Looking for a DBA / PhD program !

Scott,

I think DegreeInfo should be changed to "Distance Learning for Dummies"... the place where one can go to find information about the least respected, quickest and easiest academic programs on the planet.

Why pursue a degree from a internationally respected, traditional, b&m university in Scotland that is older than your father's, father... when you can pursue an American degree of little respect from a virtual university that is a few years old... makes sense, doesn't it?

Scott... what do you think my chances in academia with this CV

BA Thomas Edison State College (for week program)
MBA University of Pheonix
Phd Touro University International

All accredited... kinda sends shivers up your spine, doesn't it?

 

Incidently... Scott, Ken and Peter are all the same person.

 

Still the question is unanswered. He was not steering, he made the statement that Touro is a "Sham". On what basis??

What basis do you have for feeling he was steering to a more respected school. I do not know where the person wanted to use the degree but on what basis do you feel that USQ would be more respected than RA Touro in the US?

Some factual statements would be helpful otherwise we have nothing but unsubstantiated statements.

North

 

I am stating that to Touro International University is a SHAM. I stand by my comment when comparing this "university" to the likes of very old, reputable schools like The University of Glasgow.

For heavens sake, The University of Glasgow was founded in 1451 and is Scotland's second oldest university, after The Universiy of St Andrews. It is one of the UK's leading research universities and has an international reputation for excellence.

Touro is a virtual university founded recently. It has no domestic or international reputation to speak of and will likely disappear from the scene in the next few years.

I think there is massive denial going on in this forum. RA is becoming more and more meaningless with the passage of every year and the additional to the RA list of schools like "Touro".

Pheonix, Touro, Thomas Edison, Excelsior, Charter Oak are poor excuses for educational institutions and their existance can only lead to the "watering down" of the American educational system.

A degree from The University of Glasgow is internationally respected. Is it any wonder that students from all over the world are going to the UK for their education? A degree from Glasgow will put the graduate in the same league as top American and international schools like Harvard, Cambridge, Oxford, Rome, Paris, etc.

A degree from Touro will be questioned wherever you go. Is it worth it? I think not.

 

Ken/Peter/Scott:

Wow!! I am starting to get mixed up with all of your personalities. If you think this site is for dummies, why are you wasting your time coming to this site, creating 3 different names and making comments to yourself? By the way, I am dieing to know what schools you matriculated from.

 

Using that logic, Stanford & UC-Berkeley are shams, because Harvard was founded in the 1600's.

When you make an assertion here that any school is a "sham", you're going to be asked to back up that statement. You've been asked to back up your statement about Touro, and you can't do it. That relegates the statement to the garbage heap of Degreeinfo.


Bruce

 

We are being trolled. It's that simple. The reason that "Scott" and "Ken" tell us that Touro is a sham is precisely the anguished reaction that they hope that the provocative remark will generate.

Concerning Touro...

Far from being a "virtual university", presumably meaning that it only exists in cyberspace (why would that be so damning?), Touro is rapidly expanding its physical facilities. Their Touro University College of Osteopathic Medicine (TUCOM) started occupying a 173 acre site at the former Mare Island Naval Shipyard in Vallejo California in 1999. They describe the developments there:

Completed in Summer 1999 were the Basic Science Building, the Library and Information Services Building, Administration Building, Faculty Office Building, single and married student housing, the Student Center, and Cafeteria. Additional facilities will be developed as Touro expands its Health Sciences Program, Teacher's College, Business College and Liberal Arts School on the campus in the near future.

So it seems that Touro is in the process of building a full-service university campus in Northern California.

Back in New York at the Touro Law Center, an ABA accredited law school, the Public Interest Law Organization at Touro (PILOT) won the 2001 Outstanding Member Group Project Award from the National Association for Public Interest Law.

Meanwhile the Touro Graduate School of Jewish Studies, offering courses in both New York City and Jerusalem, offers a pretty impressive lineup of coursework:

http://www.touro.edu/judagrad/Course.htm

Touro is a "virtual university" only in the sense that its programs are distributed to a number of geographically dispersed sites, from both Northern and Southern California to New York City and then way off to Jerusalem.

I might point out to the skeptics that a number of the Australian universities that we discuss here, including Charles Sturt, are also distributed among a number of sites. Most of the universities in London occupy multiple sites, including the University of London itself.

 

Most likely true, but we (Administrators) will know more within a few days.

Even so, an outrageous statement such as the one made by "Scott" cannot be left unchallenged. I think it was Joseph Goebbels (the Nazi Minister of Propaganda) who said "A lie repeated often enough becomes the truth".

Whoever said it, that's a hard truth. Consequently, such a statement (about Touro) shouldn't be allowed to go unchallenged. I made the challenge, but "Scott" hasn't accepted it yet. Not a big surprise.


Bruce

 

Never let the issues be clouded by facts. Except for when he's quoted in the posts of others, I don't even see the Cast of One anymore.. this, thanks to the Twit Filter ("Ignore List" to most.)

