What if the unthinkable happens?

Friends,
Two “accredited” schools come to mind when pursuing PhD online program. Torou University and Northcentral University. Torou is a bit expensive and less responsive and has limited seats. NCU is much affordable, more responsive, and they don’t have problems accommodating new students. Both universities require no residency and everything is done through distance learning.

NCU is 100% virtual (has no real campus). Torou is 100% virtual BUT it’s part of Torou college which has a real campus.

My question are:
1) Does it matter if one school is 100% virtual and the other is semi 100% virtual assuming both offer similar PhD program?
2) What if the unthinkable happens and the school loses its accreditation. Can they reapply or are they doomed?

Your thoughts.

 

Spellcheck for searchability's sake: Touro

 

The SCUPS connection...

Yes, they can reapply. From what I understand, the owner of NCU also owns a degree mill called SCUPS and he has re-applied to have SCUPS obtain regional accreditation, but it failed... again.

However, that is a good question.

 

The school would probably be put on probation for a few years before it lost accreditation which might provide enoughtime to complete a degree program.
I think a bigger "unthinkable" is the school going out of business for financial problems. This happeded to the otherwise excellant West Coast University several years ago.

 

Re: The SCUPS connection...

Why do you call SCUPS a degree mill? When they offered a PhD in Psychology, it was accepted by California to sit for state license.

 

From the SCUPS JD Program

The objectives of the Juris Doctor program are:
1) to encourage learners to experience self-improvement and professional growth;
2) to prepare learners for a future in law with a strong academic program; and
3) to prepare learners who plan to take the California Bar Examination with the knowledge and skills necessary to pass the examination and practice law in California.

Does not sound like a degree mill to me.

 

I have to agree with Randell an admit that an unaccredited school is not necessarily a degree mill.

However, on the flip side obtaining an unaccredited degree is similar to throwing ones pearls before swine.

 

Re: The SCUPS connection...

What made you decide that SCUPS is a degree mill?

Is that accurate?

There has been some speculation about SCUPS planning to apply to DETC, mainly because of their phasing out their doctoral programs. But I don't recall anything about applications to WASC. WASC (like SACS) has historically been rather reluctant to accredit 100% DL schools.

 

Loss of accreditation is extremely rare, but it does happen.

The new 2004 Higher Education Directory, just out, has a section listing the schools that were in the previous edition, but not in this one. Of the 34, ten merged into other schools, some closed, some stopped granting degrees, and four lost their accreditation: two historically black schools (for financial reasons), and two very specialized schools (Florida Institute of Traditional Chinese Medicine and the Culinary Arts Institute of Louisiana).

At the other end of the scale, there were 85 institutions that gained accreditation or candidacy in the last year -- an astounding 40 of these being campuses of DeVry University. Only four of the remaining 45 use the word "university" -- two campuses of Argosy (North Central candidacy), plus Soka University (Assoc. for Liberal Education), and Virginia University of Lynchburg (TRACS).

One thingsd I don't understand. All the DeVry separate accreditations, nationwide, were from North Central. So why weren't there any University of Phoenix new accreditations, since they have many more locations? Something to do with corporate structure, perhaps?

 

Loss of accreditation is extremely rare, but it does happen.

The new 2004 Higher Education Directory, just out, has a section listing the schools that were in the previous edition, but not in this one. Of the 34, ten merged into other schools, some closed, some stopped granting degrees, and four lost their accreditation: two historically black schools (for financial reasons), and two very specialized schools (Florida Institute of Traditional Chinese Medicine and the Culinary Arts Institute of Louisiana).

At the other end of the scale, there were 85 institutions that gained accreditation or candidacy in the last year -- an astounding 40 of these being campuses of DeVry University. Only four of the remaining 45 use the word "university" -- two campuses of Argosy (North Central candidacy), plus Soka University (Assoc. for Liberal Education), and Virginia University of Lynchburg (TRACS).

One thing I don't understand. All the DeVry separate accreditations, nationwide, were from North Central. So why weren't there any University of Phoenix new accreditations, since they have many more locations? Something to do with corporate structure, perhaps?

 

I'm certainly not an expert, just some guy who posts to a discussion board.

But in this case, I'd say that the Touro and NCU DL doctoral programs aren't very different in the academic prestige department. (Low in both cases.) That's partly because they are new and haven't accomplished much as yet.

Touro may have a potential edge though, in that it is expanding aggressively and has started a college of osteopathic medicine at a former navy base in Vallejo CA as well as maintaining its original New York operation that includes an ABA law school and a pretty decent Jewish studies program (that in turn includes a Jerusalem facility).

So I'd speculate that Touro may have more "upward mobility" as far as future name recognition goes as it grows its various programs and sites. It will become more common for people to have heard the Touro name.

John and Ian have answered that one better than I could.

 

John - I've recently dealt with NCA on an accreditation issue, and here is what I understand. When NCA grants accreditation it does so with a precisely worded document that sets out limits. In some cases these limits deal with degrees (e.g. associates, masters, etc.) in other cases they deal with satellite campus locations. This is one of NCA tools to regulate schools.

My understanding is that some time ago UoP asked for permission to open branch campuses without NCA visits. Apparently, given the highly structured way UoP operates, NCA agreed.

DeVry apparently doesn't have this flexibility and/or their organizational structure isn't compatible with the idea.

Regards - Andy

 

Re: Re: What if the unthinkable happens?

 

Re: Re: Re: What if the unthinkable happens?

 

Degree "gatekeepers" and decision makers are probably smart enough to understand that a degree, for instance, from Morris Brown College, 2001" (when it was regionally accredited), is a valid degree, even if they lost their accreditation a few years later.

 

Ian, doesn't regional accreditation imply as well a healthy feasible financial plan approved by the accrediting agency? Of course, that doesn't cover the President or the accountant stealing the tuition fees, but isn't accreditation a guarantee of financial viability?