Comparing TUI Ph.D. to AACSB Ph.D.

This AACSB, IACBE or any other alphabet soup has been beaten to death in this forum. I still believe what Steve King has written on it. I also believe based on personal experience and what others have written on this forum that it does not mean a thing. It does not guarantee job opportunities or more income even in academic world. All these additional accreditation are merely marketing gimmicks to stay in business by such organization. It really does not add value unless where it leads to professional credentials. We have Walden graduate at John Hopkins, NDU in Washington etc. Touro PhD program is too recent to evaluate how their graduates are performing in the work place but based on their students I have met, they will compete with any school in the future. At this point of my career, teaching is not an option unless as an adjunct when time permits. After retirement, I will consider teaching at any institution and a doctorate from any accredited university will suffice in addition to the solid work history I have been building for the past 14 years. Those academic people who thumbs their nose at Community Colleges are not fit to be in academic in the first place. Community colleges mid grade professionals than all of the four year colleges combined. Those who teach at community colleges are not any less qualified than those in four year colleges, in some case more qualified.

Godwin

 

Godwin - I couldn't disagree more. First, AACSB does make a difference in the academic job market. This has been shown in this thread already. In the business world AACSB isn't as big a deal - except all of the best known B-schools are AACSB. Your employer may not know how to spell AACSB, but if he has a preference for B-schools, it is highly likely it will be for an AACSB school.

There are no guarantees in the job market. But I'd rather face a challenging market with an AACSB degree than without one. Of course, where you graduated from is only part of the story. As the years go by, academic credentials mean less. Your job experience (and publications if you are seeking an academic job) mean more.

Second, and more importantly, the steps a school has to take to earn AACSB accreditation are significant and meaningful to students. Without a doubt the best business schools in the U.S. are among the 350 AACSB accredited schools. Pick any ranking list you want - the top B-Schools are AACSB.

Why don't DL schools go for AACSB? In most cases they don't because they aren't qualified (be it due to faculty, curriculum, library, etc.) and the changes it would take to achieve AACSB are costly.

If you want an MBA or DBA/PhD fast and cheap - forget an AACSB school. RA only programs aren't without merit. It is just that they aren't of the same caliber as AACSB schools offer. If you really want the highest quality business school education, go AACSB. It really is that simple.

Regards - Andy

 

TUI and AACSB

With the rumor around that TUI is attempting to acquire AACSB accreditation it would appear that even they value the AACSB label. That, right there, speaks volumes.

 

Re: TUI and AACSB

Chris - not to mention, the boys and girls at Nova Southeastern have recently taken great interest in the new AACSB standards. They are weighing their options and the potential to be AACSB accredited.

Regards - Andy

 

I think there are two topics here and they are very different.

1. Does AACSB accreditation matter to employers / schools for their professors?

I think this answer is yes, for all the reasons above.

2. Does AACSB accreditation make a better school?

I think this is what Oko is arguing, which is an entirely different topic and discussion.

I have commented on #1, and I think employers are now looking harder into accreditation (my employer only reimburses AACSB, and they know what it means). With the internet, there are too many mills out there and when these companies start to realizse twhat all of the accreditation issues are, they are starting to realize the difference.

As for #2, I don't know yet, I have seen too many schools that are AACSB and don't make the grade in my mind, but I do think AACSB is a start.

Go TUI!!!

 

Does AACSB matter?

Question 1: Does AACSB have an edge over RA-only program?
Answer: Yes. Of course it does.
Question 2: Are most AACSB-accredited programs better than most non-AACSB program?
Answer: Most likely (Yes).
Question 2: Would lack of it prevent you you from practicing your profession?
Answer: No.
Question 3: Would lack of it prevent you from obtaining a professional license?
Answer: No
Question 4: Would lack of it prevent you from getting a very good job?
Answer: No
Question 5: Would lack of it prevent you from securing tenure at a good state university?
Answer: No

Bottom Line:
AACSB is very important but it does not have the same weight as other forms of professional accreditation such as AMA, ABA, ABET, APA, etc. It should be noted that AACSB accreditation does not lead to any kind of professional licensure. While other types of professional accreditations may be looked upon as “ must-have”, AACSB may be considered as “need to have”.
In general, RA, DETC, GAAP, etc may also be considered as “must-have”. In other words, these institutional accreditations carry more weight than AACSB accreditation. Of course, that does not diminish the import of AACSB accreditation. I am sure that a reality check will bring to the fore the import of AACSB accreditation in the academia and corporate environments.

Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D

 

Does AACSB matter?

Question 1: Does AACSB have an edge over RA-only program?
Answer: Yes. Of course it does.
Question 2: Are most AACSB-accredited programs better than most non-AACSB program?
Answer: Most likely (Yes).
Question 2: Would lack of it prevent you you from practicing your profession?
Answer: No.
Question 3: Would lack of it prevent you from obtaining a professional license?
Answer: No
Question 4: Would lack of it prevent you from getting a very good job?
Answer: No
Question 5: Would lack of it prevent you from securing tenure at a good state university?
Answer: No
Question 6: Is it required to secure tenure at an AACSB-accredited business school and most prestigious universities?
Answer: Yes


Bottom Line:
AACSB is very important but it does not have the same weight as other forms of professional accreditation such as AMA, ABA, ABET, APA, etc. It should be noted that AACSB accreditation does not lead to any kind of professional licensure. While other types of professional accreditations may be looked upon as “ must-have”, AACSB may be considered as “need to have”.
In general, RA, DETC, GAAP, etc may also be considered as “must-have”. In other words, these institutional accreditations carry more weight than AACSB accreditation. Of course, that does not diminish the import of AACSB accreditation. I am sure that a reality check will bring to the fore the import of AACSB accreditation in the academia and corporate environments.

Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D

 

Re: Does AACSB matter?

With these clarifications, I agree with you.

Do you think the trend is going towards or away from AACSB, it seems to me they are gaining recognition, but I am not sure how many in the "real world" do know. Any thoughts?

 

In Question 6, the word "bisiness" is a typo. The word "business" was intended but my fingers typed a non-word in its place. I will be very happy if degreeinfo moderators will correct that typo for me.

Ike

 

Re: Does AACSB matter?

Ike - I agree with you about everything except Question #5. From my experience, I can tell you that a PhD/DBA from a non-AACSB school will likely prevent you from being hired at a "good state university". Some may accept it - but you'd be amazed how many so-so schools won't accept a PhD/DBA from a non-AACSB school.

Regards - Andy

 

Re: Re: Does AACSB matter?

AACSB has been the trend and there is no immediate cause or indication to think otherwise. Many business schools in the United States (with few exceptions) would like to be accredited by AACSB but that is not possible because many business programs will never meet AACSB standards. Although AASCB is very popular in the United States, its popularity is yet to permeate the mainstream academia in its geographical propinquity. For example, several prestigious universities in Mexico and Canada are not AACSB-accredited. They are not even seeking it and there is no reason to think that they will ever seek it.
Only a very small number of universities in Europe and Asia are accredited members of AACSB and these institutions are not even the most prestigious universities in the countries that they are located. The most prestigious universities in United Kingdom (Oxford and Cambridge) are not accredited members of AACSB and there is no likelihood that they will ever seek AACSB accreditation. AACSB will continue to gain recognition and popularity but these will continue to be confined within the shores of the United States. You should also realize that there are competing accreditation agencies for business programs in Europe (EQUIS, AMBA, etc) and Asia and these agencies will not likely be replaced by AACSB. As long as AACSB accreditation does not lead to licensure and is not a requirement for practice, its weight and importance will continue to lag the weight and importance of other professional accreditations (ABA, AMA, APA, etc). AACSB will also continue to co-exist with other business school accreditation agencies in the US, especially ACBSP.

Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D.

 

In Illinois..

almost every state university is a member of the AACSB.

 

Re: Re: Re: Does AACSB matter?