I propose another improvement to the BB software, though: Instead of putting Johnny Reincarnation through all the labor of posting the troll-bait anew each time, why not create a hyperlink that h can insert into threads, instead? It can take the reader to a page which simply says, "U.S. R.A. institutions are generally jokes, substandard, and far inferior to even mediocre schools in Canada, the UK, and Australia. Bad, bad, bad. Not generally respected. Consider H-W instead. Or any school other than one based in the States. I have lots of evidence to support this position, but I won't share any of it with the likes of you." It'll save him the typing, cut down bandwidth, and relieve those of us with Ignore Lists from wondering what we've been missing.

 

I think this is an excellent point! TUI is just one campus of a small (not big?) but well-respected brick & mortar school. MSC thinks so, at least.

I really don't understand how you can pick on Touro. Their programs are solid. The people are great. Ok, so the University of Glasgow has a mostly DL DBA program. Cool. I might actually be able to read the web page if the font wasn't so microscopic in IE. From memory, it's about US 7,200 per year for at least three years, so it's not significantly less expensive than TUI. What's the deal? I don't get why it's so great of a choice for those who are Stateside. Perhaps we might not want to fly to Scotland to defend a dissertation (or do they call it a thesis there) or explain why we went off-shore to study something we could study here. I just don't see the advantage to the University of Glasgow. The TUI campus is still young; that's about all you can say about it.

Cheers,

Dave

 

Thank you Bruce. Thank you Bill Dayson.
Jack

 

"I think there is massive denial going on in this forum. RA is becoming more and more meaningless with the passage of every year and the additional to the RA list of schools like "Touro". "

Scott,

I once thought that what was really happening on this forum was ignorance. There was an honest lack of knowledge regarding how virtual universities are respected by the "elite" (be it academia, business, whatever... yes, people who serve fries at McDonald's do sometimes have MBAs but there opinions are probably not valid), how RA compares with the academic standards of other countres, etc..

However, there has been significant evidence posted to substantiate the views similar to yours. See "The Economist", "Business Week", Australian / Canadian / British academic authorities, etc., etc., etc..

This evidence is apparently ignored as it does not support the legitimacy of US degrees "earned" with minimum "academic" standards.

If you question the rigor of RA, if you question whether US standards are equivalent to British (etc.) standards, if you question that the perceived quality of a school impacts utility, if you question the respect of degrees from virtual universities, if you question the respect of degree from for-profit corporations... you are labelled a troll. This can actually be quite humorous... see Lawrie who is praised for offering the 4 wk BA to the masses but openly criticized for suggesting that British standards are more rigorous than American ones... or, unfortunatlely, Andy who has been torched for recognizing that the degrees offered by for-profit corps and not highly respected.

Bottom line... I have to believe that you are correct with respect to denial. The positions that the self-proclaimed "experts" promulgate are so fraudulent, so contrary to truth, so contrary to they obvious evidence... even reported on this very forum... that denial (or perhaps the desire to purpetrate a fraud?) is the only reasonable explanation.

Scott... any thoughts?

 

My thoughts: Yawn!

Dave

 

Thanks everyone for all the responses --

Hello,

this is the person who STARTED this thread.
Thanks to all the folks for the feedback.

This thread seems to have turned into a pro vs. con discussion of Touro, and an (understandable) hammering of "Scott".
IMO, Touro is TOO EXPENSIVE, so perhaps we can drop discussing Touro within the context of this thread.

My focus will probably be a programme based in Australia, New Zealand or the United Kingdom.

A U.K.-based programme seems very attractive, because I am a citizen of Germany, and the damn Germans (i.e. the government) is very picky about accepting a degree from a "foreign" institution. It is not that I intend to use my PhD / DBA degree for academic (teaching) or professional purposes in Germany (since I live in the U.S.), but I wouldn't mind having that "Dr." written in my passport in front of my name. Also, the U.K.-based public universities give a lowered tuition to EU-citizens (only about 1,000 British pounds per year), which would probably the best bargain I could possibly get.

University of Glasgow was mentioned several times on this thread, and I will investigate it further. Also, there was a thread which annonced the name "University of Lincoln" -- does anyone know more about this school?

Any information / knowledge about PUBLIC universities in the U.K. (although Australia and New Zealand are still a possibility) are highly appreciated -- the schools do not necessarily have to be 100% DL, as I could go to Europe part of the year.

Thanks everyone.

 

New thread as a continuation / focus of this thread

Hi,
I just started a new thread that continues / focuses this thread.

http://www.degreeinfo.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=4505

 

Comparison

If you had a choice between respected foreign universities such as The University of Glasgow, The University of Southern Queensland, or Heriot-Watt University AND Touro University International, I would definately recommend the foreign schools.

Regional accreditation (RA) is a benchmark that is obviously set very low. Schools like Harvard, Yale and MIT obviouly far exceed the minimum requirements for accreditation, wheras TUI probably just makes it. I would look towards the US News 2002 College Rankings for a better indication of respectability.

The "accreditation" systems in the UK, Canada and Australia are of a much higher standard than RA in the USA. Do not be fooled by the "branch campus" tag line used in the TUI diploma. Why do you think they even mention it? Obviously to gain some legitimacy.

All things being equal, go for a traditional B&M university that offers a DL option to an established on-campus program.