University of London "Diploma"

So how would one show this on a resume?

 

I would just list it as what it is, a University of London degree.

 

Diploma for Graduates in Economics, University of London (Lead School: London School of Economics and Political Science)

or minor variations thereof has been discussed here before.

 

I would like to know how do you come up with this information. Is that what LSE told you?

From what I know so far, this is not the case at Imperial. The businesss school keeps a record of alumni. Perharps there are different rules among colleges.

Also, another point that deserves clarification, although the admission of the DL programmes maybe not that competitive as the on-campus programmes, they share the same assessment standard. That is, no matter how you get into the programme, you have to fulfill the same requirement in order to earn that degree.

 

It should be noted that, in the LSE website, there's a link called External Study.

http://www.lse.ac.uk/collections/LSEExternalStudy/

This is an excerpt of the info in their website:

'LSE and the University of London share responsibility for the qualifications offered. The External Programme staff deal with all student administration, including enquiries, application, registration and despatch of study materials. All degrees offered through the External Programme are awarded by the University of London. To learn more about the University of London External Programme, and other qualifications offered, visit www.londonexternal.ac.uk.

LSE is responsible for all academic aspects of the qualifications offered. What that means is that LSE academics and administrative staff develop syllabuses, write subject guides, advise teaching institutions, grant permission to teach the Diploma and prepare and mark examinations.'



Consequently, I don't see anything wrong with pointing out that LSE was the Lead College.

Also, all potential candidates for such degees would probably find it interesting to learn that all LSE led External BSc. degrees have a Graduate Entry Route, in which it's possible for students already holding a bachelors'degree to earn a second one in less time (ie taking less modules) than the Standard Route.

I don't include a specific link because the information is included in every degree information, so interested students should go to the degree of their interest and see the Graduate Entry Route.

Someone mentioned SOAS as the one responsible for the Diploma in Economics. There are, actually, 2 diplomas in Economics offered through the External Programme:

1. The Diploma in Economic Principles, a graduate programme designed to prepare students for further graduate degree, and included in the postgraduate programmes section in the External Programme website.

http://www.londonexternal.ac.uk/prospective_students/postgraduate/soas/econ_princ/index.shtml

2.The Diploma in Economics, whose Lead College is LSE. The programme consists in 4 undergraduate subjects taken from the BSc. Programme.

http://www.londonexternal.ac.uk/prospective_students/undergraduate/lse/dip_grad/economics/structure.shtml

Good luck,


Joi

 

Perhaps, and I suspect that Imperial may be a special case. A few years ago they had their own Msc in materials engineering program. What I can tell you is that the LSE keeps its own records, keeps track of its past students or alumni and if you want to request a trancript of your work you must contact the LSE directly. I know it for my wife. However, if you´re a external student, you must contact the University of London administration, which is , again, the organ that confers the external degree (with the exception PERHAPS of that MBA from Imperial). Moreover, external students have a different graduation ceremony than those who graduate from the LSE in which the director addresses the LSE graduates and their friends and relatives.

They truly make emphasis on that, and yet they also make sure the magic words "external student" appear in your diploma and records.

 

Neither do I. In fact I agree with what JamesK said.

Regards and good luck to both with your degres.

 

Apparently not that special. Heythrop does the same with its theology students. I suspect most other lead colleges do as well. It's not like UofL is OEMing the LSE (and other) courses on CD-ROM like PCDI OEMs its career diplomas programs to anyone with a checkbook. The lead college is actually involved. Strange notion, I realize.

I concede that that method would be most technically accurate, and would eliminate all questions in much the same way that adding "via the" might have in my earlier examples; but I would not argue that doing so necessarily has more integrity. I'd list it the way I listed it above in a heartbeat... and would sleep like a baby at night with not a single worry about my integrity for having done so. Nor, if they saw it, would anyone at UofL or LSE have any such concerns, either, I dare say.

 

I think Imperial is a special case because they have set their own (way tougher) admission requirements, and because they run entirely the program.

In any case, I think they are all excellent degrees, recognized everywhere in the world, greatly priced, and as Tmak said it may be easy to enter (in some undergrad programs), but quite difficult to exit with a diploma in your pocket.

