florida and making an off-hand remark about the state's level of excitement.

Go figure middle school students jumped on the juvenile humor. Haraughty told Fox 4 that he tried to blow it off.

"I drew Florida out of proportion," said Haraughty. "The kids jump all over stuff like that, 'Oh Mr. Haraughty, Florida is all wrong. OK, whatever, not thinking, I said, 'Florida got excited.' And right after, I'm thinking, you know, but I decided I'm not going to dwell on it."

The district axed him for the comment, saying he created a sexually hostile environment.

Haraughty's students aren't happy.

 

Wow! I have heard of no other State that does that. In fact, most state governments, like mine, raise health care cost while raising the cost of pension contributions. Basically, any raise seen quickly evaporates into a wash.

I wonder if these teachers who have cosmetic surgery work covered pay more for such a cadillac/optional plan? This sounds like an isolated case to me.

At this point, I have not read enought about it to comment on it intelligently. I will venture to say, the average teacher/past teacher in this forum have never had their boob or pec jobs covered by their government insurance. I have several teachers in the family, and they have no such coverage.

Thanks for the info.

Abner

 

Yeah, the teachers in my family experience ever growing classrooms, and several special needs kids are stuck in regular classrooms for non special ed teachers to deal with. So they not only have to deal with parents who don't want their kids disciplined, but now have to figure out how to deal with certain kids who have sudden outbursts and get out of control. Homework, grading assignments work is taken home and worked on extensively at home I notice. I also notice more and more teachers dipping into their own pockets to buy supplies for their classrooms.

Oh boy!

Abner

 

Hang them (the school administrators) high as Haman!

 

Man, teaching sounds like such a tough gig I'm not sure why anyone would want to be a teacher. Low pay, crime in the schools, no parental involvement, special ed mainstreaming, homework that you have to take...well home...and to top it off you don't actually get any extra time off at all.

Those of you who know teachers, can you ask them a question for me? What percentage of influence do teachers have on student outcomes?

And just a minor note about teachers dipping into their own money to buy school supplies. Number one, you can claim that on your taxes as a deduction, and number two just use your superior academic mind and do what all the teachers that I know do...send a list home with the kid so that the PARENTS purchase all the supplies.

My last bill at Wal Mart for my 5th grader and 2nd grader? $141. Problem solved.

 

Administration is a whole big issue itself. Many schools have almost 1 non-teacher per teacher.

That's what I hear from my cousins who are teachers. They also say parents come to parent-teacher conference or send them emails bitching about their kids grades instead of helping their own kids.

I understand extra hours. My non-teaching job requires many hours outside of work.

This is what I feel attributes to the high turnover rate a lot more than the pay.

Not many people want to be special ed teachers. My aunt is one and from the stories she tells me its tough. I think the demand for science teachers is partly because most people who want to be teachers go the english, social science, etc. route in college. Most people taking biology, chemistry, etc. have other ambitions. So science teachers are always in demand from what I hear.

This again leads me to believe it's the working conditions and not the pay that suck.

 

I agree with the crime in the schools, no parental involvement, special ed mainstreaming, etc.
I don't agree with the low pay (its good but not great), no extra time off (spring/winter breaks, 2-3 months in summer?)
I have a private sector job and constantly bring work home. Yes I would love not to bring work home, but that's just not the reality of my job.

I have asked this and it's not nearly as high as you might think. There is very little parental involvement nowadays and it's almost non existent in the inner city schools.

I don't think it's the teacher's responsibility to buy supplies, although some of my cousins do it.

 

We could start a whole new thread on postal workers. For the last 20 years the amount of mail being delivered is a fraction of what it used to be thanks to email, fax, text, video conferencing, Internet, etc. When is the last time you heard of mass layoffs to compensate?

 

I'm always amazed at the amount of decay and lack of morals and responsibility that our teachers see. They go to work and have apathetic criminal kids who don't listen, parents who do not care, the above mentioned crime and such, in a school that can't afford books, they work all summer, and have to buy things for the classroom. I've never met someone discussing teachers tell me they work in a good school where the parents do care and the kids try a least a little bit to learn.

Surely schools like this exist somewhere? Everyone on here and in other disucssions about teachers insists that the teachers they know teach in the worst schools imagineable. What a weird phenomenon

 

Any job in the world is subject to this: A balance must be struck between job suck-i-ness, take home pay/compensation, and qualifications to do the job.