What's cooking for the future in the world of online doctoral programs?

Discussion in 'General Distance Learning Discussions' started by thomas_jefferson, Jun 12, 2010.

  1. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    Well, thank you. :cool:
  2. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    A positive social sanction diffused from the reference group of moderators. Randall is indeed a mobilizing agent.
  3. me again

    me again Well-Known Member

    A miscreant is as a miscreant does

    Much agreed. However, based upon past experience, it will probably have little to no effect on the miscreant. Why not? Because the miscreant simply "doesn't get it." LOL
  4. Cyber

    Cyber New Member

    Just wondering what he teaches his students at TUI. Glad I never had him in any of my courses. I think what he's really trying to do is discourage as many folks as possible from getting a doctoral degree (he'd rather be the only one with a doctoral degree) so few can "level up" to his educational level. Also, if he's got his way, I suspect he'll also make a case for stopping DL doctorates totally especially after getting his. Very shameful indeed...

    Anyway, I applaud Dr. Pina for remaining polite and professional despite the insolence from DW.
  5. Dave Wagner

    Dave Wagner Active Member

    Thanks. This explanation is good enough for me. These anonymous posters are often a bother...
  6. Dave Wagner

    Dave Wagner Active Member

    Normally, I don't respond to insults, especially from those who cower in fear behind anonymous identities...

    However, I'm going to make an exception this time. You've mischaracterized my views of DL doctorates; my point all along is that some of these programs are designed primarily to generate cash, not scholars or scholarship.

    The operators of some of these "doctoral programs" trick narcissistic students into enrolling and drain them of all their cash by extending and changing the requirements for graduation over and over and over again.

    This practice (and the business model that supports it) is immoral, unethical, and often illegal, in my opinion... The doctoral programs designed to generate cash seem easy to spot, as they accept large numbers of students with almost no admissions process and graduate just a tiny few.

    Some have suggested that the overall graduation ratio for all doctoral programs is 1 diploma for 4 students admitted. My estimate is more like 1 diploma for 10 students admitted, for regionally-accredited DL doctoral programs. I suspect, DETC graduation ratios will be lower than 1 in 10 students admitted. Yes, of course, there are many reasons why students quit doctoral programs, but the programs I'm referring to are designed to lure in students and then require more and more cash to get the investment out, which is one of elements of a Ponzi scheme.

    Since there is no informed consent at the beginning of the process, said doctoral programs are hopelessly mired in hypocrisy from the beginning.

    My views are not popular and I expect the perpetrators to identify themselves with attacks on me.

    Hopefully, the operators of such doctoral cash schemes will be dissuaded from their business models and so the harm to unsuspecting students can be reduced. Don't admit students you know don't have what it takes to complete. Don't blame students for your own incompetence. Don't expect to be paid for doing nothing. Don't produce useless, generalized scholarship under the guise of academic rigor. Well, you get the picture...
    Last edited by a moderator: Jun 20, 2010
  7. salami89

    salami89 New Member

    Agree with Dave Wagner on this one really ponzi and if the probability of 3 passing, they have made a profit on the pyramid scheme. There are many down under but then again the media has highlighted the plight of sub-continentals down under that one doesn't have to repeat it.
  8. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator


    While I do understand your point (really) and do agree that people as smart as a rock will never have a chance to make it through the program, I also feel there needs to be some flexibility in the admissions process. I do not think open admissions is always good. What if someone was not the best student in the past but really does have a burning desire to produce scholarly work? What if they got their graduate degree 15 years ago and life has chanced and they have become someone else - not the person their 2.7 GPA represents? How do you allow them a pass and filter out the others?
  9. scubasteveiu

    scubasteveiu New Member

    Good post.

    This reminds me of some of our publicly traded schools. The idea of selling an expensive but false dream should be questioned and be considered criminal, as explained by Dave. That said I don't believe he said it's still not of value (offering utility) to some.

    I have an MBA from UoP however I will never attend a 'traded' university again. Too much emphasis on stock price.

  10. Anthony Pina

    Anthony Pina Active Member

    Unfortunately, neither PBS, nor authors for the Chronicle of Higher Education and Inside Higher Ed, nor our politicians seem to be aware of the fact that many--if not most--propietary/private sector/for-profit higher ed institutions are NOT publicly-traded entities of large corporations. Not every "for-profit" is a Phoenix, Strayer, Walden, Capella, American Intercontinental, etc., nor do they operate like a "traded" institution.
  11. So... does anyone know of any doctoral programs in the works that aren't listed on the university's web site yet? :)
  12. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    Wow, what a rabbit trail your thread went down.
  13. Anthony Pina

    Anthony Pina Active Member

    Yes, I do, but I am not even go to go there! :)
  14. SurfDoctor

    SurfDoctor Moderator

    LOL! Don't blame you.
  15. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    I will jump on the grenade – Check out Sullivan University - they will be offering a great PhD program soon. I maybe wrong but that is what I think I heard once upon a time...;)
  16. Hm... a mid-career doctorate? Sounds like an excellent idea! I look forward to learning more about it.

    Anyone know any others?
  17. Anthony Pina

    Anthony Pina Active Member

    No, Randell and I are not the same person either. I would not have the endurance to do a PhD and MBA at the same time :)
  18. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    However, maybe now is a good time to admit that I am Maniac Craniac. :)
  19. Maniac Craniac

    Maniac Craniac Moderator Staff Member

    Above post is a joke, FYI :D
  20. Randell1234

    Randell1234 Moderator

    or maybe we are...;)

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