Regards

 

Funny thing about all of this...I met with the Chief of Police last night for about 2 hours and during our conversation brought up my intentions of attending the UofL external program, he was impressed when I said UofL and when I said the courses were developed by the LSE he said "who?" and when I explained it to him he murmured something about UofL being a good school. LSE had no impact on him whatsoever.

My point? Most people on the street including the HR person sorting your resume from everyone else's probably have no idea what the LSE even is....heck I didn't before a week ago...but they have all heard of UofL...and I'm more than happy with that.

Those who have heard of the LSE will likely be impressed by that, however I'm not one to be pretentious.

 

Ummmm... no... I think that's not quite right. Er... more accurately, I think that's quite likely a misassessment... though I could be wrong (as my ex-wife will tell you I nearly always am). I think that LSE is quite well-known around the globe... as is UofL, of course. I think that, like anything else, any given person may have heard of one or the other or both; but that that, whichever it is, should not be projected onto the whole of "most people on the street."

Fear not that the LSE connection will not matter, or will not impress. It most certainly will... as will UofL itself.

And JLV's last point is well taken: Once you've completed the UofL program -- if you can -- I dare say you'll have even more respect for either UofL or LSE or both. It will be no picnic, I assure you. As you're struggling through it, just keep reminding yourself of the attractive pricing, and how good it's gonna' look on that resume... no matter how you list it there.

 

Man...I hope it's no picnic. I love a challenge. As for most people on the street? Most people on the street can't tell you who the Vice President of the United States is or even whether or not Ben Franklin was ever a President. When asked "who was the second president of the United States?" almost a 1/3rd of them said "Lincoln"......

Of course that was one of those "reality" something or another shows but I was rolling in laughter. It just confirms what most cops (Bruce included) can probably tell you....most people don't have a clue.

(you'll note my faith in my fellow man)


As for the LSE and UofL....I'll take your word on that one.

 

friendforfoe:

There are institutions offering DL and online tuition for the BSc. Management degree.

You could just pay for the 4 units you intend to take.

As for the program not being a picnic, out of my own experience I can assure you this will be a real callenge. You'll be required to read widely (something American universities apparently don't require in most cases), and you can forget about multichoice questions and the like. You'll be required to write long esays in your examinations, so it's a good idea to begin polishing your writing skills,, as well as getting used to British English.

You can feel really isolated studying on your own for such a degree.

In such a case, this is a discussion forum for External Programme BSc. students:

www.yansa.org

Please do keep us updated on your progress.

If you have further questions, don't hesitate to ask.

Good luck,

Joi

 

Thanks Joi....

I kind of figured it would be something like that. I don't know about the "Kings English" but I'll give it a shot.

As for writing, I haven't seen a multiple choice question in a while since joining Southwestern College....everything thus far has been critical thinking questions and research...which don't tell anyone...but I'm loving it.

As for reading a wide berth and American University's not doing so, what exactly do you mean? You lost me on that one.

It looks to be approximately 15 to 17 months before I am eligible to start. In the interim I am trying to get my employer to pony up additional dough to do the eCornell .... Studies in Proactive Leadership cert...(as I already qualify)....we'll see.

 

I meant to say that you will be required to read 4 or 5 books per subject, and reach your own conclusions.

I remember that, when I applied and was admitted to the University of Pennsylvania, I saw their reading lists for college courses. Most courses required you to read only one book, and they were quite foundation-level ones. And this from one of the best universities in the USA.

Due to the fact that A and O level graduates in the UK are already considered the equivalent of a sophomore in the States, all of us who completed American-style High School Diplomas may feel that UofL 1st year courses are too difficult.

Anyway, you will be a graduate by the time you begin at UofL, so you'll be better prepared to take the units.

I hope you find it clearer now.

Have you taken a look to the BSc. Management, STANdard Entry Route? It's 5 units longer than the Diploma, but it's a bachelors degree.

Good luck,


Joi

 

QUESTION WITH APPROPRIATE EXAMPLES

Can anyone confirm an academic notion of mine, namely that at both "name" schools and less well-known schools, there is a difference between how undergraduate and graduate degrees are awarded?

It seems to me that at the undergraduate level, you are awarded a degree from the biggest institution involved. If you major in business at Penn, you may legitimately say that you attended the Wharton School, but your bachelor's degree will say "University of Pennylvania" the same as the history majors, etc.