I have heard two things.

1. AACSB is renaming themselves, meaning European schools are having a tough time with the "American" in the title.

2. AACSB is re-looking at their standard, namely the ratio of full time professor's. European schools seem to draw on a par ttime pool of experts for some of their base of professors, making a great way to bring in real world talent, but the full time ratio is low.

November will be interesting with new members.....

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Does AACSB matter?

I dont think many European schools would bother getting AACSB accreditation. They have their own AMBA and EQUIS accreditation.

 

Re: In Illinois..

No, that's an overstatement. In New Jersey, many are not. State Universities in New Jersey that not accredited members of AACSB include Kean University, New Jersey City University, William Patterson University, and Richard Stockton College.

Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D.

 

European Perception

Dear friends,

I would like provide a new perspective in case someone decide to cross the Atlantic. It is my personal experience that here in Europe job's advertisements, or job agencies, human resources searches, etc, ... don't require that specific accreditation, and I look at them on a daily basis. My wife also looks into university teaching jobs quite frequently, and they require in general PhD degrees, teaching experience, publications, and expertise on certain topics. Period.

Furthermore my impression is that Europeans perceive those degrees in Business Administration with certain disdain like it was professional education (an euphemism for lower level education). People in general know Harvard, Yale, Stanford, and for the rest... well, I am sure you all understand what I mean. Those accrditations are unknown for the general public, and, as I said, nobody seem to care about them. BTW, I have an American, oncampus education, of which I feel very proud. I am now looking for a PhD in Technology Management, Engineering Management or Business Administration. Touro seems to be an excellent option, and I couldn't care less about ACCSB as long as the university is regionally accredited, which is what my employers will be looking at. In my personal case, the fact that Touro is an accredited, non for profit university suffices me.

Thanks

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Does AACSB matter?

Trends say otherwise. Many schools in Europe have, and are in the process of getting AACSB (they also have EQUIS, but the AACSB marketing to a different crowd).

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Does AACSB matter?

I don't think so. Can you provide a list of "many" schools in Europe that are currently seeking AACSB accreditation?

Ike Okonkwo, Ph.D.

 

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Does AACSB matter?

I can provide you with the list from the last round of accreditation from last April.

http://www.aacsb.edu/accreditation/newaccred.asp

As you can see, there are several that received accreditation. More than before and the list will continue to grow.

The next round is Oct / Nov, and are some in the process that will be granted (fingers crossed).

Since so many US schools are behind the times, and think that AACSB is the only way to go, and our scholastic arena is becoming a global marketplace, some schools see the value. It is OK that you don't, but the facts say otherwise and nobody should be misguided that it does not matter. But if the question is, Does anybody care in the European community for employment about AACS, I agree, it does not matter EQUIS is the standard. If European schools are going to try to get Amecian scholars, they are realizing what the market needs, hence getting AACSB accreditation.

I guess I don't understand why you think that nobody in Europe is, and they will not?

Henley did, the website is full of European schools, granted nowhere near the USA, but this is an "emerging market"

List of schools in Europe already accredited:
ESSEC Business School - Paris (France)
ESCP-EAP European School of Management, Paris/Oxford/Madrid/Berlin (France)
HEC - Paris (France)
Universitaet Mannheim (Germany)
University College Dublin (Ireland)
Universiteit Maastricht (Netherlands)
Rotterdam School of Management (Netherlands)
Universiteit van Tilburg (Netherlands)
King Fahd University of Petroleum and Minerals (Saudi Arabia)
ESADE Business School (Spain)
Instituto de Empresa (Spain)
United Arab Emirates University (UAEU) (United Arab Emirates)
Ashridge (United Kingdom)
Aston University (United Kingdom)
Cranfield University (United Kingdom)
Henley Management College (United Kingdom)
London Business School (United Kingdom)
The University of Manchester (United Kingdom)
University of Warwick (United Kingdom)

 

Don't worry 'bout it. I n Georgia, "business" is written and pronounced "bidness".