Conversely, for a master's degree or doctorate, you are primarily a student of the specific "school" or "program" or "college" that teaches you. If you have an MBA from Penn, you really have it from Wharton, which everyone knows is at Penn.

Wharton may not keep track of undergraduate business majors, but they are legitimate "graduates" of Wharton to the extent that the only way they get a bachelor's degree is through Penn. Not being on Wharton's Christmas card list has nothing to do with your legitimate ability to say that you are a bachelors' level graduate of Wharton.

Conversely, if I take a master's in economics at Penn and take almost all of my classes at Wharton, it is misleading for me to make any claims about Wharton, with whom I have no official academic relationship.

This long-winded intro makes me think that if LSE is your lead college, it is your "Wharton," and you can legitmately reference it or not the same as a Penn undergrad might. It is ONLY a bachelor's degree, but it is as LSE as a bachelor's degree can be and therefore can legitmately be referenced as such. Comments? Corrections?

 

Re: QUESTION WITH APPROPRIATE EXAMPLES

fortiterinre:

In the specific case of Wharton, they handle the applications to the BSc In Economics (the posh name their gave to their BBA). One doesn't apply to Penn, but to Wharton. I don't know who confers the degree, but my guess is that Wharton will be mentioned in some way. They also have an Evening programme, and the only differences is that this one is called BBA and that there are less elective subjects in the evening. But the institution awarding the degree would not be another one, as far as i can tell. (when I was admitted to Penn in 2000 I considered the possibility of completing a double degree with the College and Wharton, so this is why I happen to know something about them.

As for the comparison with LSE External degrees, I think the example is different from what we've been discussing in this example. As JLV noted, if you earned your BSc. externally, the degree would be awarded by UofL, mentioning that LSE was the lead college, and that the degree was earned at a distance (through the External Programme).

However, if you earned THE SAME DEGREE internally, your degree would be awarded by LSE.

Good luck,


Joi

 

Re: Re: QUESTION WITH APPROPRIATE EXAMPLES

There has been quite a number of attempts to describe the University of London system by comparing if there exist similar systems in the US. But most of them are quite different. This is no exception with the case of Wharton.

BTW, does Wharton grant any of the degrees? like MBA... or it is U Penn granting the degree mentioning that it is earned thru Wharton School?

The comparison is rather complicated here. Comparing the relationship between UoL and London Business School would look very similar to U Penn and Wharton... However, that is the kind of structure is again different with UoL -> Imperial College -> Tanaka Business School.

Also, one clarification here. Both on-campus and external degrees earned though the study LSE are granted by UoL. They are all UoL degrees. They both mention LSE as the lead college. The difference I aware of is the line mentioning there is no difference between the external and internal study thing...

I think a user here has posted a UoL degree certificate some time before.

 

Thanks Joi and Tcmak, I've certainly learned enough about Wharton to know that I chose a bad example! Maybe the (sadly diminished) social work programs at University of Illinois at Chicago are a better example. The BSW was a credentialed baccalaureate social work program through the Jane Addams College of social work, but like all bachelors degrees awarded and controlled by UIC (and later CLOSED by UIC, much to Jane Addams' chagrin). The MSW awarded by Jane Addams is still through UIC, but one barely remembers that because Jane Addams is such a famous program in its own right.

But the impression I am getting is that U of L treats the External Programme almost as a separate College or School, not officially in that the Lead Colleges (including LSE) are still used, but officially enough in that the EP and the U of L are always referenced. It reminds me a little of Harvard's MLA program--the "MLA" designation is a tip-off that this is a little different from other Harvard degrees. U of L seems to go the other direction, using the same typical academic credentials (e.g., B.Sc) and even the acclaimed lead colleges (e.g., LSE), but stamping everything as coming from EP, U of L.

My conclusion is still the same, LSE is still LSE, Harvard is still Harvard, and people who dislike DL or extension programs will probably not care that some of the finest schools in the world offer them. But the LSE external website info is a little distancing--it sounds more like "dual sponsorship" than an actual dual degree from LSE and U of L. In some ways this could be seen as a negative--doing the hard work of the most acclaimed program, yet receiving the degree from a still-acclaimed-but-not-MOST-acclaimed school.

BTW, I searched for the U of London diploma scan with no luck.